X-Plane 12 full release in December 2022

[mSparks 2,092]

1 hour ago, OverTheEDJ said:

Nope, Steam proves the point just well. There are more users sticking with XP11 on Steam. You can't get around that fact. Said another way...everyday (according to steam) some 800 users chose to go with the old, instead of the new.

Sorry. Nonsense. You can't use users not switching from a solid platform - that not even MSFS could entice them away from - to an unreleased beta that doesn't really have any 3PD aircraft updated for it yet.

99% of people never check the beta box on the installer, even less take up preleases with well known bugs.

1 hour ago, OverTheEDJ said:

If you call just getting to clouds in 2022 success and progress, then there is not much I can to raise your apparent low standards.

Well, XEnviro has been trying to do clouds for significantly longer than that, they just took that experience elsewhere now its no longer needed in XP12.

1 hour ago, OverTheEDJ said:

Let's not talk about life support, because we would have to talk about the freeware gateway airports (from a starving community) that has kept XP "in the game" for years. Otherwise everyone would have to fly from and land back at KSEA.

Imagine a flight sim without even that....... Oh wait, you don't need to imagine, you just need to have a PC or XBOX with windows on it. Although skip the XBOX for now, cos they haven't got any 3PD systems working yet.

1 hour ago, OverTheEDJ said:

You mean staying in the game with no real development for years???

I presume you mean FSX and the new FSX version with added photogrammetry?

1 hour ago, OverTheEDJ said:

MS has done all of this....XP has not.

And that's why the likes of Airbus, Beta and Bridger went to MS rather than Laminar.....

Don't make me get the Textron youtube video out of box....

48 minutes ago, OverTheEDJ said:

I have seen this denial a few times, but thankfully only on this sub-forum that seems to conjure up an alternate reality concerning XP's shortcomings. It is telling how some of the most loyal XP users (in here) don't feel comfortable posting anywhere else. Enjoy your safe haven...

So, what you are saying is, because you weren't force fed the XP updates for the last 15++ years, you are incapable of telling the difference between these two screenshots.... and people should take you seriously...

Although I suppose you not being able to see a difference between those two screenshots does go a long way to explaining how you can stomach the garbage MS pumps out. 🤷‍♂️

 

Edited November 7, 2022 by mSparks

[BobFS88 651]

1 hour ago, OverTheEDJ said:

y (according to steam) some 800 users chose to go with the old, instead of the new.

That's easy, they don't want to beta test, instead, wait for the final release so the addon will begin to appear. Why do you find that so unusual.

1 hour ago, OverTheEDJ said:

If you call just getting to clouds in 2022 success and progress, then there is not much I can to raise your apparent low standards.

Given that they smartly waited until they finish with the Vulkan conversion, so that they would have the head room for the towering cumulonimbus and other volumetric clouds that everybody wanted so that would not render under Opengl only, causing the sim to go to a  stand still and give you guys something laugh at. I guess you view progress  as releasing anything at all cost, that going to give you the wow effect even if it looks like a nuclear bomb the has gone off with no moisture in the air that can be seen anywhere in the world that is known bug in plan site. Get it out there to meet that schedule, even if its wiped out addon's.

 

1 hour ago, OverTheEDJ said:

we would have to talk about the freeware gateway airports (from a starving community) that has kept XP "in the game" for years.

And how many time have you payed for PMDG for that 737NG while we have enjoyed Zibo for that last 5 to 6 years without switching sim and interruption?  

 

1 hour ago, OverTheEDJ said:

You set a schedule (out for months) and stick to it. MS has done all of this....XP has not.

Don't make me laugh so hard

MS only doing it because it learn for others (like XP and P3D). Get information out there to user they found was the best approach than keeping everything to themselves. You can go back a watch every FSExpo or Cosford convention an hear everything that was plan for X plane that has come to fruition. It was never MS invention or their best attributes but I will admit they have change from the days of, FSX SP1 and done. 

But they had to do it in order to capture the hearts and mind of the users whom they left out in the cold, which they really didn't have much of a choice if they ever wanted to win them back. 

Why didn't MS come to the FS Expo to talk about their product alongside with Austin and co, P3D other flight sim developers instead on their own gaming convention? Some things never change.

Edited November 7, 2022 by BobFS88

[mSparks 2,092]

17 minutes ago, BobFS88 said:

Don't make me laugh so hard

Considering someone who can't tell the difference between X-Plane when FSX was released, and X-Plane being released in December, anymore than they can tell the difference between what Textron announced MS was releasing in 2020 vs what MS actually released.

To be fair, they should at least get some internet points for consistency.

Even if it is absolutely hilarious.

Edited November 7, 2022 by mSparks

[BobFS88 651]

10 minutes ago, mSparks said:

Considering someone who can't tell the difference between X-Plane when FSX was released, and X-Plane today

What is sad is that many miss out on the benefits of a 64 bit sim at the time of FSX 32bitness that was suffering from the OOM, like being able to complete a flight with out having to compress files from detailed airport in order to land. And based on this recent conversation, they still treat freeware as some sort of anomaly assuming it was something less than payware. Yet we have people like MisterX who pumped out payware quality airports and scenery for X plane and had his own library set, back then. Now they wish he was doing scenery for them on the other side. They didn't want to learn the sim and take advantage of it, but they want the best its has to offer to come to them.  

[MrBitstFlyer 3,893]

3 hours ago, OverTheEDJ said:

you seek the help and feedback from the community, you have live streams, constant updates and communicate your intentions. You set a schedule (out for months) and stick to it. MS has done all of this....XP has not.

What planet were you on over the past year - constant live streams, videos showing what upgrades were in XP12 and videos from Austin himself.  Since release of the public beta there has been an update weekly.  I have been stunned what can be achieved with the XP12 platform!

 

[OverTheEDJ 266]

5 hours ago, mSparks said:

Sorry. Nonsense.

...this sums up your entire response. Please be coherent & consistent; stay on point without baseless distractions and then perhaps we can have a reasonable conversation.

[OverTheEDJ 266]

4 hours ago, BobFS88 said:

Given that they smartly waited

you mean waited for years??? Not so smart given that it left them years behind.

4 hours ago, BobFS88 said:

And how many time have you payed for PMDG for that 737NG while we have enjoyed Zibo for that last 5 to 6 years without switching sim and interruption?  

I only fly small GA aircraft. So you apparently missed the mark again... 

 

3 hours ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

I have been stunned what can be achieved with the XP12 platform!

After all of those years of stagnate development, I don't blame you for being stunned.

I mean, its 2022...and LR finally got around to bringing the sim up to 2017 gfx standards in the sky only. WOW. When..oh when...will they ever get to the ground environment??? XP13???

 

4 hours ago, BobFS88 said:

Don't make me laugh so hard

MS only doing it because it learn for others (like XP and P3D).

But it seems that MSFS does it so much better...to gain millions of users and the most successful release launch to date. So again, facts alone refute your statements.

 

5 hours ago, BobFS88 said:

You can go back a watch every FSExpo or Cosford convention an hear everything that was plan for X plane that has come to fruition. It was never MS invention or their best attributes but I will admit they have change from the days of, FSX SP1 and done. 

Do you mean the conventions where Austin offered nothing new??? In 2019 he spoke nothing of improvements on the horizon and spent interviews being vague about future development.

XP12 is a reaction to MSFS....LR had not been proactive about improvements (clouds etc) for years...

5 hours ago, BobFS88 said:

Why didn't MS come to the FS Expo to talk about their product alongside with Austin and co, P3D other flight sim developers instead on their own gaming convention? Some things never change.

Well I can't answer why. But what was the biggest thing that hit the community in 2019 alongside those boring presentations from LR???...that MSFS trailer and announcement.

 

4 hours ago, mSparks said:

Considering someone who can't tell the difference between X-Plane when FSX was released, and X-Plane being released in December, anymore than they can tell the difference between what Textron announced MS was releasing in 2020 vs what MS actually released.

To be fair, they should at least get some internet points for consistency.

Even if it is absolutely hilarious.

#notworthit

[mSparks 2,092]

35 minutes ago, OverTheEDJ said:

Please be coherent & consistent; stay on point without baseless distractions and then perhaps we can have a reasonable conversation.

You said, on multiple occasions now, more or less along the lines of

6 hours ago, OverTheEDJ said:

Nope, you show commitment by partnering with those who do it better (for avionics, weather etc), you seek the help and feedback from the community, you have live streams, constant updates and communicate your intentions. You set a schedule (out for months) and stick to it. MS has done all of this....XP has not.

6 hours ago, OverTheEDJ said:

then there is not much I can to raise your apparent low standards.

So I take that to mean, you look at these three screenshots, and think people using X-Plane are the ones with low standards who have stuck with a sim with no meaningful development.

Me, I'm excited for the actual release of that last one.

Feel free to correct me if I misunderstood what you are trying to say, maybe the way to do that is to look through

https://developer.x-plane.com/blog/

and, find maybe a single month all the way back to 2005 there hasn't been a meaningful update to the X-Plane development and plans.

2005 not enough for you? jump on

https://web.archive.org/web/20220000000000*/x-plane.com

and you can go all the way back to 1997

2 minutes ago, OverTheEDJ said:

XP12 is a reaction to MSFS.

No, XP12 is simply the next natural step resulting from decades of dedication by talented engineers, pilots, aviators and aircraft manufacturers being sick to death of Microsoft and their hyperbole. All talk and promises but when push comes to shove nothing in their trousers.

but please, enlighten us further with your effect before the cause quantum physics of the universe you built for yourself, its great for a laugh.

 

[BobFS88 651]

 

20 minutes ago, OverTheEDJ said:

I only fly small GA aircraft. So you apparently missed the mark again... 

Yeah Smart enough not to embarrass themselves like thee with SU5 and SU7 on a full release.

21 minutes ago, OverTheEDJ said:

I only fly small GA aircraft. So you apparently missed the mark again... 

I don't blame you. You certainly couldn't explain why you would want to pay for a design that over 10 years old in 2022 when there is clearly a fully functional aircraft you fly for merely your own set your price in a donation. 

 

29 minutes ago, OverTheEDJ said:

But it seems that MSFS does it so much better...to gain millions of users and the most successful release launch to date. So again, facts alone refute your statements.

And since you insist on using Steam as a benchmark 61000 to 8000 that about 13%. If you factor that into millions, that a huge drop of user loosing interest more than X plane can gain from such successful launch.  That's why I say those are numbers are not good yo use. 

40 minutes ago, OverTheEDJ said:

Do you mean the conventions where Austin offered nothing new??? In 2019 he spoke nothing of improvements on the horizon and spent interviews being vague about future development.

I didn't say to stop at 2019, you have go back to 2014 or earlier and all the years since then, he was there. I get it, you only stop at 2019 because you seem to feel it fits your point better but the other years will refute everything you just said. 

 

47 minutes ago, OverTheEDJ said:

Well I can't answer why. But what was the biggest thing that hit the community in 2019 alongside those boring presentations from LR???.

Oh so you were paying attention to those "boring presentation" where the meat and potatoes of what he has in store X plane reside. To bad you did listen, maybe you would learn something.    

 

Ok

So let get this topic back on track and discuss X plane 12.  The release is coming and that is where the focus should be.

The fun time is over and its time to get back to doing some flying. It you don't want to do that, there is always the other side friendlier confines.

Have a good day or evening.

 

[MrBitstFlyer 3,893]

2 hours ago, OverTheEDJ said:

#notworthit

You said it.

[jcomm 5,979]

Sometimes I bring my dayjob-related stuff to these threads, so I assume some of us do the same?

People who work in investment, stocks, sales departments, etc... probably prefer to examine their flightsims at the light of numbers from their dayjobs and so, for them, A vs B is basically how much A sells compared to B, how many people bought A, and how A or B have been showing a decrease or increase in userbase....

I'd rather look at it from a different perspective. Also when numbers like those are taken into consideration it always reminds me of cars, and why isn't everyone driving a Rolls Royce or a Bentley?

I don't like cars more than for what they're worth keeping - drive them to work and back everyday :-/, so, my wife knows a LOT more about cars then I do, but I know that if I had the money to spend in a top car my choice would be a Bentley, or even an RR - my dream cars as a kid...

Yet I do appreciate good cars that I could actually buy / maintain, and I even have my Clio 990 CC which is just great. If I loveed cars I would rent a top one for a day / weekend... just as I sometimes load XP to play for a few minutes / hours... 

 

[soaring_penguin 431]

4 hours ago, OverTheEDJ said:

XP12 is a reaction to MSFS....LR had not been proactive about improvements (clouds etc) for years.

You are so mis informed. I am just quoting you this part in particular : this came after Austin saw xEnviro in action. If I am not mistaken, before MSFS was on the horizon.

And before msfs, there were only a few attempts to 3d clouds (flight unlimited 3) which wasn’t nice because the hardware only caught up recently. And XEnviro has been struggling also with performance. It needed a direct hook into the Vulkan api, which had to be delivered first (during xp11run).

how many titles do you know that improved performance during current versio, without needing new hardware? This is also commitment. Laminar provided this upgrade from OpenGL to Vulkan for free during the xp11 run. Not so sexy as photogrammetry but not less work!

but haters are going to hate.

[Mike44 22]

They still need to fix lots of bugs for XP12 final...

 

[UKflyer 630]

and fix the flickering please, you've had 11 betas to do it

[soaring_penguin 431]

1 hour ago, UKflyer said:

and fix the flickering please, you've had 11 betas to do it

who, me? 😇 you are addressing the wrong crowd...

for what it's worth, the flickering is gone on my system since a few betas.