October 18, 201213 yr Hi FS9 folks, the title says it already. I want to move on from my "only propliners" attitude and try a jet, but it has to be vintage. I just don't know if I stay with a jet for long (many years ago a made some flights with iFDG A319, but I found them - with one word - boring), thats why I will try freeware first. Searching a freeware 737-200 I found the TinMouse v 1.32. More recently, the TinMouse got quite good reviews. Is it still really good for me (as I see myself as beginner on the area of jetliners), or is there a better recommendation? Edit: 2D-panel is a "must", VC not. Thank you very much in advance Harald Harald Geyer Gründer der Messerschmitt Freunde Dresden v. V.
October 18, 201213 yr Timmouse is the way to go for you. 2d panel, good systems, nice model , good sound. One of the best freeware planes ever made for fs Cheers Lee
October 18, 201213 yr I agree with Lee's recommendation 100% There is simply nothing better to be found in the way of a freeware B732. You might also like to check out HJG at: http://www.simviation.com/hjg/main.htm Their B722 is of very good quality and it will certainly not bore you. It will make you work to fly it even on AP. Definitely retro when it comes to the autopilot. Regards, Mel
October 18, 201213 yr Hi Harald I agree with what has been recommended - by all accounts the Tin Mouse 737 is excellent. But I'd like to put in a plug for a payware aircraft that I think is one of the three absolute top products ever released for FS9 and will give you a superb introduction to flying a classic jetliner that actually preceded the 737 though the flight deck of the 737-200 was recognizably influenced by it. That plane is the Dream Fleet 727. It is as close to pefect as it is possible to be within FS. Full systems modelling but the learning curve is not such that you will not love flying it from the very first attempt. The documentation is very complete and you can spend as much time as you want learning to fly it "on the numbers." Systems are accurate and there are some system failures built in. As in the real world, it truly is one of the greatest airliners of all time. It is a joy to fly and something you never get tired of. It's also the logical jump up from your beloved propliners as the 727 really was the transition from the prop era to jets for most airlines. (Along with the Caravelle and the Comet of course) Cheers Ian
October 18, 201213 yr The Tim Mouse rocks and is probably better than half the payware aircraft out there... One of my absolute favorites of all time... Bob should get a commendation for his years of effort and dedication... Keep in mind there are two distinct models that work with the panel... The Erik Cantu Vistaliners model and the Terri Gaff model that was intended for payware but then later released as freeware when the project didn't complete... The "Tinmouse" forum is hosted here on AVSIM and is your best place to start... It's a fantastic little bird... Enthusiastic - - - umm - yup... Regards, Scott
October 18, 201213 yr Please forgive for intercepting, hope the Ts wouldn't mind. Hi Ian I heard nothing but good things about Dreamfleet 727. I also have read its review. Maybe this sounds a bit silly but since there are only few left in the RW, I am in doubt to invest in as I went to Maddog instead (and I am more than happy with the MD82) so I stopped thinking about getting the 727. but reading your reply here and some of your thoughts about the 727 in other threads, I may reconsider. Is it really that good? I know it aint a new addon and I once watched a startup tutorial on YT and the 2D is very plain. I love clicking things and "pulling wires", I do have some respects to the older aircraft, unlike some modern simmers who fly fully automated only..don't get me wrong, I do own Airsimmer, PMDG 737 and Qots and have had hundreds of hours but I feel like reminiscing vintage birds. So if I love LSH, will it be close to it?
October 18, 201213 yr Please forgive for intercepting, hope the Ts wouldn't mind. Hi Ian I heard nothing but good things about Dreamfleet 727. I also have read its review. Maybe this sounds a bit silly but since there are only few left in the RW, I am in doubt to invest in as I went to Maddog instead (and I am more than happy with the MD82) so I stopped thinking about getting the 727. but reading your reply here and some of your thoughts about the 727 in other threads, I may reconsider. Is it really that good? I know it aint a new addon and I once watched a startup tutorial on YT and the 2D is very plain. I love clicking things and "pulling wires", I do have some respects to the older aircraft, unlike some modern simmers who fly fully automated only..don't get me wrong, I do own Airsimmer, PMDG 737 and Qots and have had hundreds of hours but I feel like reminiscing vintage birds. So if I love LSH, will it be close to it? It really is that good my friend... It's a valid point about it being an endangered species in the real world and there are not many left flying, but it's not that many years since they were used in most of the major cargo carriers so I never feel all that "out of place" sitting in a line of Airbuses and NGX's waiting to take off in my FedEX 727-200. The 2D is maybe a little bit dated, but not much - it's definitely as good as most current payware and the VC, which was way ahead of its time, is still very immersive and totally functional including working windshield wipers (not just moving - they clear the windshield). The RXP WX radar is completely realistic - I have tested it with realtime weather and it has detected thunderstorms that I could see out my house window... There's good crew interaction in terms of speed callouts, start up, take off etc. There's just so much about it that stands out - even from outstanding products that are far more recent. And in terms of immersing you in the world of flying a previous generation of aircraft, I can only say as a former professional pilot from that time period that it really does the job... I'm not wanting to hijack the thread and certainly not knocking the TinMouse 737 which I am sure is the best answer to Harald's original question - but to me, if the goal is to fly an aircraft of that era and general characteristics of the 737-200, then the DF 727 is unbeatable Cheers Ian
October 19, 201213 yr Author Hi, many thanks for all your very helpful posts. You might also like to check out HJG at: http://www.simviation.com/hjg/main.htm LOL because I checked this site and made a strange face - and I checked my installed aircrafts and made an even more strange face - because I realized I have this plane already but I never tried to fly it. I must have forgotten that it's in my hangar waiting to be tested! A 727 in a classic Lufthansa or LAN Chile livery - that seems to be a thing of my taste... But I think I will start with the TinMouse indeed (I like the 737-200 especially because I was passenger in one of the last LAN Chile 732's in January 2007) and look, if I go further - perhaps until buying a payware aircraft - or move back to my beloved DC-6. It will depend on my skills to manage a complex jet aircraft, too; because I have to confess that with my DC-6 I play the role of an "excentric private pilot" rather than a professional airline pilot. So I should go practice with an Itek Air livery between UAFM and UAFO, friends told me strange things about safety and schedule awareness there... Regards and Thanks! Harald ... going east. (Edit: The only thing I don't like about TinMouse so far is hiding the panel in a "fsfsconv" folder instead of within the planes folder to ensure working cabin sounds.) (Edit2: @Quraisy! No problem with your post at all, quite the contrary your post and Ians answer are very welcome as there is much to learn for me at the topic of vintage jets - the only one of these planes I am a little familiar with is the Tu-134 by SCS (recommendation!!! but not easy if you have no basic russian language skills), but I abandoned it when I experienced an engine failure at final, which I wasn't able to find the reason for.) Harald Geyer Gründer der Messerschmitt Freunde Dresden v. V.
October 19, 201213 yr Timmouse is the way to go for you. 2d panel, good systems, nice model , good sound. One of the best freeware planes ever made for fs Cheers Lee Yup, she sure is! and now there's also a new model with a nice VC released for it: http://forum.avsim.net/topic/386092-you-want-a-vc/page__st__25#entry2487951 along with a complete SDK: http://forum.avsim.net/topic/386092-you-want-a-vc/page__st__25#entry2488531 for anyone who wants to improve the textures, model, etc....
October 19, 201213 yr Author OK, the TinMouse is installed, and I have choosen a nice LAN Chile livery from the 80ies. But when I see the panel I have a huge respect for this plane. (Will run the engines of my DC-6 some minutes to calm down) By the way, where can I get the checklists the Aircraft.cfg references to? It's not included in the package. Harald Geyer Gründer der Messerschmitt Freunde Dresden v. V.
October 19, 201213 yr It really is that good my friend... It's a valid point about it being an endangered species in the real world and there are not many left flying, but it's not that many years since they were used in most of the major cargo carriers so I never feel all that "out of place" sitting in a line of Airbuses and NGX's waiting to take off in my FedEX 727-200. The 2D is maybe a little bit dated, but not much - it's definitely as good as most current payware and the VC, which was way ahead of its time, is still very immersive and totally functional including working windshield wipers (not just moving - they clear the windshield). The RXP WX radar is completely realistic - I have tested it with realtime weather and it has detected thunderstorms that I could see out my house window... There's good crew interaction in terms of speed callouts, start up, take off etc. There's just so much about it that stands out - even from outstanding products that are far more recent. And in terms of immersing you in the world of flying a previous generation of aircraft, I can only say as a former professional pilot from that time period that it really does the job... I'm not wanting to hijack the thread and certainly not knocking the TinMouse 737 which I am sure is the best answer to Harald's original question - but to me, if the goal is to fly an aircraft of that era and general characteristics of the 737-200, then the DF 727 is unbeatable Cheers Ian Thank You Ian for your thoughts :smile: . Fedex still operates more than 60 727-200 however, it's quite surprises me, I knew Fedex is MD 11 heaven but they also operate 727 and DC 10 in a large numbers. Hi, many thanks for all your very helpful posts. (Edit2: @Quraisy! No problem with your post at all, quite the contrary your post and Ians answer are very welcome as there is much to learn for me at the topic of vintage jets - the only one of these planes I am a little familiar with is the Tu-134 by SCS (recommendation!!! but not easy if you have no basic russian language skills), but I abandoned it when I experienced an engine failure at final, which I wasn't able to find the reason for.) Thank You for your kindness
October 20, 201213 yr move back to my beloved DC-6 Harald will you be tempted by PMDG's offering when available?
October 20, 201213 yr Author Harald will you be tempted by PMDG's offering when available? Hi Appliance, this will depend on if it is available for FS2004. If yes - it is a must for me. If not, I have to consider the case carefully. I used FS2002 until FSX was out - then I looked at FS2004 and FSX and decided for FS2004 which I built up extensively, especially with AI traffic and sceneries from eastern Europe and CIS countries, an area what has great freeware offerings for FS2004. I never thought of changing to FSX and I think just the DC-6 will not change my attitude. So I think if PMDG's DC-6 is for FSX only then I stay with Calclassics DC-6 forever! (- which was, by the way, updated just these days, I want to say a huge compliment to Tom Gibson for his work on these great planes -) Harald PS I have to hijack my own thread now, because I checked the TinMouse yesterday and found it a little too complex for the beginning. The HJG 727 seemed more appropriate to me - at least in terms of "vintage-ness" - but I had issues with the panel, so I will try a re-install from their site. Harald Geyer Gründer der Messerschmitt Freunde Dresden v. V.
October 20, 201213 yr Author You might also like to check out HJG at: http://www.simviation.com/hjg/main.htm Mel, your reminder made my day. I re-installed the plane from the site you suggested (which, as I wrote yesterday, I did already have, but obviously in a compilation of someone who compiled it not carefully enough - with some cockpit sounds, effects and gauges missing). Some minutes ago I made my first landing. Came in too slow and therefore with a too high AOA, but it was pure fun. Without the possibility to connect GPS and Autopilot it reminds me to my Tu-134. So this is a new input to consider Ian's suggestion regarding the DF 727... So, let me thank you all again for your help! Harald Harald Geyer Gründer der Messerschmitt Freunde Dresden v. V.
October 20, 201213 yr Without the possibility to connect GPS and Autopilot it reminds me to my Tu-134 Hi Harald. I may have missed something in regards to the HJG B722 but, . . . you are correct, no GPS, but incorrect on the autopilot. There is a rudimentary autopilot accurate for that aircraft (more or less). What you have to do is either use it to navigate by using radio nav beacons, VOR, ADF to fly the headings or use the autopilot to follow ATC heading and altitude instructions as per a filed flight plan. That is also pretty much the case also for the early B732 without the Sperry 177 autopilot upgrade. BTW both the original and the Sperry 117 are available the the TinMouse B732. Most of the vintage jet liners used a similar method of part electrical and electro - mechanical system coupled with a INS. Regards, Mel P.S. I just reread your post and I did indeed misinterpret the part I quoted. You did not say you thought it did not have an autopilot - my bad. I will leave the post as is though, for anyone else who may be interested in either the HJG B722 or the TM B732. What was your weight ,speed and flap settings on final? Just curious.
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