1 hour ago, mSparks said:

This really isnt the place to spread MSFS disinformation, please do it somewhere else

https://www.theregister.com/2020/08/20/flight_simulator_bing_fawkner_tower/

Both use OSM data for their autogen, the only difference is the XP assets havn't [yet] been updated from a time when FSX was still getting regular bug fixes.

See also

Unless you bought something like SFD Global and smoked all your  frametime with reshade.

Only thing they "must" do there is fix the default lighting (without breaking anything else) - and I dont think anyone cares if that is XP11 or XP12, but it really should be this side of Christmas.

But that screen capture looks terrible? Like something I would have expected to see ten years ago? I don't understand what you mean? Edit. It reminds me of a very poor toy train set layout. Exactly what is it meant to demonstrate? 

Edited June 30, 20214 yr by jarmstro

I don't think that the autogen buildings are the problem. What really needs to be addressed is the land with no buildings. The rural areas. Flying in the US at high altitude, there is fast amount of open spaces which look very much the same. Even with SFD Global. Having said that I find XP default airports to be on the most part better than the MS default, with some exceptions. 

I started a flight yesterday in MS at Geneva. After the program crashed, I started the same in XP. I was surprised the difference in the airports. The XP was far better. Many 3rd party companies are making addons to make MS look better, but it does take a good amount of cash to bring all the airports to what XP has.

I'm not knocking MS at all. I think it has a lot to offer, but I would wait to see what XP will come up with. You've got to remember Asobo has been working on theirs for 10yrs or so.

Everyone will not be happy with whatever XP or MS does, but we can enjoy whatever we have.

 

25 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

Like something I would have expected to see ten years ago?

FSX era was 17 years ago actually, making it more complicated since wasn't on the roadmap sooner because people already struggled to get the 60fps minimum for commercial use.

Many people still do.

1 hour ago, rka said:

@akita See that pic in the post above. Of course this looks much better, and can still be improved, but in the end, no matter how much you tune it, it will look like you're flying above Cities: Skylines.

Since it lacks important steps in the rendering pipeline for complex terrain. Actual 3d can be generated on the gpu per pixel on terrain, like farmland patterns, rocks and more all artist driven evolving into real 3d of what is typically baked on a low res imagery.  MSFS do that but the decals don't quite always fit, it takes a *perfect AI* or actual terrain artists. AI vs man debate 🙂

With imagery you are also very limited with seasons; you need to color process baked elements like green grass, so the AI needs to be a bit more than perfect.  While in other approaches, the grass just goes away leaving no traces if needed, much more plausible and real IMO as real simulation.

All industry standart stuff that Xplane will hopefully introduce, mentioned them in a previous comment.

This kind of thing is a charm:

 

And a much better tech for simulating a dynamic earth.

Edited June 30, 20214 yr by akita

4 hours ago, akita said:

4 hours ago, mrueedi said:

If 1000 people record 1000 trees every day, they will surpass MSFS in 5479 years!! Claim disproved.

Yeah...this is not how Xplane's scenery work...really disproved none.

How about this?

If 1000 people create 1000 buildings every day, the whole globe will be covered in 4109 years!! Claim disproved.

 

3 hours ago, mSparks said:

This really isnt the place to spread MSFS disinformation, please do it somewhere else

Please read the following article from top to bottom, I think you owe me an apology, you need to stop spreading disinformation:

Meet the startup that helped Microsoft build the world of Flight Simulator | TechCrunch

 

The article also gives good background information, why aerial images are crucial just to get the buildings right.

1 hour ago, akita said:

With imagery you are also very limited with seasons; you need to color process baked elements like green grass, so the AI needs to be a bit more than perfect.

That is not true. If AI detects an area with green grass, it easily can generate the meadow in any other season.

Your procedure on the other hand can't even tell for sure, where there is grass and where not. And it misses the hedge running across the meadow. And the three little bushes on the other side of the hedge.

It's amazing the number of people NOT interested in X-Plane hanging around in the X-Plane forum!

Is their sim of choice too boring or what? 😆 

34 minutes ago, mrueedi said:

That is not true. If AI detects an area with green grass, it easily can generate the meadow in any other season.

Your procedure on the other hand can't even tell for sure, where there is grass and where not. And it misses the hedge running across the meadow. And the three little bushes on the other side of the hedge.

Don't make MSFS AI sound so perfect while it has no idea how to render a complete industrial area full with obstacles at the final of my local airport. It is far from that. Xplane also failed there btw, but at least had the bridge and it's street lights (crucial at this runway). Specifically seasons while MSFS  is yet to implement although it is "easily" done by AI as you claim.

41 minutes ago, mrueedi said:

How about this?

If 1000 people create 1000 buildings every day, the whole globe will be covered in 4109 years!! Claim disproved.

Yet again, you don't know how Xplane scenery works.

Oh and btw, this ai calculates building heights from shadows is nonsense..shadows depend on lighting angle, light bounces, sources..so do you claim that MSFS AI knows excatly what exact position was our solar system in while the satillite captured the imagery, at an exact location and time of the sun relative to earth, then do some NASA calculation magic to perfectly nail a building height? Some marketing BS here XD

Edited June 30, 20214 yr by akita

13 minutes ago, Murmur said:

It's amazing the number of people NOT interested in X-Plane hanging around in the X-Plane forum!

Is their sim of choice too boring or what? 😆 

Like other sub-forums, people will feel free to share their opinions here (even if its criticizing XP). Your conclusions as to why will not discourage them from doing so....

9 minutes ago, FlyBaby said:

Like other sub-forums, people will feel free to share their opinions here (even if its criticizing XP). Your conclusions as to why will not discourage them from doing so....

While not talking on behlaf of murmur, but I suspect it was sarcasm due to some people at the MSFS forum, personally had that kind of nonsense towards me not long ago, people for some reason are under the impression others need to satisfy their opinion, generally speaking it's a major worldwide plague and the biggest reason for people getting killed, a human nature though.

Edited June 30, 20214 yr by akita

1 hour ago, mrueedi said:

If 1000 people create 1000 buildings every day, the whole globe will be covered in 4109 years!! Claim disproved.

How about this one

If two people can do all of New York for a laugh

https://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?/files/file/41479-new-york-city-vfr/

20 highly trained Eastern European artists on salary can.....

Edited June 30, 20214 yr by mSparks

33 minutes ago, Murmur said:

Is their sim of choice too boring or what?

The subtopic (procedural scenery generation) is interesting. And, as it is portrayed as the gordian knot for XP, I feel it is on topic.

36 minutes ago, akita said:

Yet again, you don't know how Xplane scenery works.

You and I are not talking about how Xplane scenery works. You made a claim about community gateway engagement. And that works the way I described. Claim disproved.

 

39 minutes ago, akita said:

Oh and btw, this ai calculates building heights from shadows is nonsense..shadows depend on lighting angle, light bounces, sources..so do you claim that MSFS AI knows excatly what exact position was our solar system in while the satillite captured the imagery, at an exact location and time of the sun relative to earth, then do some NASA calculation magic to perfectly nail a building height? Some marketing BS here XD

No, I dont claim any of the things you mention. Because these things are not needed. Have you read the article? B.t.w. OSM is only availble for a tiny fraction of all the buildings worldwide (there goes your free datasource just for something simple as building heights). For the rest they extract the heights from the images. That is no bs. They of course had the scientists required for that task, but the things you mention are really not that hard to figure out:

Looking at an aerial image tile, south is always at the bottom, the season is known or tends to be summer anyway. The latitude is known, so from the mean shadow direction the daytime for that tile can be determined. And from there, the calculation of the height of a single object is more or less straight forward. Nearly nothing of the things you mention in fact are required to accomplish this task. AI shines especially if cleverly applied...

 

6 minutes ago, mrueedi said:

For the rest they extract the heights from the images. That is no bs.

Protip, this quality of scenery

Not coming to xplane ever.

And it doesn't matter how hard you shill for it, you aren't going to convince XP users - let alone Laminar, that it should.

Edited June 30, 20214 yr by mSparks

35 minutes ago, mrueedi said:

You and I are not talking about how Xplane scenery works. You made a claim about community gateway engagement. 

The gateway of Xplane... therefore placed using Xplane tech.

As for the shadows thing, still, far from, very far from perfect where I live, although recently even got really detailed in OSM. It is a total nonesense in terms of rendering in a game as it can go wrong in so many ways as evident, compared to what can be achieved when making a scenery system that can be fully opened for community engagment to gather the lost data through a gateway and Xplane art assets. And no, it does not take to place individual trees or buildings with Xplane's autogen, you can nail cities in minutes + whatever LR deliver as a base point for their next global scenery.

Edited June 30, 20214 yr by akita

7 minutes ago, mSparks said:

Protip, this quality of scenery

Not coming to xplane ever.

And it doesn't matter how hard you shill for it, you aren't going to convince XP users - let alone Laminar, that it should.

Well..the roofs colors are correct.

#1 reason for me switching it off in MSFS.