P3D3.2 looks really good, but hesitations are really bad!

[devgrp 1,233]

Wondering if  these stutters began occurring after switching to version 3.2, from 3.1? I have avoided loading 3.2 because I have read a few posts about 3.2 micro stutters on Facebook P3D group. My 3.1 runs very smooth with a 3 year old desktop, and frankly, I am afraid to move to 3.2, because one thing I hate about a flight sim is seeing stutters. To me, stutters  ruin any kind of immersion possible. 

Micro stutters are not just isolated to 3.2. I've had then in 3.0, 3.1, and 3.2. The only disappear after I run the dxtfixer to fix missing alpha channel in some of scenery and planes

[virtualstuff 759]

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Anyway, the ANSWER to my originally posted problem:

 

It was the video driver. I installed the latest from nVidia, 364.xx.  My friend Thomas told me that the 364.xx series were bad on his system -- lower frame rates and bad stutters -- and that he'd gone back to 361.43 and it solved all that.

 

So I tried that ... and it made all the difference!

 

More testing to do, but I’m no longer getting the hesitations where I was before, the microstutters are all but gone, the frame rates are much better, and I can even re-enable MyTraffic6 traffic alongside UT2, the way I've always had it in FSX-SE!

 

Still some things to solve, and I'm still not convinced I'll stay with P3D -- the performance with heavy traffic, heavy weather and dense airports is much better in FSX-SE. But I'll try a couple of test flights over the weekend.

 

Pete

 

Pete great to hear that you solved at least one of your issues already tried HT with a correct AM?

[Pete Dowson 558]

Pete great to hear that you solved at least one of your issues already tried HT with a correct AM?

 

Yes. I think I've got all that balanced now.

 

Pete

[divermar 1]

Pete,

 

Great news that you figured it out

 

I wanted to ask about a previous post #28

 

 

 

I've just added the ability in FSUIPC to set the Affinity Mask for programs started via its "RunPrograms" options -

 

I use FSUIPC to launch other programs using the RunIF option, is this the same thing you mentioned or an updated feature and if so what is the syntax, or did I misunderstand.

 

Thank you for all your hard work

[JNS 106]

 

 

 

I think the best tweak I've applied is affinity mask of 116. This seems to use the cpu to the best efficiency. I run UT2 and after starting the sim go to task manager and assign this and all other obvious processes to core 0, leaving P3d to run on the other cores. This alone eliminates nearly all the stutters.

 

+1 on that

[ryanbatc 12,865]

In general microstutters simply means your system isn't keeping up (I know Pete already fixed his problem). On mine I have to run texture res at 1m. With it any higher its microstutter-fest 2k16!

 

It's quite odd but that's what does it for me.

 

Panning ! Yes - stutters truly rear their ugly head when I use Track IR. This is why a lot of people don't notice stutters... joystick hat switch at 30 hz hardly noticeable.... TIR unlocked fps = noticeable

 

Gosh Rob I thought my rig was ancient 2500k / gtx 970 (card not so old )

[Michael Moe 495]

+1 on that

am=116 is this with HT on or off ?

 

Never tried that combo.

 

I only have Vpilot in background on my PC .ASN on a network PC

 

Michael Moe

[JNS 106]

That's with HT on.

 

Jeff

[Pete Dowson 558]

I use FSUIPC to launch other programs using the RunIF option, is this the same thing you mentioned or an updated feature and if so what is the syntax, or did I misunderstand.

 

It is an additional feature in the RUN and RUNIF parameters, yes, but it isn't released yet. I wanted to get the documentation updated first, but I won't have time before I go on holiday next week, so I'll release it for now as an interim update (4.949j) over the weekend. Then the documentation update will only be in the Change notes document included in the Zip.

 

I've extended the number of RUN and RUNIFs it can cope with to 16 each, instead of 8, and the additional parameter is in the form

 

AM=n  for the Affinity Mask being set to 'n' (a decimal number), or

AM=Xn  for the same but given in hexadecimal (which I find clearer to see which cores are enabled).

 

Check for the update (DLL and change notes in the ZIP only) in the Download Links subforum on my Support Forum, maybe Sunday afternoon

 

Pete

[sbs9 40]

Let me share one more tip to completely kill stutters in P3D - set the monitor frequency to 30Hz in Windows (if your monitor supports it). In P3D: Target frame rate unlimited, VSync On, Triple Buffering enabled. This eliminates all stuttering if your FPS doesn't drop below 30 (strong GPU required).

[JLuis 409]

I am really thinking to go back to v3.1 too.

 

After v3.2 my performance is very bad.

 

Continuous with v3.2. No issue more.

 

Not so many microstutters, but I still get the longer (1 sec or so) hesitations. They're the only annoying things.

 

But I found the problem See later ...

 

 

No. 3.2 is the first version I felt I should try on my cockpit system. All previous versions of P3D have only been on my development system for FSUIPC work.

 

 

Answer to the first -- no, not yet. I'll see about making an new release this weekend. Some other stuff to do in it yet.

 

To the second. Hmm, I've thought about it. Nothing more yet.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Anyway, the ANSWER to my originally posted problem:

 

It was the video driver. I installed the latest from nVidia, 364.xx.  My friend Thomas told me that the 364.xx series were bad on his system -- lower frame rates and bad stutters -- and that he'd gone back to 361.43 and it solved all that.

 

So I tried that ... and it made all the difference!

 

More testing to do, but I’m no longer getting the hesitations where I was before, the microstutters are all but gone, the frame rates are much better, and I can even re-enable MyTraffic6 traffic alongside UT2, the way I've always had it in FSX-SE!

 

Still some things to solve, and I'm still not convinced I'll stay with P3D -- the performance with heavy traffic, heavy weather and dense airports is much better in FSX-SE. But I'll try a couple of test flights over the weekend.

 

Pete

 

Thanks Peter and Thomas. I got back to 361.43.  :smile:

 

For what it's worth, I have eliminated all stutters in 3.2 by doing the following, which might not work for others, and I have a very modest system with an ancient GTX 580 card and UNDER clocked i7 CPU running at 3.2 ghz.

 

For a like for like comparison initially, it is probably fair to run P3d 3.2 without HDR, cloud shadows and perhaps reduce sliders by one notch to align graphic output to the FSX equivalent, bearing in mind pop free autogen and the inherent higher detail which is bound to present a somewhat unequal comparison if you ignore these factors, all of which can be added gradually and later once a stable frame rate and stutter free performance is achieved:

 

I think the best tweak I've applied is affinity mask of 116. This seems to use the cpu to the best efficiency. I run UT2 and after starting the sim go to task manager and assign this and all other obvious processes to core 0, leaving P3d to run on the other cores. This alone eliminates nearly all the stutters. I run 0.2-0.25 fiber frame rate tweak, not 0.01 or 0.1 as very low settings are asking for blurred scenery and possibly stutters. It does result in a slightly lower frame rate but makes for smoother performance.

 

I find that aircraft complexity is a driver of potential stutters more than any other factor. For example, the otherwise excellent Aerosoft A318/319s are by far the worst provokers of stutters and I simply have to reduce detail for those to function acceptably and even then it is tough going.

 

If I run the default aircraft (eg: C172 or ported over default B737) I can run internal shadows, cloud shadows, HDR and high density everything and see barely a single stutter. 

 

ONE IMPORTANT indicator of performance lag in P3d is the delay or lag in internal VC PANNING. If there is a delay or lag in panning this is a clear predictor of stutters ahead, even if the frame rate appears to not degrade. As soon as I see panning less than completely smooth I know I should tone down the sliders or remove shadow detail or some other performance hit. It works every time. I can't stress this enough. If you see the slightest reluctance in panning side to side in the VC that is a very clear indicator that your graphics are struggling. 

 

With less demanding aircraft I can run with Vsync on and the motion is utterly smooth with no tears and not the slightest stutter except brief moments when new scenery is loading. I cannot run Vsync with the Aerosoft A319 or other graphically demanding aircraft. Nevetheless if I can get a stutter free performance on a now relatively old system I feel others could achieve the same. Another very important aspect is Texture Bandwith. I never run more than 50 or 60, and find the default 40 perfectly ok. Raising this to 80 or 120 does not return any advantage but higher-spec systems might manage better.

 

I always tweak in reverse. ie: I do not start with everything on full tilt then tone things down. I start with everything sparse and everything else switched off, then gradually introduce complexity step by step until I see a performance lag or stutters then adjust accordingly. One final thing. I find that matching MSAA with SGSS works very well. For example if I run the internal MSAA at 2x then I also run Sparse Grid SS at 2x. I find mismatching the two results in a greater likelyhood of stutters and degraded shimmering. In fact running MSAA 2x and SGSS at 2x results in less shimmering than MSAA at 4x and SGSS at 2x, or vice versa.

 

Hope that helps.

 

Thanks Rob! Now I use MSAA at 2x and SGSS at 2x too.  :smile:

 

Thanks for all information. Now I can fly without stutters. Very nice performance. I am happy!

[divermar 1]

It is an additional feature in the RUN and RUNIF parameters, yes, but it isn't released yet. I wanted to get the documentation updated first, but I won't have time before I go on holiday next week, so I'll release it for now as an interim update (4.949j) over the weekend. Then the documentation update will only be in the Change notes document included in the Zip.

 

I've extended the number of RUN and RUNIFs it can cope with to 16 each, instead of 8, and the additional parameter is in the form

 

AM=n  for the Affinity Mask being set to 'n' (a decimal number), or

AM=Xn  for the same but given in hexadecimal (which I find clearer to see which cores are enabled).

 

Check for the update (DLL and change notes in the ZIP only) in the Download Links subforum on my Support Forum, maybe Sunday afternoon

 

Pete

 

Outstanding, thank you for including that update.

 

Enjoy your holiday

[hesynergy 67]

Let me share one more tip to completely kill stutters in P3D - set the monitor frequency to 30Hz in Windows (if your monitor supports it). In P3D: Target frame rate unlimited, VSync On, Triple Buffering enabled. This eliminates all stuttering if your FPS doesn't drop below 30 (strong GPU required).

I preface this with the understanding that I am happy to be shown the error in my thinking,…

 

But...thanks to the idiot(s) that dropped the system specs from our profiles, I have to ask what are YOUR specs?

 

 

Regards,

Chas

[sbs9 40]

I preface this with the understanding that I am happy to be shown the error in my thinking,…

 

But...thanks to the idiot(s) that dropped the system specs from our profiles, I have to ask what are YOUR specs?

 

 

Regards,

Chas

980Ti + 4790K at 4500MHz, but the key to successfully utilize 30Hz approach is to establish a balance between YOUR hardware and P3D settings to maintain 30 FPS.

[jabloomf1230 2,445]

but the key to successfully utilize 30Hz approach is to establish a balance between YOUR hardware and P3D settings to maintain 30 FPS.

 

 

No truer words were ever posted here or anywhere else, but that also applies to a 60 Hz refresh rate. No tweaks or other silliness are needed to make P3d run smoothly, except the above advice. People don't like this type of advice because it's both easy to understand and expensive. Either one has to come to grips with the fact that one's hardware can't handle maxed out settings or one has to go out and buy  new hardware. 

 

This goes for XP10 also. And I can't wait until "the end of the year" when the DTG Flight Simulator is released and people make the same blunders with it also.