Since "Games for Windows LIVE" is where the next simulator is based from, I thought I'd sign up to take a look around. When you do so, you get to download a puzzle game for free. Anyway, you certainly must be online to play the game; in fact, there's no other way to activate it until you've signed in with your password and hit the play button. Thinking ahead, it may be impossible to tweak settings in "Flight" if all the texture and sound files remain on a MS server. Maybe that won't be the case, where files could be downloaded to your hard drive, but access to the sim itself to run it all is through the internet. I love to tweak sound files to my personal liking, and I hope that's not impossible in the next version. I'm not concerned with the social interaction while flying, nor do I care about earning points for completing tasks, as that's too gamey for me.I'm not trying to prejudge "Flight", although it may sound that way. As long as MS lets us remain in control over our sim world, things should be fine. If we have to give up too much to stay connected online, then I think the FS world could be fragmented more than it is now. The drama of it all will be interesting, although PMDG will keep me in FSX for a long time to come.

I said it previously, but having to be connected continually would hurt MS in this endeavor (yes, downloading real weather from MS means we need to be connected, but we can still run FS without having to connect to the internet), just like it has hurt other publishers. Right now though, it is to early to tell how it will shake out. Hopefully, MS will not make it a requirement, only time will tell.

previous username : fsxIf you take a look at the countries where Windows Live! is actually available (see link below) - it's only available in 26 countries. Even with the new countries they intend adding in the future , it still excludes our friends in Argentina, Brazil, Russia, China (apart from Hong Kong) , Thailand, Turkey, UAE, and all eastern European countries. Does that not therefore tell us that you don't actually need the Live! connection. Standalone therefore must be an option - these titles must be available in these countries too. All of the Microsoft titles are listed under the LIve! banner - so big deal. It's like someone said before. I suspect this might just be the conduit through which MS will dispatch any addons, like service patches, Acceleration etc, but can't believe that every 3rd party provider will have to distribute via this channel. http://www.xbox.com/en-US/live/countries.htm

With all new games you have to be conected continually to play, get used to it.

Since "Games for Windows LIVE" is where the next simulator is based from, I thought I'd sign up to take a look around. When you do so, you get to download a puzzle game for free. Anyway, you certainly must be online to play the game; in fact, there's no other way to activate it until you've signed in with your password and hit the play button. Thinking ahead, it may be impossible to tweak settings in "Flight" if all the texture and sound files remain on a MS server. Maybe that won't be the case, where files could be downloaded to your hard drive, but access to the sim itself to run it all is through the internet. I love to tweak sound files to my personal liking, and I hope that's not impossible in the next version. I'm not concerned with the social interaction while flying, nor do I care about earning points for completing tasks, as that's too gamey for me.I'm not trying to prejudge "Flight", although it may sound that way. As long as MS lets us remain in control over our sim world, things should be fine. If we have to give up too much to stay connected online, then I think the FS world could be fragmented more than it is now. The drama of it all will be interesting, although PMDG will keep me in FSX for a long time to come.

People are overreacting way too much to Windows Live. There is no way Microsoft will keep all the Flight files on some master server. Go into your FSX or FS9 directory and look at how big your scenery, sound and texture folders are. Do you really think Microsoft will make you download several gigabytes of data every time you click fly now? No server could handle the demand and no user would put up with waiting hours for a single flight to load.V_One, your link is for Xbox Live which does not apply to PC games. I think Flight will be like most other games, where an internet connection is only required for multiplayer.

V_One, your link is for Xbox Live which does not apply to PC games. I think Flight will be like most other games, where an internet connection is only required for multiplayer.

Not true at all, to play and save/load a single player game on GFWL you need to be connected to the internet. This is every time you play, not just after installing and playing for the first time.There is a work around where you can make an offline proflile, but without that you can't play (or save) the game unless connected to the internet.I have Bioshock 2 through Steam and it uses GFWL, hasn't given me any problems, but GFWL is hated in the gaming community.

With all new games you have to be conected continually to play, get used to it.

No you don't. I can play CoH offline as well as Portal (not really brand new, but still new enough) and SHIV (do not even need the DVD in the drive with it either). Ask Ubi how well their OSP has gone over. They had a 13% drop in sales last quarter as compared to the same quarter last year. This is the first quarter that they used OSP on their PC games and it hit them in the wallet. They even stated that the new RTS Ruse will not use it but just Steam instead though it is the only game to use just Steam. Other PC games are still destined to use OSP.We do not need to "get used to it" as many of us game while on the road. We cannot depend on dodgy or slow internet connections at hotels or even if there is a connection at the places we work at (I sometimes will not have much to do over the course of a job and will play games to fill the time) or if we are able to connect to them. Forcing us to stay connected 24/7 is not the way to go no matter who it is and they will suffer monetarily for wanting us to.

No you don't. I can play CoH offline as well as Portal (not really brand new, but still new enough) and SHIV (do not even need the DVD in the drive with it either). Ask Ubi how well their OSP has gone over. They had a 13% drop in sales last quarter as compared to the same quarter last year. This is the first quarter that they used OSP on their PC games and it hit them in the wallet. They even stated that the new RTS Ruse will not use it but just Steam instead though it is the only game to use just Steam. Other PC games are still destined to use OSP.We do not need to "get used to it" as many of us game while on the road. We cannot depend on dodgy or slow internet connections at hotels or even if there is a connection at the places we work at (I sometimes will not have much to do over the course of a job and will play games to fill the time) or if we are able to connect to them. Forcing us to stay connected 24/7 is not the way to go no matter who it is and they will suffer monetarily for wanting us to.

I love Steam, greatest thing for PC gaming if you ask me. Easy to buy and play games, and if you build a new rig or install a new OS, just log into steam and redownnload the game. Games are tied to your account and not your computer, so it's hassle free to redownload a game. I play a lot of PC games and only buy them from Steam, saves on desk clutter since you have no DVD's laying around.

Not true at all, to play and save/load a single player game on GFWL you need to be connected to the internet.

Not true. I've played few GFWL single player games (Gears of War, Batman: Arkham Asylum). In my country Live is not supported yet, but I was able to make a local profile and play without internet connection.

Not true. I've played few GFWL single player games (Gears of War, Batman: Arkham Asylum). In my country Live is not supported yet, but I was able to make a local profile and play without internet connection.

You obviously didn't read all of my post.

You obviously didn't read all of my post.

You wrote:

There is a work around where you can make an offline proflile, but without that you can't play (or save) the game

Are you now contradicting yourself?

People are overreacting way too much to Windows Live.

THIS. THIS. and THIS AGAIN.Retail gaming titles designed for use with Windows Live are far more likely to be using the Live platform as some sort of front-end interface for multiplayer, some addon and patching distribution, and other smaller features. I have HUGE doubts that Microsoft would go the route of using the Live platform as a full DRM system and exclusive distribution point for all 3rd party addons. Which scenario is more likely:* MS Flight will require the use of MS Live as a DRM control. * All addons will be fed through MS Live just like the iPhone's app store. * Your configurations will be held by MS Live.~or~* MS Flight will use Microsoft's tried and true one-time internet activation method and not use an always online DRM scheme.* SOME addons may be MS Live exclusive, but the system will not require the use of Live for distributing all addons. * Your configurations, files, and sim items will be on your hard drive like they always have.I know we're all speculating here, but lets not get all ramped up over this. There are lots of what if's running around with regards to the Windows Live integration... but taking a look at what Windows Live is today, I don't think there is much to fear. Dire predictions can predispose you to feeling negative about the whole project. Personally, the only thing I'm taking from the announcement is that there is a new flight game in development. Until I hear more from official sources, I'm not going to drool in anticipation nor am I going to shiver in fear for what "M$" has planned. Keeps the blood pressure down, ya' know?-Greg

Until I hear more from official sources, I'm not going to drool in anticipation nor am I going to shiver in fear for what "M$" has planned.-Greg

This is what I have been saying.

* SOME addons may be MS Live exclusive, but the system will not require the use of Live for distributing all addons.

And if that is the case, it may well be a good thing. One thing ACES did after the release of FSX was to link to other community sites, giving them added exposure.Take a small or new developer, be it of scenery or airplanes or a utility. Exposure is difficult if you're not a BIG name or have the capital to buy advertising. Having the ability to promote a new product through a Microsoft portal could give the new or struggling developer the exposure they need to survive.

* SOME addons may be MS Live exclusive, but the system will not require the use of Live for distributing all addons.

Ya,I believe so...3rd party publishers are the genie MS wouldn't be able to put back in the bottle.That bridge has already been crossed. We can fret about it...but MS made that call and their hands are tied.They can’t close the open market without a tsunami of hate.Apple was able to build a closed market because they had no precedent.Mind you they won’t be able to sustain it once the fan-boys & devs really start jumping ship for platforms with open markets.Flight would get eaten alive by any competing product with an open market - namely FSX.FSX is Flight’s biggest threat. The same way FS9 was FSX market rival.meshman I agree with you. And dev's have put it to MS that they should open a store.