Beechcraft Debonair 35 on Simmarket

[srgalahad 3]

I can't comment on the FDE as I don't (won't) own it and thus also have to go by the various screenshots for the visual side, but... it seems pretty good for the "sorta looks like/close enough" school of design.

1. the curve of the upper sides/cockpit start too low and taper too tightly,

2. the window frames are too thin. esp. the rearmost one and the front seat side windows are just not quite right.

3. the rear window is the wrong shape and size.

4. the shape of the cowling nose bowl is too flat - almost looks borrowed from an Archer.

5. those tip tanks! as far as I can find, there is no STC'ed tanks with a circular cross-section - they are all thinner horizontally (a tall ovoid), not at all like the F9F tanks modelled.

The differences are small, but for someone who's been around Debonairs since 1960 they're irritating.

For comparison:

Good pics  of the tanks are hard to find but this one covers the angles: https://sky4buy.com/1960-Beechcraft-Debonair-Nice-Tip-Tanks-Full-IFR-Fresh-Annual-ADSB-47-995-00324124651587/018800

 

[Glenn Fitzpatrick 3,798]

47 minutes ago, srgalahad said:

I can't comment on the FDE as I don't (won't) own it and thus also have to go by the various screenshots for the visual side, but... it seems pretty good for the "sorta looks like/close enough" school of design.

1. the curve of the upper sides/cockpit start too low and taper too tightly,

2. the window frames are too thin. esp. the rearmost one and the front seat side windows are just not quite right.

3. the rear window is the wrong shape and size.

4. the shape of the cowling nose bowl is too flat - almost looks borrowed from an Archer.

5. those tip tanks! as far as I can find, there is no STC'ed tanks with a circular cross-section - they are all thinner horizontally (a tall ovoid), not at all like the F9F tanks modelled.

The differences are small, but for someone who's been around Debonairs since 1960 they're irritating.

For comparison:

Good pics  of the tanks are hard to find but this one covers the angles: https://sky4buy.com/1960-Beechcraft-Debonair-Nice-Tip-Tanks-Full-IFR-Fresh-Annual-ADSB-47-995-00324124651587/018800

 

 

There seems to be some variation in that rear window shape (see photo below) but the majority of Debonair photos online seem to be the same shape as in your photo above -  and I have not yet come across a rear window shaped like the window in the addon. Might exist but must be very rare if it does.

Edited September 22, 2021 by Glenn Fitzpatrick

[Stoopy 1,571]

2 hours ago, Chock said:

What's wrong with that? That's what it is like on the real thing. It's smaller on a 36, but that's because the fuselage is longer.

Fair enough - on closer look you are correct that on the 35 the tail has that aspect ratio.  However, just doing some side-by-side comparison shots (the real plane below is a 35-33 also) she just looks a bit... well.... CHONKY.   To the point that I'm just not feelin' it.   Even though I do appreciate the benefits of a robust lady, this one is a Whole Lotta Rosie. 😄 

Really looks like she's got the ol' Beechomoter pegged right off the scale, and she could blow at any minute!

Edited September 22, 2021 by Stoopy

[Chock 17,769]

There absolutely are some things which are 'off' with the model for sure. That was readily apparent even on first glance when I saw it, but on the plus side it does have a good interior, is well featured and flies well and these things are certainly of merit. It has now been patched to be more like the correct size in the sim and the prop animation is much improved too and no longer looks like the spinner is about to detach and take someone's eye out lol, so evidently the developer is willing to accept criticism and do things about it, which is a good thing. But there are still some things I'd like to see fixed on it for it to become something I'd strongly recommend to those who like looking at an exterior model as much as they like a decent cockpit and systems.

Apparent even without comparison to the real thing is the top line of the engine cowling, which is far too sloped on this sim version and this has the effect of making the thing look a bit snub nosed, but comparison with the real thing reveals that there is a bit more to what is giving it this appearance: The leading edge of the wing is a bit too thick and this has the effect of masking the front end cowling on the lower part, which adds to the snub-nosed look of things. Also contributing to the snub-nosed look, is the fact that the front end of the cowling is a bit mis-shapen too; this means the spinner has had to be made a bit too small in order to fit things and when you combine all these minor points together, the model does not have the more purposeful 'pointy' look of the real thing.

Less obvious, particularly when off the deck or in the long grass common in MSFS airfields, the main wheels are too large, and whilst I know you could theoretically fit slightly larger wheels to an aeroplane, there is only so far you can go with this before they would not fit in the wheel wells upon retraction. The window shapes are slightly off and whilst most of them are fairly close, the rear-most window is not at all close to the correct shape, especially in the leading edge lower corner and to be honest I'd rather see it deleted altogether (as was the case on earlier Debonairs) than be that far off the mark. 

If these things were tweaked, and it wouldn't be a massive amount of work to do this, since we are for the most part talking about grabbing a few control points on polygons and shifting them a bit, it would be a no-brainer recommendation given all of the good points this add-on has, such as the working systems and the nice cockpit.

See the two pics I joined up in Photoshop to highlight these points, although bear in mind that it is virtually impossible to get the exact same viewpoint of a photograph on a sim screenshot because a camera lens will invariably distort/compact things a little bit, and whilst you can correct this in photoshop if you have the lens metadata, it doesn't always work perfectly. I reckon a decent couple of hours shifting a few polygon vector points around in the 3D modelling program, whilst referencing a few pics, would have this thing sorted out and looking much better. I hope the developer considers doing this, because if they do it will be well worth having, since it's already most of the way there in terms of systems and flight model.

Edited September 23, 2021 by Chock

[Beagle12 139]

From the pilot's interior view, the propeller is not centered. It is too far to the left.

[CaptainNick 575]

Installed the update. Now the plane looks closer to actual size but still feels "off" in scale. Almost like the pilot was scaled down too.

Spinner animation is better, not perfect but liveable.

No beacon bleed on the roof, It did look like some was coming from underneath the boxes in the rear though.

Exterior is still off from a debonair. As Chock pointed out the nose fairing is weird with that downward slope on center then the odd deep slopes on the sides. Tippy tanks are wonky and the whole empennage needs a rework.

Still perfectly flyable, and not terribly priced IMO. Ive blown more on worse add ons for sure.

Edited September 23, 2021 by CaptainNick

[Matchstick 1,886]

What are people using for cruise settings for this - the fuel flow/power settings in the manual seems to give very low speeds ?

[Matchstick 1,886]

Just started a test flight in Beechcraft Debonair inflight to test RNAV approach and the sim has spawned me at 1823241ft. Whoops.

 

Plane hit ~ 650KIAS at 100000 before exploding to an overstress so well over mach 1 🙂

- Edit - sadly after completing the RNAV tests this is another aircraft where glide slope information isn't being show on the CDI during RNAV approaches even though the AP flies them fine. I wonder what secret sauce Just Flight used to get this working in their Warrior and Arrows as those seem to be the only aircraft I've come across where it works.

Edited September 23, 2021 by Matchstick

[Glenn Fitzpatrick 3,798]

 

 

[airlinejets 709]

1 hour ago, Matchstick said:

Plane hit ~ 650KIAS at 100000 before exploding to an overstress so well over mach 1 🙂

From a Beachcraft to a Spacecraft. 😄

Edited September 23, 2021 by airlinejets

[Sigwolf 222]

1 hour ago, airlinejets said:

From a Beachcraft to a Spacecraft. 😄

Well, Beechcraft did make the Starship...

[Dillon 2,197]

Uninstall for me until this thing is patched.  Not a problem for most but that prop texture is at the top of the list of things that kill it from my vantage point.  You have to constantly look at that train wreak when flying even if you want to dismiss many of the other glaring issues.

[Todd2 2,104]

Just updated to version 1.02.  This is turning out quite nice.  The pilot is grown up now lol.

[Dillon 2,197]

6 hours ago, Todd2 said:

Just updated to version 1.02.  This is turning out quite nice.  The pilot is grown up now lol.

Can you give some details as to what's fixed outside of it's 'nice'? 🧐

Nevermind, for those interested here you go:

Changes:
Fixed - Weak Taxi/Landing Lights
Fixed - Propeller transparency
Fixed - Propeller size
Fixed - Windshield roughness (specularity)
Fixed - Tachometer ticks quantity
Fixed - Airspeed indicator (changed to MPH with inner ring for knots)
Fixed - Wheel size too big
Fixed - Rear window too big
Fixed - Tip tanks geometry
Fixed - Nav/Beacon/Strobe lights emissive objects
Fixed - Pilot Too Small
Fixed - Wrong informations on documentation
Fixed - Airplane model name (changed to Debonair 35-B33)
Fixed - Gap on left window vent
Fixed - CB XPNDR not working
Fixed - CB COMM not working
Fixed - Engine power scalar
Fixed - Propeller thrust scalar
Fixed - Propeller beta range

Verdict:

The plane is much improved and sized right when sitting next to other aircraft.  All reported items seem to have been addressed.  The prop texture still needs a little work and the plane is still fully loaded at startup. Fly's very nice with just the pilot and co-pilot and a little bit of cargo.  Great job and a fast turnaround from the developer. 😎

Edited September 25, 2021 by Dillon

[Glenn Fitzpatrick 3,798]

I would be interested in seeing some screenshots of the latest version.