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styckx

Resize those HD textures - [Warning pictures in post]

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Full disclosure - These screenshots are in FSX but I prepared this with using it as a suggestion for you v2 users who are seeming to suffer from OOM's more often than FSX due to the added overhead that comes w/ P3Dv2 features. A common topic lately is the obsession with HD textures.   Lots of times 4096 textures are completely unnecessary for a lot of people. So I want to show you.. With some work what losing your "HD" actually results in image quality wise.  

 

Let's take the Carenado 182T as our example..  One of these is using resize 2048 textures, and the other default 4096.. The difference is very negligible..  And this is most zoom in an average simmer will actually use. Is the 4096 worth it?

 

Answer for those who can't tell

 

 

4096 = Top / 2048 bottom

 

 

11242549024_26beceea2c_o.jpg
 

11242509095_4c854013a9_o.jpg

 

 

It isn't until you really zoom in on it do the real differences stand out...

 

4096

 

11242552516_37a193986c_o.jpg
 
2048
 
11242549594_4a4cc35bb6_o.jpg

 

Difference in file size... Now the difference in file size is where the real dramatic differences play out..  Textures with the "Copy" suffix are the originals. That's a reduction of nearly 75% in file size..  So, is what you're gaining in less overhead for the game to deal with worth the minor reduction in image quality?

 

11242634055_d722a40167_o.png
 
Now let's take this further.. I now attack the texture.common directory and resample all the 4096 textures down to 2048. These mainly consist of the interior
 
4096 interior
 
11242912343_fb782717b2_o.jpg
 
2048 interior
 
11242912643_28e2fb185a_o.jpg
 
And this time we reduced total file size of the folder by nearly 50%..  For one plane we just reduced the overhead FSX/P3D has to deal with by 60MB with minimal reduction of image quality.  If you comb through your hanger (and even scenery) and trial error your way by trimming the fat on some of these planes it might be the difference between a successful flight, or an OMM. 
 
11242823295_4234f7f9c3_o.png
 
 
 
Edit: Mods/Admins can we not lock this thread (every one in here seems locked).. I will try to help anyone who replies
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Edit: Mods/Admins can we not lock this thread (every one in here seems locked).. I will try to help anyone who replies

There is a reason why these threads are "locked..."

 

This sub-forum is set aside specifically so that one may post well-documented and/or proven "Tips" or "Tricks" for easier and quicker reference and review by our readers.

 

As such, extended discussions are really out of place, otherwise we'd wind up with another mess like what happened in the FSX "Tips and Tricks" forum. It took me months to winnow out the wheat from the chaff when I was given the task to "clean it up..." :)

 

However, since you did ask nicely, I'll leave this thread unlocked for the nonce, with the clear understanding that I may at my discretion and with no malice aforethought decide to break out my tools and winnow the chaff! :Nerd:

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Hi,

 

How many files have to be resized?. One by one for hundreds if not thousands of files would take a very long time.

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Depends on the plane.. I'm only referencing 4096 textures since they are the biggest bloat. 4096 textures aren't heavily used so you won't have hundreds thousands of them, 182T has only two per plane and there was about 6 in the common folder.

 

It is very quick and painless to resize them if you have the right tools.

 

Bill.. Thank you kind sir.. I understand you can lock it at any time. :)

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Hi Bill,

 

I see what your saying.

 

I have photoshop. Not sure about P3Dv2 texture files. Is this a simple resize and save or are other steps involved. Are there any other benefits other than reducing OOM's, For instance, will it increase performance?. <---- that would be nice.

 

 

Depends on the plane.. I'm only referencing 4096 textures since they are the biggest bloat. 4096 textures aren't heavily used so you won't have hundreds thousands of them, 182T has only two per plane and there was about 6 in the common folder.

It is very quick and painless to resize them if you have the right tools.

Bill.. Thank you kind sir.. I understand you can lock it at any time. :)

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Hi,

 

Reducing to 2048 is alright by me if it means adding additional scenery, AI aircraft, clouds or any other higher setting in the sim.

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I'll only add two things to this, one opinion and one truth:

 

Opinion: Imagetool should be used for final conversion from source to whatever your final format of choice is, without exception.

 

Truth: Always save your textures with an alpha channel, even if it is just a pure white alpha. 

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Hi Bill,

 

I see what your saying.

 

I have photoshop. Not sure about P3Dv2 texture files. Is this a simple resize and save or are other steps involved. Are there any other benefits other than reducing OOM's, For instance, will it increase performance?. <---- that would be nice.

Resize and save as DXT5 (usually) with no mipmaps.. You need to install the Nvidia DDS Tools so PS can read and save DDS. Obviously back up what you are resizing in case you don't like the results.

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Resize and save as DXT5 (usually) with no mipmaps.. You need to install the Nvidia DDS Tools so PS can read and save DDS. Obviously back up what you are resizing in case you don't like the results.

 

Actually, just FYI, DXT1 and DXT5 only differ in what is allotted to the alpha channel, the RGB channel is identical, so unless your texture actually has a gradient alpha, DXT1 is just fine. 

 

Also, never ever ever ever use DXTBMP to convert anything.

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Actually, just FYI, DXT1 and DXT5 only differ in what is allotted to the alpha channel, the RGB channel is identical, so unless your texture actually has a gradient alpha, DXT1 is just fine. 

 

I understand that..  I just like to keep it simple when explaining things out. 

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I think that, along with my CC number, I will include a link to this thread for every payware product I buy from now on   :lol:

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I am a bit confused as to what the texture size really does.  Is it related only to textures on a plane or is it also related to other textures such as ground or building/house textures?  Thanks.

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I am a bit confused as to what the texture size really does.  Is it related only to textures on a plane or is it also related to other textures such as ground or building/house textures?  Thanks.

 

I'll do my best to explain this in easy to understand terms. :) 

 

Think of texture size as a Photograph you took with a digital camera... .

 

Now.. Imagine a 1024x1024 texture is a picture you took with a 3MP digital camera.. If you printed that picture out on 8x10 paper it will look noisy, blurry, not sharp because there isn't enough "pixels" in the image to spread out over an 8x10 to keep the fidelity of the photo in place.. 

 

Now.. Imagine a  4096 texture is a 13MP camera and you take the same photo.  When you print that out on 8x10 it will be crystal clear, sharp, and vibrant. 

 

So (in essence) what we are doing here is taking that "13MP" picture and converting it down to 8MP.. An 8MP pictured printed out to an 8x10 will still look absolutely fantastic with minimial lose as compared to 13MP.. Most people would never notice the difference in everyday situations. 

 

The plane model itself (the mesh) is the 8x10 paper, and the textures are the photograph... :)

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Thanks for the explanation.  Does this relate only to plane textures or other textures as well, such as ground and building textures?

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Thanks for the explanation.  Does this relate only to plane textures or other textures as well, such as ground and building textures?

 

Mainly just planes. You could play with scenery textures but unless it's a big payware airport I don't think many use 4096 textures (I'm just guessing, I fly GA so I don't own any big airports).. But playing with texture and doing repaints has been a sick hobby of mine for years so I tend to end up all around an FS folders :) 

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Mainly just planes. You could play with scenery textures but unless it's a big payware airport I don't think many use 4096 textures (I'm just guessing, I fly GA so I don't own any big airports).. But playing with texture and doing repaints has been a sick hobby of mine for years so I tend to end up all around an FS folders :) 

 

 

That was true until FSDT and Flightbeam.

 

The default Flightbeam KIAD install is 783 MB.

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Bill.. Thank you kind sir.. I understand you can lock it at any time. :)

As you can see, instead of locking the thread, I've simply moved it back into the general P3D discussion forum.

 

Later I'll make a copy/paste of your original post back to the "Tips and Tricks" sub-forum and lock that sucker!

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Also, never ever ever ever use DXTBMP to convert anything.

 

Interesting! Why not? I usually use DXTBMP to change the windows in addon airplanes (making them (more) transparent).

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Interesting! Why not? I usually use DXTBMP to change the windows in addon airplanes (making them (more) transparent).

 

 

DXTBMP has/had it's purpose, but, in all honesty it has some of the worst compression quality of any tool you could pick, and even more importantly it does not handle alpha channels very well depending on content. I sometimes think DXTBMP might be singly responsible for most people's aversion to DXT1 textures  :lol:

 

Use imagetool for conversions and your editing tools of choice for making changes.

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How does the TEXTURE_MAX_LOAD=xxxx setting in the Prepar3d.cfg fit into this discussion? If this is set to 2048 or 1024, will this accomplish the same thing, and if not, why not?

 

Thanks,

Robert

 

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TML1024 will indeed reduce the displayed resolution, but does nothing to actually reduce the size of the texture itself.

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I always use 1024 in the sim so I might resize my textures but I really do wonder if it will make any noticable difference in performance or to avoid OOM.

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