FSX-MS Pro-Atc or Radar Contact?

[nam1394 12]

One of the biggest issues I have with PROATC-X is the inconsistencies of the verbiage between voices, particularly callsigns. This is sort of a self inflicted wound, as they provided a tool for users to add and share voice packs to the program. On the surface this is a very commendable feature. The problem is though, you lose quality control. So one voice may recognize you as "DELTA 1191" while another may say "DAL 1191" or just 1191.

This happens with PFE too. Ground will say "emirates 835" then tower will "UAE 835". This is because older voices will not recognize newer airlines like Emirates, Etihad, jetblue and others. Also, some phrases were not recorded by older voices, so another voice will be inserted to say the missing phrase. All in all, PFE is the best but it also has its shortcomings and this not the only one.

[Guest]

I only own ProATC but I would not advice it to anyone it its current state. The dev is supposed to be working on the next version but I've heard that line for over half a year now... I really doubt if he can pull it off (or even is he actually is working on it).

 

That doesn't mean ProATC is useless: when I flew the 737NGX I did use it and I liked how it assigned SIDs and STARs at the appropriate time (well, for Europe anyway) but too often I had to ignore ATC because of odd altitude assignements (having to climb to FL180 while you were already descending for approach) and because of no vectors during approach (at the end of the STAR you had to figure out yourself how to start the actual approach).

 

I agree with the remark about the voices: I only found two voices useful and the rest was rather crappy.

 

If I knew back then what I know now I would never have bought it. I only kept on using it because it would be a waste of money not to use it. Since quite a long time I am completely back to flying GA only and so I don't use ProATX at all anymore, I don't even have it installed. For GA default ATC is good enough. And I also agree with the remarks that default ATC has the best sounds and voices: the main problem with default ATC is how they vector you all over the country to get you somewhere and they don't do SIDs and STARs without workarounds. But all that is only of importance for airliners so I don't really care about that right now.

[Gregg_Seipp 571]

This is the one area of FSX that has not progressed as much as all the others.  I have RC and used it for a while, then I got VoxATC and gave it a brief shake...now I'm just back to default.  In part, the lack of progress is because the default ATC did an decent job but, apparently, has to be completely replaced in order to be improved.  You can't get rid of the redundant frequency changes, poor handling on missed approaches, mindless traffic calls, etc.  I'd think that someone would have to start developing a new ATC by replicating the OLD ATC first...and then improving it.  What would be good is to make that an open project (I'm dreaming) with places to plug in further enhancements.  I don't think a small team is going to accomplish it. 

 

One thought I had is if someone could create an ATC program that just handles operations around the airport:  VFR traffic with sequencing, practice instrument approaches, VFR arrival requesting IFR handling, SIDs, STARs, VFR transitions, Class B, C, D, and ground traffic.  Even that is a large undertaking if done well.  My hat is off to anyone that tries. 

 

In the end, the best ATC is VATSIM if you can find a controller and Pilot Edge if you're flying in the US southwest.

[mike2060 4]

MCE provides voice recognition for default ATC and RC (and PFE ?).

 

Thanks I'll check it out!

[tf51d 284]

This happens with PFE too. Ground will say "emirates 835" then tower will "UAE 835". This is because older voices will not recognize newer airlines like Emirates, Etihad, jetblue and others. Also, some phrases were not recorded by older voices, so another voice will be inserted to say the missing phrase. All in all, PFE is the best but it also has its shortcomings and this not the only one.

If you use the original voices yes, since they added limited callsigns, but if you use the voice packs only, then this is not an issue!!

[mrchrsrider 66]

+1.

 

 

Sorry but I cannot believ I just read that: IMHO uterly incorrect, sir, default ATC is HIDEOUS, it's only storng suit being routing trafficon the ground.

It's all a matter if preference, for me I like the default ATC because regardless of how horrible you think it is it still provides a complete flight from start up to shut down and sequences you with all the other traffic in FSX in the air or on the ground (what ATC is suppose to do), it also allows you to fly approaches from different IAFS if you so choose or will give you vectors to final. Radar contact in my opinion hardly sequences you with traffic, and with pro atc you don't even hear the other traffic. All of them have faults that's why I have given all three a shot but for me as far as my preference goes default ATC work just fine. If I get an itch and want a STAR/SID then ill use one of the 3rd parties but neither were worth the money.

[Sportsfan23 2]

No not chatter, that's actual ATC from AI

 

Yea turned out I think that was from another video.

Ok so it sounds like PFE is fairly close to the default ATC which while not great at least gets the job done?

[dolph98 24]

RC does not control ground traffic. Not sure about PFE. Never used that.

PFE does control ground. But better yet, it controls you - PFE GC gives you clearance to cross a runway if applicable.

I own both PFE and RC. I also have EditVoicePack to make the default ATC speak faster and have extended airline names, etc. My preferences are 1) Default since less hassle 2) PFE then 3) RC4.

I have not tried either RC or PFE with SIDs/STARs but I know PFE has the option. PFE does a better job with smaller aircraft and VFR than RC4 does (IMHO).

PFE is the most difficult to set up for a flight but it's well worth it, the voices sound natural and even accents follow the country you are flying over. Nice touch.

[Pe11e 812]

I have never saw that PFE does ground control, or clearances to cross the runway, etc. I had numerous situations with AI airliners going directly into my plane. I think the only cure for this is to use default ATC and PFE at the same time until takeoff?

[tf51d 284]

 

 

PFE does control ground.

 

No it doesn't, it only is interacting with it to provide the simulated audio responses, same as RC. FS is controlling movement. If you turn on FSX ATC you would hear the instructions to them and the AI responding to it. In fact the PFE audio instructions are actually delayed, so the AI has actually already acted on thoriginal FS ATC/AI command.

[Sportsfan23 2]

No it doesn't, it only is interacting with it to provide the simulated audio responses, same as RC. FS is controlling movement. If you turn on FSX ATC you would hear the instructions to them and the AI responding to it. In fact the PFE audio instructions are actually delayed, so the AI has actually already acted on thoriginal FS ATC/AI command.

 

From what I have gathered is the default ATC does an ok job at getting planes from point a to point b with no real added immersion. It doesn't do sid/stars but controls all the traffic on ground and in the air and keeps things moving. 

 

This is just a scenario I thought of. Say you are flying to a very busy airport and will be landing with planes in front of and behind you. Does the default ATC do a good job of managing all these different approaches or do you need one of these programs to handle those situations better?

 

Also do AI planes fly real departures and approaches or do they just take off and head for the airport they are assigned to go to?

[tf51d 284]

 

 

This is just a scenario I thought of. Say you are flying to a very busy airport and will be landing with planes in front of and behind you. Does the default ATC do a good job of managing all these different approaches or do you need one of these programs to handle those situations better?

No it doesn't but there are a couple of utilities that will keep them out of your way. The one I use is called AISmooth ver 1.2 (You can get it in the library)

Also do AI planes fly real departures and approaches or do they just take off and head for the airport they are assigned to go to?

 

No they fly straight. One of the addon ATC programs Ultimate Traffic 2 does make them follow flightplans (Not procedures)

[Ray Proudfoot 9,038]

From what I have gathered is the default ATC does an ok job at getting planes from point a to point b with no real added immersion. It doesn't do sid/stars but controls all the traffic on ground and in the air and keeps things moving.

 

Depends how you consider 'ok'. If you fly purely in the US and aren't too fussy about correct procedures then it might suit you. You will get strange vectors as you descend and approach the runway. And it only knows one transition altitude - 18000ft. If you want to fly elsewhere in the world then be prepared to compromise... heavily. It knows nothing about ICAO procedures, only FAA. But hey, it's free so you get what you pay for.

 

This is just a scenario I thought of. Say you are flying to a very busy airport and will be landing with planes in front of and behind you. Does the default ATC do a good job of managing all these different approaches or do you need one of these programs to handle those situations better?

 

None of them can do a perfect job. It's been years since I used the default but I know when I did use it I wasn't impressed. RC4 will attempt to speed up aircraft ahead of you on finals and slow down the ones behind and it does a decent job because in the thousands of flight I've used RC4 with I rarely encounter any serious problems. But if you have 100% Ai arriving at KLAX or EGLL nothing will cope with that with 100% precision.

 

Also do AI planes fly real departures and approaches or do they just take off and head for the airport they are assigned to go to?

 

They fly Great Circle Routes. Or a straight line if you prefer.

 

I'm not sure how many awards the other commercial ATC programs have won but if you look at the RC4 site you will see it picked up quite a few including a Gold Star Avsim Review. http://www.jdtllc.com

[Sportsfan23 2]

Very helpful information thank you.

[tf51d 284]

 

 

You will get strange vectors as you descend and approach the runway.

 

Actually not so strange, once you understand what it's doing.  It will vector you to a parallel coarse with the runway, but since it doesn't take wind in consideration it will give you vectors back on course once you drift more than 4nm from it's plotted course. This is what may seem strange. At about 27nm from the runway, it will torn you base (Sometimes there's a 30 degree vector right before.) At final approach clearance it will turn you 60 degrees to intercept the ILS at about a 30 degree angle. (If it's a visual you won't get clearance until you are near approach course.)  Take out the corrections for wind, and it's pretty similar to some procedure approaches I've seen.