I would rather see the USA focus on their economy for now rather then leading a mission into Syria. I think the USA could take part in a smaller way to save money for back home. These air force type missions like recent Libya or Kosovo back in the late 90's are very expensive.

 

If there is going to be a NATO action I think Turkey should lead that with the support of its NATO allies seeing as Turkey is a capable nation and Syria's neighbour.

 

I agree with you there. Turkey with aid from NATO should be able to complete the mission whatever that may be. I don't think the US will be able to do much with the economy. At least for the US it is on the rise we just keep getting drug down by the EU and investors being timid until that all figures it self out over there.

I agree with you there. Turkey with aid from NATO should be able to complete the mission whatever that may be. I don't think the US will be able to do much with the economy. At least for the US it is on the rise we just keep getting drug down by the EU and investors being timid until that all figures it self out over there.

 

I'm not sure that that is how it works. If Turkey requests NATO support under Article 5, then NATO command and control would be followed, and Turkish forces would opeate under NATO command (Allied Joint Force Command, Naples IT) and the Allied Air Component in Izmir. I can see Turkey may want more freedom of action acting in its national capacity.

 

scott s.

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I don't see an invasion happening, what I see will be an escalation on the current embargo in place by the USA and EU. Turkey should push for more weight behind that embargo.

 

Syria is mostly landlocked by Turkey with Iraq on the other side. Their coast is short. Only real consideration is Russia does have a port in Tartus, so they will continue to support Syria in the interest of that asset.

 

Reports of desertion from Syria to Turkey today, that makes me wonder who ordered that missile attack and the reasons behind it.

I would not want to be a Syrian helicopter pilot straying into Turkish airspace though. You will find anymore incursions over the border will be met with more than a diplomatic protest.

Turkey infiltrafes Greek airspace all the time.They are known bullies in the area,with a very bad history of human rights violations themselves!

If they entered Syrian airspace, under the current tensions in the region ,then the Syrians had every right to shoot that aircraft down.

 

PS:This is not to say that I condone what is happening internally in Syria at this present time.

To those advocating military intervention, we should also bear in mind here, that the situation in Syria is far more complex than a simple 'guys in white hats and guys in black hats' fighting for either freedom or oppression, as though it was some kind of clear cut Hollywood script. Just today in fact, there was a credible report on the BBC that widespread attrocities are being committed by both sides, which to anyone who has ever had experience of war, will come as no surprise at all, because that is what very often happens in warfare.

 

This is not to say that I in any way condone or support what the Syrian Government has done, any more than I would condone the rebels doing so, but we should remember that, as is often the case, it's generally not as simple as people like to believe, and rarely about the desire to free people from oppression either. The reality is that the war in Syria is to a large extent a proxy war between the coalition of a few NATO countries plus some primarily Sunni Muslim nations such as Saudi, versus the coalition of China and Russia, and like all such proxy wars, it is ultimately about selling stuff to client states and creating spheres of influence - i.e. do you want a T-82 or an M-1 Abrams in return for that oil/gas/copper concession? - and not about being the cavalry riding to protect the innocent, and that goes for both sides.

 

The wider objective of Nato countries is to isolate Iran from one of its few allies in the region so it can exert further influence, the objective of China and Russia is to keep Syria and Iran as client states so they can do the same, but as ever, whilst the fighting goes on and the blame gets bandied about, the people who live there are the ones who suffer, just as they did in Korea, Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Angola, Libya, Croatia, Serbia etc, etc.

 

It's an old, old story, and sadly this is simply another chapter in it, because an innocent civilian is just as dead whether hit by a missile from Mil-24 Hind or an AH-1 Cobra, or an AR-15 as opposed to an AK-74. But I don't blame the military, of whatever nation, they simply get told where to go and whom to fight, however, I do blame the goverments who so often shamefully abuse the act of loyalty given to them in trust by their soldiers who volunteer in the faithful belief that they will be told to do what is right and just.

 

As the legendary Chuck Yeager once whispered to a fellow pilot in the briefing room upon hearing his P-51 Mustang fighter group being ordered to strafe anything that moved in a 50x50 mile square of Germany in Autumn 1945, and that included civilians: 'If we're going to do things like this, we sure as hell better make sure we're on the winning side'.

 

Al

One thing that any escalation of tension in the Middle East always does is raise oil prices. Given the already fragile state of the European and US economies, a prolonged conflict in Syria, particularly if other nations get involved and shipping is affected, could tip Europe into recession and flatten what's left of the wimpy US "recovery."

 

The current administration in Washington is just hoping this doesn't blow up before the election. Syrain rebels were emboldened by the NATO support of the Libyan uprising, so this administration must already bear some responsibility for what's happening there now.

To update a fairly well known Steve Bell cartoon on the matter...

 

 

Al

Daniel, using words like "loser" are going to get you attention you do not want (from Stephen).. I suggest you apologize for that and move on.

 

I apologize but I believe that comment towards New Zealand and Matt is totally unjustified and abhorrent.

I apologize but I believe that comment towards New Zealand and Matt is totally unjustified and abhorrent.

 

Where was the comment about Matt and New Zealand?

Where was the comment about Matt and New Zealand?

 

I think he's referring to this exchange!!

 

Turkey is the regional superpower for that area and the Turkish Airforce is one of NATO largest combat fleets (3rd largest millitary behind the USA and the UK). They have very good military capabilities so most likely they just want advice on what they can do. Turkey has a modern fleet of F-16's that they build themselves and they would be more then ready to take on Syria's aging Migs.

 

Syria is backed by Russia so that is the only area of concern really. I think a good response is to impose an embargo on further delivery of arms from Russia. They should sink that shipment of Helicopters from Russia if they try to deliver.

I guess cheerleading for conflict in the Med probably feels like a video game if you live in New Zealand.. :Thinking:

Missed that in my reading, thanks.

 

I don't think that warranted that much of a response.

I apologize but I believe that comment towards New Zealand and Matt is totally unjustified and abhorrent.

 

Cheers Daniel and all the best to Raindance and everyone else on here....I consider you all a friend.

 

My personal connection with Turkey is a have an ex-girlfriend that is Turkish, best way to discribe that one is she was one of those you let go and regret ever since, However we had the Long-Distance-Relationship-Blues......Therefore I think very highly of the Turkish culture and the nation, but I also think highly of many cultures and countries around the world.

 

Looks to me like this will be a slight escalation in tense relations with Turkey and Syria and like has been said....I wouldn't want to be a Syrian Helicopter pilot straying into Turkish airspace (even if I was trying to defect).