👍

30 minutes ago, threegreen said:

Haha. It's equally cool from a simmer's point of view since I wouldn't know 80% of what I know without flight simming and these addons. Even with the obvious limitations that come with a desktop flight sim software, you can actually teach yourself how to fly specific aircraft down to pretty insane detail - like fail passive and fail operational autoland systems.

I know it would make my day if I explained something to a real pilot about their plane that they never even heard of... but it probably wouldn't make theirs. 

Spectacular down to earth read! Many of the points discussed recently in this thread also apply to GA aircraft. Due to countless hours in the sim and familiarity with glass panels, I was instantly comfortable and at home when I had the upgrade in my plane from the old dial gauges to the G3X glass panel. Obviously not the complexity of an airliner, but I needed no introduction to the G3 as result of flying modern GA aircraft in this sim.

57 minutes ago, NismoRR said:

Exactly what I was thinking. Appreciate your input, especially from a guy named F737MAX  with ~3000 likes. 🙃

👍

Despite trying to hold out, I've followed @Ricardo41's lead. I've succumbed to temptation and bought the -600.
Yes, I know PMDG were not in my good books, but for $35 I get a high-quality add-on while waiting for the JustFlight RJ and the iFly 737MAX, whenever they turn up.
 

2 hours ago, Stearmandriver said:

Thanks Jane! 

One thing worth pointing out that I think is pretty cool (we're using that term very loosely in its most geeky sense here 😁) is that I wouldn't know anything about any of this if it weren't for flight sims and PMDG.  I kid you not, if I asked another pilot at work whether we had a fail passive or operational autoland system, I'd get a blank stare.  "You push these two buttons, we make our callots on the way down, the plane lands itself" would be the approximate response 😉.  Which is good in a sense, as you train people on what they need to know about their fleet and don't clutter their minds with trivia about options that don't apply to their planes... but it's funny to me, just how many options and various configurations are available on these planes that most pilots don't know about. 

Simming is a good way to explore all that. 

I worked these jets in real life for years, especially cockpit avionics.  What you say is absolutely true in my experience.  

1 hour ago, jrw4 said:

Check this video on autoland procedures in the 737 family.

I figured it out, Set APP mode then both AP before intercepting localizer.

2 hours ago, threegreen said:

I know it would make my day if I explained something to a real pilot about their plane that they never even heard of... but it probably wouldn't make theirs. 

Simmers have taught me things about my airplane, especially these kinds of things - different options or procedures than we have / use.  The instructor in me is tickled by this.  The pilot in me might sometimes be annoyed.  😂

Just now, Cpt_Piett said:

I figured it out, Set APP mode then both AP before intercepting localizer.

Correct, and both courses have to be set as well as both NAV radios too, naturally.  And in the real world most pilots seldom do autolands unless the airport is socked in, they're qualified, and the runway is protected (if socked in).  The only time I've ever seen pilots do autolands is on test flights and in the Level D's.  I don't know about now but back in the day an autoland wasn't counted as their own landing.  We had to test every phase of the autoland system on the ground and then sometimes go on test flights in the jump seat.  

11 minutes ago, Jack_Sawyer said:

 I don't know about now but back in the day an autoland wasn't counted as their own landing.

Yup.  We've got an ACARS post-flight summary report that is sent after shutdown, where you select who performed the takeoff and the landing. For landing there are three choices: CA, FO, or autoland.  An autoland doesn't count towards either pilot's landing currency, but the airplane needs to maintain currency too so she has to get one every now and then.  ;)

3 hours ago, Stearmandriver said:

Huh? Nothing, it was a response to your original post (as quoted), which doesn't even contain the word "brake."  Why would a response be expected to reference brakes? 

It wasn't angry, it was because a stuck brake is a stuck brake, and AFIK - there is no magical solution to a stuck brake that I need to know some secret detail only a pilot knows. This was the issue from the other thread. You are obviously very knowledgeable, but it doesn't come across if you keep repeating the same thing to a person. I heard you the first time and I had already considered what you were suggesting, but I was doing the absolute minimum in the FMC already. You kept repeating the same thing over and over in the other thread, "that it's because I don't understand the systems". You were very aware my initial issue in the other thread was the stuck brake and the FMC not responding. It was going in circles, and I'm not a patient person when someone wants to go in a circle with something repeatedly telling me the same thing over and over again (heard you the first time). It was a controller issue or a slew issue (or rather, more than likely - both), and it has nothing to do with systems issues. You were then trying to tell me how the software worked and how bugs work in software, and I have no patience to debate a pilot about coding issues. If something works 75% of the time the same way, but fails 25% of the time doing it the same way, it's obviously not related to the FMC procedure. Since most other planes do not have issues from going in and out of slew mode (especially if you just do it before take-off), I didn't suspect this as the main reason initially, given the VAST list of bugs I had in the first version before they patched it. The slew mode still works SOMETIMES, but something causes slew mode to mess up the state of things at times (resulting in stuck brake, non-working FMC, and some weird side effects to certain indicators as well as certain toggle switches stop working).

Edited November 3, 20223 yr by Alpine Scenery

2 hours ago, Alpine Scenery said:

it was because a stuck brake is a stuck brake

Hello Alpine.  I've just joined this thread today and was curious about this brake issue.  Are you still having this problem and would you be willing for me to help troubleshoot it?  If so we can do it on this thread or via PM.  Please let me know one way or the other.

Best regards, Jack.

3 hours ago, Alpine Scenery said:

It wasn't angry, it was because a stuck brake is a stuck brake, and AFIK - there is no magical solution to a stuck brake that I need to know some secret detail only a pilot knows. This was the issue from the other thread. You are obviously very knowledgeable, but it doesn't come across if you keep repeating the same thing to a person. I heard you the first time and I had already considered what you were suggesting, but I was doing the absolute minimum in the FMC already. You kept repeating the same thing over and over in the other thread, "that it's because I don't understand the systems". You were very aware my initial issue in the other thread was the stuck brake and the FMC not responding. It was going in circles, and I'm not a patient person when someone wants to go in a circle with something repeatedly telling me the same thing over and over again (heard you the first time). It was a controller issue or a slew issue (or rather, more than likely - both), and it has nothing to do with systems issues. You were then trying to tell me how the software worked and how bugs work in software, and I have no patience to debate a pilot about coding issues. If something works 75% of the time the same way, but fails 25% of the time doing it the same way, it's obviously not related to the FMC procedure. Since most other planes do not have issues from going in and out of slew mode (especially if you just do it before take-off), I didn't suspect this as the main reason initially, given the VAST list of bugs I had in the first version before they patched it. The slew mode still works SOMETIMES, but something causes slew mode to mess up the state of things at times (resulting in stuck brake, non-working FMC, and some weird side effects to certain indicators as well as certain toggle switches stop working).

I'm afraid we got our wires crossed somewhere. I don't remember discussing a brake issue with you, just the FMC in the other thread and MCP / flight guidance in this one.  But wherever the misunderstanding was, I'll apologize for my end of it. 

Regarding the stuck brake, are we talking about the parking brake or an individual wheel brake? I only ask because PMDG changed parking brake behavior a couple versions ago... you now have to depress the brakes fully, 100% before the parking brake will set or release. It didn't used to be this way and has caught some folks out as not everyone trolls their forum for changelogs... go figure haha. 

The change did align the PMDG more with how the airplane behaves, but in this case I personally think it's a bit of overkill, given the hardware differences across the sim community. 

Anyway, maybe you already knew about the change but I thought I'd throw it out there as others may not. 

All the issues are related to slew mode, and depressing the brake thing is normal on several planes, so I doubt it caught many off guard. I stopped going into slew mode before the flight, have had no major issue since, but there are still a few bugs overall, but nothing bad. Any of the brakes can get stuck, even the auto-brakes won't disarm when it happens, so just depends what you have turned on. When you enter into slew mode and move the plane, depending on the current configuration, things can get stuck. Since the issue was intermittent as well, it wasn't easy to diagnose, because entering into slew mode before a flight was an automatic thing I was doing without thinking about it. I've had only 1-2 other planes have any real issue from going in and out of slew mode (think they were freeware planes), so didn't expect it.
 

Edited November 4, 20223 yr by Alpine Scenery

Gotcha.  I agree the plane definitely does not like slew mode... just too much going on in the background.  

The PMDG forums were lit up with questions about the parking brake when it changed.  It seems some folks didn't even have the ability to apply 100% braking.  That's why I think it was probably overkill.   🤷

I have seen this issue every once in a while going back to the first NG forP3Dv4. I have seen it once or twice in MSFS but I do not recall if it was in the 700 or 800. I do not have the 600.

For me, 99% of the time it happens, it is on the runway immediately after landing. Occasionally after turning off. It happens most often after stopping hard trying to make a turn off. Once it happens, it is like the parking brake is stuck on and the plane will not move. I have always been able to break it free by firewalling the the throttle and waiting. The airplane will start to creep forward, and eventually it will just (quickly) start moving normally. If I'm lucky enough to stop it in a reasonable position, I just continue on with the flight.

So, don't stress that issue Alpine (unless you are seeing this frequently?) because it's been around forever. It only happens to me once in several hundred flights, so I can live with it. Other things mess up flights more often than that.

4 minutes ago, MDFlier said:

I have seen this issue every once in a while going back to the first NG forP3Dv4. I have seen it once or twice in MSFS but I do not recall if it was in the 700 or 800. I do not have the 600.

For me, 99% of the time it happens, it is on the runway immediately after landing.

It was happening 25% of the time for me, but I'm fairly sure it was the slew mode making it happen more often than normal. I never tried to full throttle and wait for it to come unstuck, because almost every time I had the brake bug, I also had the non-working FMC bug. So I usually just stopped and restarted the flight.

I don't really care that much, there are plenty of planes to fly, I just find it odd that the only real issues I've had with any plane happen to be a PMDG.
I just got bombarded by people not believing I was experiencing a bug, yet thinking I was doing something to cause it (maybe slew though).

Still, it's basically a bug, because most other planes don't have any state issues with slew mode (there are some mostly in-air, but I rarely slew in the air).

Edited November 4, 20223 yr by Alpine Scenery