February 22, 20224 yr Author 22 minutes ago, Luke said: If the vote is between "billionaires spending their money to go to Mars or my taxes going up by a penny to fix the Earth", it wouldn't even be close. One billionaire whose net worth is 233 billion dollars wants to put a colony on Mars. His 233 billion doesn't even come close to even starting a colony. As far as I can see the colony isn't even going to give a return on his money unless they can find things on Mars to bring back to earth and sell. So when his money runs out who's left to pay the tab? Noel The tires are worn. The shocks are shot. The steering is wobbly. But the engine still runs fine.
February 22, 20224 yr 2 hours ago, birdguy said: Why not fix Earth before colonizing Mars? Why put all your eggs in one basket. Getting off earth is necessary to the survival of the species.
February 22, 20224 yr Author 55 minutes ago, goates said: Why must it be either or? It doesn't have to be either or. It can be both if the 1% of the wealthy of the world wasn't hoarding 45% of the wealth of the world. (11% of the world's population holds 39% of the world's wealth. 33% if the world' population holds 14% of the world's wealth. And the remaining 55% of the world's population holds just 1.3% of the world's wealth) Wealth distribution is the reason why we can't do both at the same time. Now I repeat...I am not against space exploration. I support sending scientists to Mars and even the moons of other planets in the solar system. I am against starting a colony on Mars. But the cost of that is going to be far, far greater than the 233 billion dollars Elon has...if he wishes to spend his entire fortune. And if the colony starts who picks up the tab after Elon? Noel Edited February 22, 20224 yr by birdguy The tires are worn. The shocks are shot. The steering is wobbly. But the engine still runs fine.
February 22, 20224 yr If we started a new topic titled "Any New Thoughts of a Mars Colony" would anyone respond? I'm seeing responses, including my own, which look as if they have been copied and pasted from previous versions of the topic. Dugald Walker
February 22, 20224 yr 4 hours ago, dmwalker said: I thought so. I keep seeing images of domes 3D printed from the Martian equivalent of concrete and giving protection against solar radiation. Are you assuming that, in the far distant future, Mars's magnetic field will be restored so that this protection will no longer be required? No, no, those are just the initial structures early on in our Mars endeavours. Possibly will be 3D printed. We were discussing the future, what an advanced Mars Dome would be like with the technology of the future. In which case think geodesic transparent domes. Mars radiation is a very good point. We already have LPX glass that's resistant to quite intense radiation, so I would be very surprised if in a few hundred years the glass of the day isn't extremely good and protecting the inhabitants from radiation. In fact with the pace of technological development I'd say its a certainty.
February 22, 20224 yr Author 13 minutes ago, Penzoil3 said: Why put all your eggs in one basket. Getting off earth is necessary to the survival of the species. Why? Why don't we take our chances with the rest of the species on earth? We are a mere pin word not allowed in the universe. We all have lives that terminate at some point. Planets all have lives that terminate at some point. Suns all blow up or become dim at certain times. Why is our species so important it must live beyond its allotted time? We haven't had a good track record of taking care of ourselves since our species began walking upright and began killing his neighbors to get their wealth and territory. Why transfer that to a Mars colony? What makes you think the very special people selected to survive on Mars are going hold hands every evening and sing Kumbaya? Noel The tires are worn. The shocks are shot. The steering is wobbly. But the engine still runs fine.
February 22, 20224 yr Author 7 minutes ago, martin-w said: In fact with the pace of technological development I'd say its a certainty. Martin, you are the eternal optimist. In a hundred years all the problems of the world will be solved on Mars. Technology is going to fix this and technology is going to fix that. You should write a novel about that. They might even make it into a movie. Noel The tires are worn. The shocks are shot. The steering is wobbly. But the engine still runs fine.
February 22, 20224 yr 3 hours ago, birdguy said: Martin, you guys are talking about all this wonderful technology we are going to have in the future to make Mars habitable under a dome. We already have a habitable planet with a dome called the atmosphere. Why can't all this wonderful technology100 years or 500 years from now be dedicated to cleaning up our 'dome'. We don't have to extract water out of the thin air of Mars. We already have oceans and lakes and rivers full of it. I've already answered that Noel. No amount of cleaning up the planet will protect us from all threats. It wont stop war ravaging the planet and destroying all life with Nukes or something even more horrible. Pollution and asteroids aren't the only threats we face. There are many "great filters". Quote Instead of spending quadrillions to put perhaps a few thousand people under a huge dome why not spend it repairing what we already have and saving billions of people? We aren't spending quadrillions. And we can do both. Currently NASA's the space budget is just a 1/3 of one percent. Its private companies providing employment for thousands of people that will be building Mars domes, not your taxes. Quote You know Mars has as much chance as being hit by a large catastrophic asteroid as Earth has. We've discussed this so many time Noel. What you say is not relevant. It doesn't matter if Mars is hit. The point is being multiplanetary If you have 1000 eggs and you put all of them in one vulnerable location you risk losing them all. If you divide your eggs up and put then in several locations its highly unlikely you will lose them all. Quote Elon is another cult leader and the Mars dome just another Jonestown or Waco. Noel, seriously, I think you've lost the plot. 😀
February 22, 20224 yr 9 minutes ago, martin-w said: think geodesic transparent domes. Just like Ganymede in The Expanse. The problem with old folks like me is that our imagination of the distant future is still rooted in present day technology and can reach only 20 or 30 years ahead. Dugald Walker
February 22, 20224 yr On a lighter note, how about that Mars One Project which went bankrupt? Was it a sincere but naive plan or just a scam? What happens to the 100 finalists and how is the Mars One Foundation doing? Dugald Walker
February 22, 20224 yr 31 minutes ago, birdguy said: But the cost of that is going to be far, far greater than the 233 billion dollars Elon has Elon isn't building a Mars Dome Noel. 😂 SpaceX are providing the transportation. Its other private companies that will be building Mars domes and colonizing. Dont worry nobody is stealing your dosh. Purely from a practical standpoint its vital. The world is rapidly running out of resources. If we don't mind off world we are screwed. We WILL be mining the asteroids. The Moon too, probably for Helium 3. We WILL be out there and we will have Moon and Mars bases. The other point is that China are planning a Moon base and a Mars base. Some might say that would be a dodgy situation if we aren't equally capable. Quote Martin, you are the eternal optimist. In a hundred years all the problems of the world will be solved on Mars. Technology is going to fix this and technology is going to fix that. I didn't say anything of the sort. Or imply it. The fact our problems CAN'T be all solved on Earth is WHY we need to ne multiplanetary. 🙄 Edited February 22, 20224 yr by martin-w
February 22, 20224 yr 2 minutes ago, martin-w said: The other point is that China are planning a Moon base and a Mars base. Some might say that would be a dodgy situation if we aren't equally capable. A good, old fashioned space race just like the one which got us to the moon. Dugald Walker
February 22, 20224 yr 41 minutes ago, Penzoil3 said: Why put all your eggs in one basket. Getting off earth is necessary to the survival of the species. Please accept a GOLD cat point. Only my second ever allocated. ONE GOLD CAT POINT 😸
February 22, 20224 yr Author 2 minutes ago, martin-w said: The other point is that China are planning a Moon base and a Mars base. Some might say that would be a dodgy situation if we aren't equally capable. So that's it. We are in an arms race with China right now. We are going to extend that arms race to the Moon and to Mars. I'm glad I won't be around to see it. Noel The tires are worn. The shocks are shot. The steering is wobbly. But the engine still runs fine.
February 22, 20224 yr 13 minutes ago, dmwalker said: Just like Ganymede in The Expanse. The problem with old folks like me is that our imagination of the distant future is still rooted in present day technology and can reach only 20 or 30 years ahead. I'm 64 though. Are you saying that's young. I may give you a cat point if you say yes. And an extra point for mentioning my favourite science fiction show.
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