I was having the lackadaisical power trouble of the G36.

I tried the mod and it was better, but the numbers only got better when leaning from the get go, to avoid the engine from dying, as it’s a known issue with the mod.

So that got me thinking, maybe reducing drag etc. helps, but the real issue is that the mixture is not well calibrated.

I tried a little experiment: 1. I Removed the mod 2. Loaded up the G36 and leaned it to about 75% on the ground as with the mod.

I was then getting similar numbers to the mod at take off and once in the air leaned from that 75% and had good climb power and faster cruise speeds.

So maybe, the power issue is just the mixture not matching the lever position? Where ~75% is closer to full rich and that’s why you have to go down to 10-12% (which is too low in real life) to get a proper lean at altitude?

I’m just speculating on my observation and I don’t have the know how to adjust it to correct it, but maybe someone with the knowledge could check it out.

Maybe the mod needed is only a number (scalar) tweak?

I have suspicions that you didn't load mod correctly. There is  significant difference in performance between default and the mod in my experience !

No I did. The oil temp is low and buses are tied as noted in the install instructions...

I haven't had the chance to get numbers, but my experience is that the standard G36 will not perform to specifications, even taking into account a different mixture position. I always lean the mixture for peak power on run-up no matter where the mixture lever ends up and don't simply move the mixture to a specific position.

Edited September 24, 20205 yr by Hyperfocal

The default Bonanza is indeed under-powered. But you are right about the mixture too. I've spent many hours trying to change the mixture section in the engines.cfg so it doesn't need to be leaned at low altitude. Unfortunately the mixture rich/leaning appears to be hard coded with very little leeway to alter it, as it was in FSX. You shouldn't have to lean until around 4000 feet and you should be able to get away with higher than that. The default Bonanza does need leaning even at sea level. It also requires ridiculously small mixture percentage at high altitudes.

This sim, and FSX and P3d need a complete re-write of mixture parameters. They have been flawed for many years now.

I was going to ask others if mixture is really off in this sim.  I'n no pilot, but the mixture seems to barely do anything in this sim.  FSX wasn't perfect, but at least it was consistent.  Even in the 172 mixture doesn't seem to change EGT at all.  You just pull back and eventually the engine sputters.  You can't get anything close to real fuel flow numbers in it.  Flying in FSEconomy where I have to "pay" for fuel, you really notice.  You can easily run out of fuel on a short flight.  I mean the numbers aren't even remotely close.  

The G36 just felt way off on power though.  On approach with full flaps the thing falls out of the sky.  Even at full power I was just falling, not flying.  I had to raise the flaps up to avoid crashing.  The mod seems to improve things a ton.  

1 minute ago, kerosene31 said:

 Even in the 172 mixture doesn't seem to change EGT at all.

You can't imagine how many airplanes don't have EGT gauge in real life. Yet there is a way to lean and fly in accordance to POH

5 minutes ago, sd_flyer said:

You can't imagine how many airplanes don't have EGT gauge in real life. Yet there is a way to lean and fly in accordance to POH

It isn't the gauge, it is that leaning doesn't seem to really do what it is supposed to.  If you fly by the manual (I have one from the REP Xplane C172) you'll burn a ton more fuel.  

If there's a way to lean these things, I'd love to hear it.  There seems to be no peak at all.  

Edited September 24, 20205 yr by kerosene31

12 hours ago, Cmcollazo71 said:

I was having the lackadaisical power trouble of the G36.

I tried the mod and it was better, but the numbers only got better when leaning from the get go, to avoid the engine from dying, as it’s a known issue with the mod.

So that got me thinking, maybe reducing drag etc. helps, but the real issue is that the mixture is not well calibrated.

I tried a little experiment: 1. I Removed the mod 2. Loaded up the G36 and leaned it to about 75% on the ground as with the mod.

I was then getting similar numbers to the mod at take off and once in the air leaned from that 75% and had good climb power and faster cruise speeds.

So maybe, the power issue is just the mixture not matching the lever position? Where ~75% is closer to full rich and that’s why you have to go down to 10-12% (which is too low in real life) to get a proper lean at altitude?

I’m just speculating on my observation and I don’t have the know how to adjust it to correct it, but maybe someone with the knowledge could check it out.

Maybe the mod needed is only a number (scalar) tweak?

I wonder if there isn't an issue with the mixture in general in the default aircraft. In a recent flight in the 172 (which, granted, I've never flown in real life), I had to lean the mixture at 1,500-2,000 feet MSL to keep it from running rough. And in cruise at 3,000 feet MSL I had to pull the mixture out well past 50% to get the thing to run rough. Probably at least 60-65% if I'm honest. And that's just not realistic at all. 

32 minutes ago, kerosene31 said:

It isn't the gauge, it is that leaning doesn't seem to really do what it is supposed to.  If you fly by the manual (I have one from the REP Xplane C172) you'll burn a ton more fuel.  

If there's a way to lean these things, I'd love to hear it.  There seems to be no peak at all.  

I happened to own 172 in real life as well as teach in one often. REP is great but even they sometimes don't get thing right. Here is a technique I used for around 20 years: lean mixture until engine sound rough or RPM drops and then enrich until it start running smooth again.

All performance charts in POH are based on properly lean engine, so if it was impossible to lean without EGT gauge would have a lot more accidents right now of pilots running out of fuel 🙂 

Here I'm cruising in G36 mod at 9000 ft at KTAS 162  which is not far from actual performance. Yes mixture is broken but at least we can reduce fuel flow to a reasonable value 

15 minutes ago, sd_flyer said:

I happened to own 172 in real life as well as teach in one often. REP is great but even they sometimes don't get thing right. Here is a technique I used for around 20 years: lean mixture until engine sound rough or RPM drops and then enrich until it start running smooth again.

All performance charts in POH are based on properly lean engine, so if it was impossible to lean without EGT gauge would have a lot more accidents right now of pilots running out of fuel 🙂 

Thanks for that, the big problem is that the RPM will drop almost right away when you stop leaning, long before the engine starts sputtering.  I understand that the EGT isn't needed, but since it is there, shouldn't it work properly?  

By understanding is you lean to GPH.

THROTTLE FULL

CRUISE POWER.....................................................2500 RPM
MIXTURE........LEAN FUEL FLOW...........<6000..........GPH 15
MIXTURE........LEAN FUEL FLOW.............8000..........GPH 13
MIXTURE........LEAN FUEL FLOW..........10,000..........GPH 12
MIXTURE........LEAN FUEL FLOW..........12,000..........GPH 11

I fly this aircraft the most with the mod, love it.

Edited September 24, 20205 yr by Nyxx

35 minutes ago, kerosene31 said:

Thanks for that, the big problem is that the RPM will drop almost right away when you stop leaning, long before the engine starts sputtering.  I understand that the EGT isn't needed, but since it is there, shouldn't it work properly?  

EGT right now somewhat broken! if you look at both fuel flow and EGT fuel flow jumps up and down. Realistically you lean fuel flow decreases. 

Mixture axis is very sensitive by default. I have desiccated axis  assigned for mixture to get fine adjustment. In real life when I lean I usually use thumb that pushed on lever and index finger that pulling for leaning. This technique assuring abrupt change and possibility chock engine. However; are there some aircraft with knobs (mixture) that you can simply unscrew it slowly without worries!

Also  engine should go rough either when mixture is too lean or too rich. For example when I fly older 182F with continental O-470, say at 4000 ft and ask student to do a slow flight. By default they push mixture rich and carb heat on just to find out that engine studently goes rough! It doesn't happened with other airplane but it does in 182F. This is because O-470 has to be properly lean before carb heat is applied! When I experienced it first after years of instructing in Arrow I reported mechanic who assured me that this is normal for O-470. So leaning mixture also  specific to particular engine model. Since Asobo chose to go "wide" in developing MSGS I don' expect high fidelity engine simulation . It's up to 3rd party developers or moder (given that Asobo gives access for those tweaks.    

1 hour ago, Nyxx said:

By understanding is you lean to GPH.

THROTTLE FULL

CRUISE POWER.....................................................2500 RPM
MIXTURE........LEAN FUEL FLOW...........<6000..........GPH 15
MIXTURE........LEAN FUEL FLOW.............8000..........GPH 13
MIXTURE........LEAN FUEL FLOW..........10,000..........GPH 12
MIXTURE........LEAN FUEL FLOW..........12,000..........GPH 11

I fly this aircraft the most with the mod, love it.

This table is great although it doesn't account for ISA deviation. Usually performance degrades when temperature is above ISA