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dokelly07

Blurries & contention

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Phil's blog stated today "many enthusiast sites, like avsim.com, flightsimworld.com, etc - have threads about the blurries. something on their systems is causing contention so that the terrain texture generation is always behind."That seems like a good explanation. When I get blurries things are so far behind that if I look behind the aircraft I can see the clear textures far away... After a while they just disappear completly as the system is not keeping up.So what is causing the contention? I and all others concerned by the SP1 blurries would like to know so that we can fix it. Any ideas?Edit: BTW the mipbias tweak has nothing to do with this issue. The textures are not getting loaded, period. This is not a filtering or AA issue.

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that's the best I've come up with so far with FSX SP1. But this is hard on frame rates. Expect something in the teens then.In the [ Main ] section:FIBER_FRAME_TIME_FRACTION=1.20ProcSpeed=2000PerfBucket=50And it only works if you lock your frame rates (to anything.. it does not matter as the resulting rate will always be slower ;-)Let's pray that Microsoft will come up with a hotfix for this hot issue soon. If that FSX was open source, we could fix it in no time ... Hah.

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>Phil's blog stated today "many enthusiast sites, like>avsim.com, flightsimworld.com, etc - have threads about the>blurries. something on their systems is causing contention so>that the terrain texture generation is always behind.">>That seems like a good explanation. When I get blurries things>are so far behind that if I look behind the aircraft I can see>the clear textures far away... After a while they just>disappear completly as the system is not keeping up.>>So what is causing the contention? I and all others concerned>by the SP1 blurries would like to know so that we can fix it.>Any ideas?>>Edit: BTW the mipbias tweak has nothing to do with this issue.>The textures are not getting loaded, period. This is not a>filtering or AA issue.This is exactly the problem I am having.Today on a flight from helsinki to Warsaw in the default CRJ700I was getting acceptable FPS on the ground on either end (11-44)In the air I was getting 20-40 FPS.I had fine textures and autogen at takeoff. Enroute I was at34K so no autogen visable. On approach to EPWA I had no autogenwhatsoever although the base ground textures were almost "believable"until I was about 5 miles out. From that point on to touchdownthe ground textures were pretty blurry. After I landed and sat onthe ramp for a couple of minutes, the autogen started to "catch up".My memory useage, both system and video, never exceed about 50%.( 2GB system and 512MB video card ). My old AMD barton 3200+ cpuis working full time, but that was the case with pre-SP1 FSX as well.This texture/autogen problem is VERY annoying and I've tried myriad tweaks and setting changes, all to no avail. Paul

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This is actually good news for me - as I thought it was just my single core machine that was the culprit and that I would just have to get use to it. It is some small solace to know I am not alone, and there might be a solution for this in the future.Misery loves company.

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The issue is that although ACES are evidently aware that this issue is affecting a certain number of people and that there is no tweak that solves the problem, nothing has been communicated about a fix. There's no doubt it's a regression from RTM because a simple revert to RTM solves the problem.I'm scared that future addons will require SP1 and we will then have a choice between the addon + blurries or no addon and crisp textures in RTM. Not a nice choice to have....JCMK

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There's definitely an issue with blurries in SP1. There's a thread on Horizon's (VFR GenerationX) site where people get much more blurries, and the loading time has increased from 2 minutes to 6 minutes for the scenery, so it's even worse for those types of scenery.I get more than acceptable FPS, so why can't it load textures in a timely manner?

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>>I get more than acceptable FPS, so why can't it load textures>in a timely manner?That's is where I have a problem with all of this. The Sim runs great on my almost three year old machine, so I don't understand why it won't load the textures faster. If it was older machines like mine having problems that's one thing, but I see problems with high end machines here also.The other thing that pains me is they beta SP1 for a couple months, it comes out and the blurry situtation arises and Microsoft seems taken back by it, like it's a total shock.I can somewhat live with the blurry situation now, especially with ASX. But, it is frustrating to say the least.

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>I'm scared that future addons will require SP1 and we will>then have a choice between the addon + blurries or no addon>and crisp textures in RTM. Not a nice choice to have....Forget about the choice: ActiveSkyX for instance, one of the first and biggest addons that's released after SP1 REQUIRES SP1. SimConnect has been changed (somehow) so I think almost all addons will need SP1...

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good question.if we knew that, we would have a great start on understanding and categorizing the issue. right now, its still in the "mystery" class.

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>that's the best I've come up with so far with FSX SP1. But>this is hard on frame rates. Expect something in the teens>then.>>In the [ Main ] section:>>FIBER_FRAME_TIME_FRACTION=1.20>ProcSpeed=2000>PerfBucket=50>>And it only works if you lock your frame rates (to anything..>it does not matter as the resulting rate will always be slower>;-)>>Let's pray that Microsoft will come up with a hotfix for this>hot issue soon. If that FSX was open source, we could fix it>in no time ... Hah.>I played with these settings and found that FIBER_FRAME_TIME_FRACTION=1.20did indeed allow the autogen to keep up with my aircraft, howeverat the cost of miserable FPS ( 2 - 3 ).I started backing that 1.20 value down and at about .55 my FPS got into the almost acceptable range for my conditions.I finally settled on .45.I changed PerfBucket=50 to a value of 6 and saw no appreciablechange so I put it back to 50 and moved on.Since I intend to build a new system in the fall I'll justaccept the 6-8 FPS on the runway and move on. In the air Iwas running 30-40 FPS before making the above changes. Sincethen I have loaked FPS at 20 and see 17-20 FPS in the air.I also have most settings on high to maximum since my experimentationshowed now appreciable effect on frame rate. My gripe was with autogen ceasing to generate once I left the immediate area ofmy initial takeoff point ( withing 6-10 miles ) and never catchingup while enroute so that on my approach at my destination thelandscape was pretty ugly and unrealistic. At least now it's only unrealistic in that autogen is popping up about 2-6 milesin front of my plane on descent. Paul

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>Believe it or not, but we had zero reports of these blurries>during the beta. Zero.Did the beta testers have a test plan to go by or was the beta simply conducted based on feedback from the testers as theyuncovered problems or discrepancies?It's rather curious that no one reported this "autogen not autogenning"problem since it is really a showstopper IMO, and seems to be happeningon a variety of systems. But then I am amazed at the myriad otherglitches that seemed to have slipped through the cracks previouslyin both FSX and FS9... Paul

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Seems I was dead wrong with my assumptions of PerfBucket.It's the "rating" that your machine gets, according to CPU speed, Graphics card, etc... Valid values are 1-7. So setting PerfBucket above 7 has no effect. HeheThat setting influences, among other things, the "reset to defaults" values of the graphics and sound settings.Reading Phil Taylor's blog has made this a bit clearer.

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Quick! Everyone downgrade to SP1 Beta 4! ;)Hah,Christian

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>>>Forget about the choice: ActiveSkyX for instance, one of the first and biggest addons that's released after SP1 REQUIRES SP1.Bad news for me if this is the trend with devs.I fly low and slow mostly. The blurries in FSX SP1 ruin it for me. I was hoping I could go with the boxed version, albeit , with lower frames, and still enjoy all the fine addons coming down the pipe.Major bummer.Greghttp://www.fs2crew.com/linepilot.jpg

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Phil,Not really searching out your posts on the board and only browsing through you blog I don't see the one question that I have being answered. Are you looking into the Blurry problem for a possible solution and maybe a quick patch?I agree with one of the posters above. Textures are not loading right, it's not a Mipbias or AA problem. And like I said if it was just happening to me on a very mid-range system that would be one thing. But, there are folks here that have some serious machines having problems.All that being said, I've pretty much came to a point where all if just about good for me. Texture that is right under the aircraft to say a 1/2 mile to a mile look good. Beyond that it's ugly as can be. I stay pegged at 24fps (Locked @ 24) flying with a very few stutters every once in awhile. Autogen is on sparse, which is ok for me, the more I move that slider to the right the worse it gets.I really want to build a new machine, but I can't see doing it right now.

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>good question.>>if we knew that, we would have a great start on understanding>and categorizing the issue. >>right now, its still in the "mystery" class.So this might not be the smartest question to ask from a technical standpoint - but would posting our machine specs help any? Maybe there's some correlation???ASUS P4C800-EIntel 3.2 GHz HT (stock)4GB Kingston DDR-SDRAM PC3200 (200 MHz)-[DDR-400] GeForce 7800 GS AGP (stock)XP pro SP2What else?*edit* Ok, after looking at the specs that were already posted in the thread, I'm not seeing any correlation - so it looks like I answered my own question, Sorry for wasting everyone's time.

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I would also guess that it takes come certain hardware configuration to get these blurries (certain graphics card, processor, or memory configuration). Maybe it has something to do with memory timing, or something to do with a motherboard setting.I am not sure what these "blurries" even look like. Could somebody who is having "blurries" trouble please post up a screen shot so I can see what they look like. I don't think I am having any issues with blurries, but I guess I don't know that for sure.

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>good question.>>if we knew that, we would have a great start on understanding>and categorizing the issue. >>right now, its still in the "mystery" class.Phil,I work for a small company so I understand we work under much looser rules... but we frequently send loggin builds to customers with unexplained phenomnon. Is there nobody in your beta program that had the problem? Could you send logging builds to them?I lieu of that would collecting dxdiag dumps from people reporting the problem help? Is this already done via the official support channel?

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Hi Chris,I could be wrong, but I think I have shown that changing the ProcSpeed and PerfBucket values after their initial creation (the run that creates FSX.cfg) has no effect:http://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=set...ow_topic#401636(Post #25 in response to reply #24)It may be that this apparent lack of effect is confined to the in-sim user settings. Whether the PerfBucket value is used by the sim's engine in some other arcane way is quite another matter. However, I noted no changes in performance when this parameter was changed.Mike

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No one on the beta ran into this, as I already stated.Machine config information, as already stated in this thread,shows no correlation.We are listening, though, and if a pattern emerges we will definitely take a look.

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I don't have any blurries or a I should say except far off in the distance, but then again it was like that before the patch. My computer is a Core2Duo E6600 at 2.7 Ghz and 3 gigs of ram, but windows only seems to show two except in the system, hardware, computer name tab, where it says 3.0, but anyway and I have an nVidia 7600GT and a 250 gigabyte SATA drive.Edit: Here's some shots, this is what my FS looks like, I usually fly jets so I'm only a couple thousand feet agl. (Billings, MT is where I am)Jeffhttp://forums.avsim.net/user_files/172935.jpghttp://forums.avsim.net/user_files/172936.jpg

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phil, I think there IS a pattern with nvidia, amd dual core users.there is the classic surge that some claim to be nvidiaand then there is the stutter (not fps) but scenery just doesnt flow by smooth at various points. I know this must be a burden on you answering all these forums, and like many others, I commend you for your professionalism. Is there some organized way we could set something up in order to help you and the aces?Im thinking like a poll or something? Maybe Rig setup and problems one user gets?

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I don't understand the blurries/SP1 issue at all...how it can happen to some people, and not others?RhettAMD 3700+ (@2585 mhz), eVGA 7800GT 256 (Guru3D 93.71), ASUS A8N-E, PC Power 510 SLI, 2gb Corsair XMS 3-3-3-8 (1T), WD 150 gig 10000rpm Raptor, WD 250gig 7200rpm SATA2, Seagate 120gb 5400 rpm external HD, CoolerMaster Praetorian

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Believe it or not, but we had zero reports of these blurries during the beta. Zero.

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