Pitch attitude on approach and touchdown.

[g_precentralis 191]

Omg... are that 2 degrees more or less really an issue?

[henkie 0]

Omg... are that 2 degrees more or less really an issue?

If it means that you'll float all the way to Paris if you have a appointment in Brussels, yes ;-) Just kidding, but one of the best things about flying for me is the landing, even in a simulation for the PC. So for me it is very important that it feels right. But now it doesn't. And I think those few degrees has everything to do with it. Kind regards,

[g_precentralis 191]

Well, I'm not rl 737 pilot, and do not know what is the right feeling, but I do not have problems at all. :)

[Jen 0]

Somebody from PMDG please comment on this topic as it is becoming quite an issue and causing a lot of grief among the flightsim PMDG community. This would settle the matter once and for all and keep me from constantly looking for answers to what I too consider a conflict with the Boeing FCTM. Regards,jen noulet

[G550flyer 1,014]

Well I posted about this issue on the first day of release. My intentions were not to stir up fights and debates. I fly real world and have a great love for the flightsim community I use my real world experiance in an effort to help the community. I've been fortunate to fly light and heavy jets all around the world. Stemming from my time in military, I do precision flying. From air-refueling to landing heavy jets on a 5000ft runway performing max effort stops. Being in situations where if you are a tad bit fast, high or floating meant you are departing the paved surface. This was routine. My first experiance with flying came by way of flightsim. So I give back when I can. Some can't experiance real flight but flightsim gives them an option, and I aim to make it as real as can be. The landing and approach attitude, I can fix myself. I mention the issue here because others see the same issue. I'm not giving my opinion because the manual says it clearly enough. Every real world flight manual that I've used, have those charts. Those are the same charts that I've learned from and taught from. Every jet I've flown had the same landing procedure. The only thing that changed from jet to jet was the height that you flared and pulled power. All ways 2 to 3 degrees added for the flare. I guess that's why the airforce uses the beechjet(T-1 modified to fly sluggish like a heavy) as the heavy track trainer for guys selected to fly heavies. I all ways flight test flightsim against the manual, not my opinion. As stated, didn't want us to bicker about it. Just wanted us to look at it collectively and compare it to the manual.

[michal 44]

and causing a lot of grief among the flightsim PMDG community.

'Grief' is a bloated word here.Like I said in another thread - just carry less speed on final and you will get the attitude you prefer. Flying this 5 or 10 kts slower than the "book" value should not prevent someone from enjoying the simulation or otherwise if there is any grief here - it is self inflicted.

[Jen 0]

You are correct in assuming that it shouldn't prevent someone from enjoying the simulation since other than this variation from the FCTM the simulator is an incredible work of art, but the fact remains with an overwhelming consensus of those who fly by the book, that this aircraft model has a seemingly inaccurate discrepency in the manner in which the correct 'attitude' should be according to the Boeing NG FCTM's... Based on reviewing the above threads concerning this issue, I believe it should be addressed by the PMDG team and if a correction is possible within the FSX software enviroment, it should be implemented via an (SP) and/or an explanation as to what PMDG's intentions are to correct or convey their existing thoughts and/or future actions. Regards again,jen noulet

[Dean19 11]

I think the whole point of this thread(and the other threads on this issue) is the desire to fly the aircraft by the official Boeing numbers and have it react accordingly during this important phase of flight(approach/landing) I'm surprised this wasn't caught during the beta period. Also surprised at the lack of comments by the PMDG team about this.

[738Captain 4]

In the video I post, at 8:48 to touch down, you can clearly see it's 5 degrees on the flare and yet still people are arguing.

[SKEWR 364]

I think the quote below is actually a nicely worded request. I DO think some of the things we've been seeing since release are really small things that are blown out of proportion, but let's not forget we have not even seen SP1 for the NGX yet... However:1) $150 worth of PC software does not equal an actual Level D simulation. Let them fix what they can and accept the limitations of the FSX software.2) As most of us are not 737 type rated, we have to trust the manuals and the words of RL 37 pilots. If they disagree, the videos in this thread should be the proof you seek as to what is accurate.3) MOST IMPORTANT: There are still paying customers who cannot complete a flight (let alone see the attitude on flare). Before any frothing at the mouth occurs, let PMDG get everyone they can flying, and then let's quibble about a less than 5 degree, perceived, inaccuracy. Just my 2 cents...

You are correct in assuming that it shouldn't prevent someone from enjoying the simulation since other than this variation from the FCTM the simulator is an incredible work of art, but the fact remains with an overwhelming consensus of those who fly by the book, that this aircraft model has a seemingly inaccurate discrepency in the manner in which the correct 'attitude' should be according to the Boeing NG FCTM's... Based on reviewing the above threads concerning this issue, I believe it should be addressed by the PMDG team and if a correction is possible within the FSX software enviroment, it should be implemented via an (SP) and/or an explanation as to what PMDG's intentions are to correct or convey their existing thoughts and/or future actions. Regards again,jen noulet

[G550flyer 1,014]

Well some people can sit in the pilots seat, watch the approach, flare and touch down. Compare it to the manual and still wouldn't acknowledge it. It's amazing that the real videos that you see, HUD and PFD , coincides with the Boeing manuals. Amazing that the actual Boeing jets behaves as the boeing manual advertise. Hmmmmm.

[BraytonCycle 0]

No need to fart jizz bubbles.. hahaha.. Here's a vid I made a few days ago... Vref134 , wind down the runway at about 5 kts, flaps40, weights, can't remember off the top of my head but 140 passengers and about 3000lbs in each tank.. http://www.youtube.c...h?v=iLCf0kNNqNE

Tony, this is just a video of you landing on FSX! Of course you will get a good landing holdin 2-2.5degrees because PMDG set the numbers like that. This does not mean it replicates the real aircraft. Plus the second video, were you looking at the FPV or the pitch attitude? Also note the FO calling "Tail" which meant he would had to lower the nose to drive the aircraft in so not to float as some of you may have noticed. Not a smooth landing which is better than a float half way down the runway and greasing it! Am a real world pilot on the NG and know for sure the top of the white box (airplane nose) on the PFD is held just on the 5 degree line on touchdown just as the Boeing designed it to in their books. No use posting videos of PMDG landings since thats PMDGs programmed numbers. Those of you looking at the second video, that -3 degrees that pilot was holding is correct since in the HUD system, we fly the FPV (Flight Path Vector) which shows flight path angle relative to the horizon. On an ILS its basically the glideslope which is -3 degrees. Whats shown on the Attitude indicator is different, around +1 to +2 degrees for flaps 30 as this is the aircrafts nose relative to the horizon. Without using HUD, select "FPV" on your EFIS panel when carrying out an ILS or even level flight and see what the FPV holds compared to the Attitude indicator. Your AI should indicate +1 to 2 degrees and FPV around -3 degrees. Anyway, hope PMDG could just provide numbers which those who want to adjust can do so so as to replicate the real aircraft and those who are happy with what they now can carry on flying without any changes.

[PIC007 82]

Anyone considered the affect of different CG's on this? Just asking cause I just fly the plane and so far I aint broke one yet :-)

[frank1223 4]

The approach attitude is absolutely correct on the NGX (0~+1 degree on the attitude indicator) . Its the 737-700 and 737-300 which flies at +2.5~+3 degrees attitude.What we are concerning is the 737-800 seems to have too much lift during flare. It should be almost 5 degrees at touchdown, but in this case we would flared to the moon.

[mikea76 184]

Brayton and G550flyer, I am sure your both really good pilots and I do not have the background to question you, but IF you guys are right and they got this wrong, how was this missed by multiple type rated pilots that fly this plane for a living such as jack, tom and the other pilots that worked with PMDG on this. Your basically saying that 1. they noticed this and pointed it out but were overruled 2. they are incompetent 3. did they just not care.. or are you two wrong? I hope you two won't be offended by this but I can't confirm Brayton is a 737 pilot, and g550 you sound really professional but you don't fly the 737. I really would like to see the tech team pilots respond to this. Ok I am not a pilot so I may be wrong here but my airplane body attitude is spot on on approach and reading the charts in the manuals, they mention that these charts were for sea level, -150 fpm at touchdown with CG at forward limit.. so what that tells me is unless your at sea level with your CG at the forward limit then your going to be off even in the real plane.