Instrument stuff can be a challenge, especially to those who are prone to getting motion sickness. I love doing the unusual attitudes and getting people upset, but it is demanding. Lots of learning lubricant during the summer (sweat).

Sorry for the delayed update.Lesson #6...(not much else to say)

Congrats on your solo! You're now officially a "pilot"! (Hope that was an old shirt)

Actually that shirt was a gift. I had no idea I was going to solo today...We did about 5 touch & gos, taxi'd back & when I started packing up my headset he stopped me & said I wasn't done yet. It was interesting, I had to share the pattern with a Cherokee & a citation, which was the first real traffic I've experienced...Did 3 takeoffs & landings. Long as those 2 numbers are always equal I'm happy!Edit: those citations are pretty fast compared to this little socata tb9. I had just started my turn off the runway when he radioed (quite anxiously) to make sure I was clear. About 15 seconds later I watched him land while I was taxi'ing back to the runway start.

Edited January 9, 201214 yr by MrKen

What's with the shirt? I don't understand the significance.

That sucks! I had a polo on solo day. I also got a cold cup of water dumped on my head by my smart alec instructor!Anyway, congrats again! You're making great progess!

What's with the shirt? I don't understand the significance.

Tradition has it that the shirt tail of a student that solos must be cut out. This tradition began because in tandem trainers in yesteryear, the instructor sat in the back and would tug at the student's shirt tail to get their attention. When an instructor solos a student, it means they are confident the student won't bend up the plane. No instructor= No tugging at the shirt tail= No need for the shirt tail!

Edited January 10, 201214 yr by ZachLW

Kenneth-I just picked up on this thread now- and wanted to chime in and offer congratulations and best of luck.I am always excited to see a fellow simmer make the plunge into real world flying. Even if you don't intend to do it as a career, the experience of learning to fly does great things for one's self esteem and personal pride- and I think it helps teach better decision making all-around.I've seen a number of friends, fellow simmers, beta testers and even members of the PMDG team go through and complete a new rating- and it's always great to see the enthusiasm.Our own Lead Beta Tester, George Morris has been keeping me up to speed on his training and his flying since he first began a few year back. He is now flying multi engine airplanes- and he flew Ryan out to spend the afternoon with me at KRFD where I was involved in a few tasks on afternoon back in late September. You'll make great friends in aviation- and you'll have some great stories to tell. Keep at it and don't let anyone make your decisions for you, Captain....

Kenneth-I just picked up on this thread now- and wanted to chime in and offer congratulations and best of luck.I am always excited to see a fellow simmer make the plunge into real world flying. Even if you don't intend to do it as a career, the experience of learning to fly does great things for one's self esteem and personal pride- and I think it helps teach better decision making all-around.I've seen a number of friends, fellow simmers, beta testers and even members of the PMDG team go through and complete a new rating- and it's always great to see the enthusiasm.Our own Lead Beta Tester, George Morris has been keeping me up to speed on his training and his flying since he first began a few year back. He is now flying multi engine airplanes- and he flew Ryan out to spend the afternoon with me at KRFD where I was involved in a few tasks on afternoon back in late September.You'll make great friends in aviation- and you'll have some great stories to tell. Keep at it and don't let anyone make your decisions for you, Captain....

Robert, have you ever been an instructor - either in your airline or a general aviation instructor on small aircraft? Just curious.

Thanks for the congratulations everyone, and thanks a second time for both of yours Zach!@Robert:I was actually secretly afraid that if you saw this topic you'd move it somewhere else! And for the record I'm still blaming the ngx & 744 for my firm landings... 2-3 degrees does NOT work in a TB9! I'm always afraid I'll balloon up & stall 5 feet above the runway so I think I'm not following through completely on the flare. I seem to always land (hit) half a second after the stall horn sounds off. I'll be doing great, maybe a bit fast/jerky on the flare (that ground seems to always come up really close, really fast!) because it levels off a foot or two (i think) above the asphalt & instead of keeping it there to bleed off speed i just hold that pitch while it slows a bit & continues a too-fast descent, without ever adding any more back pressure to slow it up further. I think the next session I'll ask the instructor to go up with me & let me watch him do 2 or 3 landings. I think I'm consistent enough in my wrongness to see the difference watching it done the right way. I'm also nervous about tailstrikes so that's probably messing me up too.@ the real sel pilots here, does it look like I've analyzed my wrongness correctly or is the issue probably in another direction? Everything else is going great, I'm throttling back to idle about 75-100yds before the threshold & crossing around 65kts +/- a couple. Vso is 50kts, at this point I'll have 2 whites, 2 red and usually within 3-4 feet of the centerline.

Edited January 10, 201214 yr by MrKen

@ the real sel pilots here, does it look like I've analyzed my wrongness correctly or is the issue probably in another direction? Everything else is going great, I'm throttling back to idle about 75-100yds before the threshold & crossing around 65kts +/- a couple. Vso is 50kts, at this point I'll have 2 whites, 2 red and usually within 3-4 feet of the centerline.

The way it was explained to me is all about sight and feel and less about hard numbers (you'll never ever hit numbers exactly, but the sight/feel rarely change). First, idle when you see you've made the runway (the runway numbers/threshold will begin to slide back in your field of view, instead of having the illusion of getting closer to them). Next, pitch to maintain final approach speed. I tend to flare late and land flat (but relatively softly), but begin your flare once you're closer to the ground (timing is up to you - most CFIs hate my flare though, and flinch at the yoke because I flare so late - I'd argue an earlier flare would get my nose up higher, which most CFIs would like to see). The rest comes with experience. How quickly should you flare, how quickly should you pull the yoke back to flare properly, what's the proper deck angle at touch? All of that is something you'll have to figure out because it's all about perception.How you perceive the picture is something nobody can teach you. Landings will improve with time and experience.

Edited January 10, 201214 yr by scandinavian13

Maybe I'm making it out to be worse than it is. I'm just getting a bit frustrated because this is the first thing I haven't been able to nail on the 2nd or 3rd try and my last 2 landings weren't any better than the two before them.

Edited January 10, 201214 yr by MrKen

It's a long process. My landings were streaky (not because of locked brakes, but because I hadn't nailed the picture and got lucky sometimes) for a while, and then I took a break from flying (finances). When I went up for my BFR, I did a few laps at a local towered airport, and by then, I'd finally started getting the feel for them. Moral here is sometimes a break is what you need.One thing a lot of people stress is that you transition your eyes from your aiming point, to the end of the runway when you get closer to your flare. It helps you judge vertical distance better to more accurately judge your flare.I know it's frustrating, but look on YouTube. Even the pros mess up landings on the clearest, windless days. Accept the not-the-best landing, quickly analyze what you could do better on downwind, and try again. Practice makes perfect. Dwelling makes errors.As long as you have an opportunity to try the landing again, you're on the right track. :(

Edited January 10, 201214 yr by scandinavian13

I've coached my friend (also a commercial MEL pilot) to land the NGX here at my house.What finally ended up working for him in the '-800 (results may vary according to gross weight and the actual issues you're having with landing):

• Establish your Vref speed just before you cross the numbers (assuming you added a few knots while on approach). ie pitch and power come back just a tad just over the threshold. Pitch should be around the 4-6 degree range. Assume you're aiming for the 1000' marks in my example. Airspeed from the threshold on should be bleeding off from Vref.
• At around 50-30 feet, power should be at idle, pitch remaining constant (that's important). That is, stick to around 5-6 degrees during "flare" (barely any)
• Hold that attitude. We let ground effect do it's work to cushion the descent rate. You have to count on it!

The big thing I found my friend doing was flaring the nose too much over the runway. Pitching for 7-9 degrees to arrest descent rate because of poor airspeed control on short final. Don't be tempted to change pitch more than 1 degree either side of the 5 degree pitch line. It's that sensitive! Count on floating 3-5 seconds (a long way) if pitch control is poor. A solid touchdown with no bounce is a good landing. A Boeing landing.EDIT: I somehow got mixed up. Disregard my nonsense.

Edited January 10, 201214 yr by ZachLW

At around 50-30 feet, power should be at idle, pitch remaining constant (that's important). That is, stick to around 5-6 degrees during "flare" (barely any)

While I seem to idle a bit later then that...you advice about holding the pitch constant is bang on for me. It takes a lot of effort though to force myself not to squeak a bit more pitch out of the flare...which = float of course.

While I seem to idle a bit later then that...you advice about holding the pitch constant is bang on for me. It takes a lot of effort though to force myself not to squeak a bit more pitch out of the flare...which = float of course.

I'm so stupid. I got this post mixed up with another. Ignore my last post.Obviously Kenneth isn't seeking his PPL in a 737!But yes, she likes to float!

@ the real sel pilots here, does it look like I've analyzed my wrongness correctly or is the issue probably in another direction? Everything else is going great, I'm throttling back to idle about 75-100yds before the threshold & crossing around 65kts +/- a couple. Vso is 50kts, at this point I'll have 2 whites, 2 red and usually within 3-4 feet of the centerline.

I think you're way ahead of most pilots given the amount of time you've been at it. You've got the right attitude, and obviously the instructor has faith in you.

Edited January 10, 201214 yr by ZachLW