Just to re-iterate that on the four core leaving HT disabled and No AM presents a very good setup for the sim and can only be beaten by a few percent with HT enabled.

 

Hi, Steve.  Just wanted to clarify something.  I normally run with AM=116, HT on.  It so happens that on my particular Asus MB, Maximus VIII Hero, I can't turn off HT in the BIOS (I probably would have chosen another MB for the purpose of experimentation if I had known this first).  So, as I understand it AM=85 (and AM=14, I believe) are like having HT turned off.  My question is:  Is this exactly like turning off HT in the BIOS or just a "reasonable facsimile"  workaround?

 

Thanks,

Jeff

Yes Jeff, looking at four core HT enabled with AM=85=01,01,01,01 there's a one (unmasked) in each comma separated pair (core). With P3D the sim starts up and counts these ones, makes a fixed thread on each of the corresponding Logical Processors. Each to do a particular job, underlying these jobs P3D spawns over 50 threads across these unmasked LPs. More work is done on these as SimConnect clients are handled, and when more dlls are loaded.

If there are four available LPs the sim will split into its optimum number of parts, where the main job of rendering is concerned is at its leanest. They do other stuff but I'm dumbing it down a little. We can add more ones to the mask and the sim splits into more parts, these extra parts go toward boosting the loading speed of scenarios up to a point. If they are on cores already with a sim job, a one in the pair, they share that core and run into each other eventually, so more physical cores is better.

With AM=85 or some value representing one unmasked LP per core, i.e. 170, the sim works exactly the same as it does with four straight HT disabled cores and no NoAM=AM=0=15=1111 in this case. (How the AM is interpreted is up to the sim, after then it passes its desired affinity setup to the jobscheduler for it then assigns threads to LPs as these processes spawn new threads.)

With your 116 it is interesting because it leaves the first core free, LP0 and LP1 of core zero, like a hole for addon activity to fall into. AM=116=01,11,01,00 core zero on right. This unmasks one LP of core 1, and one LP of core 3. But the pair unmasked on core 2 happen to be different types of job and they don't ask for maximum throughput together, most of the time, remember that these share a core. So 116 is kind of a magic number that helps avoid issues, but in the end it does only use three cores.

Using all four cores means that there will be activity from addon exe processes sharing the cores of the sim. When HT is enabled that's a good start since two threads on an HT enabled core finish faster than the same two threads on a non-HT core.

How much extra can we get from four cores over three on a 4GHz class CPU? Maybe around 5% stability and 10% loading speed.


Once the sim is set up, managing where addon exe apps start, their affinity, is a good way to help the sim get along uninterrupted.
 

Hi, Steve.  Just wanted to clarify something.  I normally run with AM=116, HT on.  It so happens that on my particular Asus MB, Maximus VIII Hero, I can't turn off HT in the BIOS (I probably would have chosen another MB for the purpose of experimentation if I had known this first).  So, as I understand it AM=85 (and AM=14, I believe) are like having HT turned off.  My question is:  Is this exactly like turning off HT in the BIOS or just a "reasonable facsimile"  workaround?

 

Thanks,

Jeff

I've got the same board and I'm sure you can turn it off/on

Cheers

Chris

Thanks very much for the reply, Steve.  I'm probably just getting down to nitpicking, but curious all the same.

 

Chris, thanks for the reply.   I had looked everywhere I could think of in the BIOS and couldn't find anything.  Then I called Asus Tech.Supt. twice and both times they said that board did not provide for turning HT on/off in the BIOS.  Actually, a lesser Asus MB I have on another machine can turn HT on/off in the BIOS.  That's what surprised me.   If you have done this yourself, would you please let me know where the setting is and what Asus calls it?

 

Thanks,

Jeff

Thanks very much for the reply, Steve.  I'm probably just getting down to nitpicking, but curious all the same.

 

Chris, thanks for the reply.   I had looked everywhere I could think of in the BIOS and couldn't find anything.  Then I called Asus Tech.Supt. twice and both times they said that board did not provide for turning HT on/off in the BIOS.  Actually, a lesser Asus MB I have on another machine can turn HT on/off in the BIOS.  That's what surprised me.   If you have done this yourself, would you please let me know where the setting is and what Asus calls it?

 

Thanks,

Jeff

 

If you motherboard is the one in your sig, Maximus VIII Hero, thats the one I have you certainyl can turn HT on or off.

 

It is under CPU Configuration, You will see speedstep, turbo boost, Hyper Threading. Simply select enabled or disabled. Go to your AI Tweaker page or whatever it is called. Make sure to not be in EZ mode, go to advanced.

Well, thanks guys. i found it. I think the way things appeared on my screen I didn't see to scroll on down in the CPU Configuration. That's all I can figure. Almost missed it again this time. Of course, it didn't help when Asus people twice gave me wrong information on their product.

 

Again, thanks. I feel much better now.

Jeff

Hi Jeff, we have more or less the same rig.

I suggest you give my settings a try.

Who knows? :-)

Yes Jeff, looking at four core HT enabled with AM=85=01,01,01,01 there's a one (unmasked) in each comma separated pair (core). With P3D the sim starts up and counts these ones, makes a fixed thread on each of the corresponding Logical Processors. Each to do a particular job, underlying these jobs P3D spawns over 50 threads across these unmasked LPs. More work is done on these as SimConnect clients are handled, and when more dlls are loaded.

 

 

Hey Steve, you seem very knowledgeable regarding AFs. What would you recommend for a 5960x with both HT on and off? 

What would you recommend for a 5960x with both HT on and off?

Remember that four cores gives the best rendering performance, and more than four improves the scenery loading speed.

 

So for example with HT On and utilising six cores, enable six LPs 00,00,01,01,01,01,01,01=1365 and make sure all addons are above LPs 0 and 1.

 

If you want to increase loading speed a little more you can try 01,01,01,01,01,01,01,01=21845 and make sure all addons are above LPs 0 and 1, maybe start all addons on 10,10,00,00,00,00,00,00=A000Hex.

 

Similarly with HT Off try four cores 00001111=15, six 00111111=63, or eight AM=0 and start addons on LPs 6 and 7.

 

 

If you don't pay attention to addon exe apps affinity, then start the sim above core zero instead, 11110000=240, 11111100=252. Addons should end up mostly in LPs 0 and 1.

Folks, just a reminder, with your permission.

This thread intends to present another vision of tweaking, without HT and AM.

I don't say I am right, I just share my findings with those who have similar hardware.

:wink:

Remember that four cores gives the best rendering performance, and more than four improves the scenery loading speed.

 

So for example with HT On and utilising six cores, enable six LPs 00,00,01,01,01,01,01,01=1365 and make sure all addons are above LPs 0 and 1.

 

If you want to increase loading speed a little more you can try 01,01,01,01,01,01,01,01=21845 and make sure all addons are above LPs 0 and 1, maybe start all addons on 10,10,00,00,00,00,00,00=A000Hex.

 

Similarly with HT Off try four cores 00001111=15, six 00111111=63, or eight AM=0 and start addons on LPs 6 and 7.

 

 

If you don't pay attention to addon exe apps affinity, then start the sim above core zero instead, 11110000=240, 11111100=252. Addons should end up mostly in LPs 0 and 1.

 

Thank you for the detailed reply, Steve

 

Right now, I'm running with HT off as I'm testing the claim that disabling HT decreases VAS usage in P3D. So by your numbers, AM=0 would be 'full utilization' and be the 'best' option for my 8 physical cores in terms rendering performance / scenery loading speed, given the application gets most of the rendering time on all cores, that is? Then use something like Process Lasso to change the affinity of addons and other 'non-critical' software to the last two cores? Given the utilization I'm seeing with default settings, which is basically Core 0 at 80%+ usage when playing, rest of the cores at a more latent 30-40%, would that also indicate the default is based around AM=0?

 

I heard you want to use core zero, as skipping that might introduce additional terrain blurries.

 

Folks, just a reminder, with your permission.

This thread intends to present another vision of tweaking, without HT and AM.

I don't say I am right, I just share my findings with those who have similar hardware.

:wink:

 

I do agree with your notion, that a 'clean' config is usually the way to go. That seems to have provided me with the best result. I was just curious to see the difference between a properly configured AM and whatever the game uses by default. Given what Steve is saying, the numbers I've been using have been way off.

I remember the big thread on this before.

 

I may try FXAA and MSAA in sim to see what it looks like. But your monitor is much better than mine. 

 

Affinity Mask

 

From Steve's big thread previously I started running AM=116 in P3D with a 4790k. I then have a batch file to start ASN on perhaps AM=85 I can't remember. 

 

Things have been pretty good. My textures take a while to transition from blurry to sharp if I pan around in spot view sometimes. Not sure if that has anything to do with HT being ON

Things have been pretty good. My textures take a while to transition from blurry to sharp if I pan around in spot view sometimes. Not sure if that has anything to do with HT being ON

 

If you're using OrbX stuff, that might be why. Lots of reports of that exact behaviour since they updated their libraries and FTX central. 

Thank you for the detailed reply, Steve

 

Right now, I'm running with HT off as I'm testing the claim that disabling HT decreases VAS usage in P3D. So by your numbers, AM=0 would be 'full utilization' and be the 'best' option for my 8 physical cores in terms rendering performance / scenery loading speed, given the application gets most of the rendering time on all cores, that is? Then use something like Process Lasso to change the affinity of addons and other 'non-critical' software to the last two cores? Given the utilization I'm seeing with default settings, which is basically Core 0 at 80%+ usage when playing, rest of the cores at a more latent 30-40%, would that also indicate the default is based around AM=0?

 

I heard you want to use core zero, as skipping that might introduce additional terrain blurries.

 

 

I do agree with your notion, that a 'clean' config is usually the way to go. That seems to have provided me with the best result. I was just curious to see the difference between a properly configured AM and whatever the game uses by default. Given what Steve is saying, the numbers I've been using have been way off.

 

I will try with HT OFF and AM=0 and report ;-)

If you're using OrbX stuff, that might be why. Lots of reports of that exact behaviour since they updated their libraries and FTX central. 

That would make sense then. Thanks! It's only ever the ground textures.