Chock

For those of you who like the Avro Vulcan...

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Yeah, Alan they previewed that screen at their stand at Cosford 2017.

I'm still waiting for their VC-10 to see light of day, and I don't mean the FSLIte version that they are proposing to roll-out.

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Yup, I'm looking forward to their VC-10 too, although I am a little wary of that given that it is being made by Aeroplane Heaven, whose output can be a bit hit and miss as you probably know. When Aeroplane Heaven makes a good add-on, which they certainly do on occasion, then it is really good, i.e. their B17F for example which is excellent and especially for the price, but when they make a not so brilliant one, i.e. their C-46, which is in dire need of some love from a patch to improve its flight characterisitcs; these are, at present, nothing more than a lazy and badly-tweaked DC-3 flight model applied to a different 3D model in the sim, then it ends up being really disappointing, especially when that 3D model of the C-46 itself is so good.

However, I'm pleased to note that this forthcoming Vulcan is an in-house development from JF themselves, and as we know, pretty much every recent one of those has been spectacularly good. If any developer can make a decent Vulcan, it will be the bunch from Just Flight, since pretty much everyone in the UK knows that thing like the back of their hand and has seen them fly loads of times and in many case been on one too. That's certainly true for me, since there is one preserved just a few miles from my house and I went to see the thing make its last ever flight over Woodford a couple of years ago and have seen it fly loads of times over the years too. As such, this one is likely to be a no-brainer day one purchase for me, as it will be for probably most Brit flight nuts, as the Vulcan is like an old friend to us all. Let's hope the VC-10 turn out to be one of Aeroplane Heaven's good ones too eh?

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Had a Vulcan in FS9 which wasn't bad if I remember correctly. It was a boxed product and I am inclined to think it was from Just Flight but whether they were the developers is another matter. The FS9 one did a reasonable job in reproducing that wonderful Vulcan sound (more of a howl really) which sticks in my head from seeing it at airshows over the years. Good to know the in-house team at Just Flight is developing this but it would have been even better if they were also developing the VC-10 themselves.

Bill

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1 hour ago, Chock said:

As such, this one is likely to be a no-brainer day one purchase for me,

Having serviced them in the RAF, I too am looking for a P3DV4 offering. Nearest to nirvana I have come is the Iris Simulations model, but that had issues of nose-diving.

Aeroplane Heaven-produced VC-10? Oh, no. That is as bad as being told it will initially be an FSLite model !

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2 minutes ago, Christopher Low said:

Have Just Flight stated that the VC10 will be an FSLite model?

They told me that at Cosford when they were showing off their VC-10 there.

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Odd aircraft in that AFAIK there is no ejection seat for bombadier

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I could be wrong here, Chris, so Chock with his depth of knowledge of aviation history may shed more light, but during my RAF days I was told the reason they did not have ejection seats was because as they were the UK's premier nuclear deterrent and as such the aircrew were expected to deliver the final deterrent so.................I'll leave out the obvious.

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Now, I like the Vulcan, I do, but at the risk of being burnt at the stake I prefer the look and lines of the Handley Page Victor.. a different design to deliver the final deterrent (as was the Vickers Valiant).

Years later the Vulcan & Victor were again doing similar jobs, but this time as tanker aircraft (Victor more so than Vulcan. Not sure if a Victor ever tanked from a Vulcan, but they certainly did it the other way round!)

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There were a few reasons not all the crew had ejector seats on the Vulcan...

First up, technology; when the Vulcan (and indeed all three of the V-Bombers) were developed, much of their design was stepping into new territory with regard to making pressurised aeroplanes which could fly at high mach numbers, but which could still have enough openings in the skin to allow ejector seats to be launched.

Anyone who knows about the failures of the first variants of the deHavilland Comet will know that was largely due to a lack of understanding about the stresses on the fuselage integrity any holes in the fuselage put on a pressurised craft, and so the idea of putting enough holes in the fuselage of those V-Bombers to allow all the crew members to eject was problematic, even if they were prepared to spend the money to solve such an issue. That was another reason incidentally, the cost of making an aeroplane where all the crew could eject was greater, so they went with the idea of some of the crew having to manually bail out in a manner similar to a WW2 bomber. Yet another reason for it, was that the V-Bombers were all intended to be nuclear strike force bombers for an all out war against an enemy most thought would be the Soviet Union, in which case it would have been likely that the bombers bases would be destroyed if they did manage to return, or they would be intercepted, but hopefully after having delivered their bombs. So it was generally regarded that it would be quite likely to be a one way trip anyway if you were a crew member of one of those V-Bombers.

The idea of manually bailing out of a Vulcan seems improbable to me, anyone who has ever clambered into one of those things will know it's bloody hard to do that even when it is parked on the ground, you smack your head on all kinds of stuff when you do so, and it's horribly claustrophobic in a Vulcan cockpit too. The notion of being able to get out of one when it is tumbling out of control at near supersonic speeds in questionable at best, and as far as I'm aware, the crew members without ejection seats simply accepted that fact.

We tend to think that aircraft in the 50s and 60s were sophisticated, and they were in some ways, but there was still much which was being learned, as evidenced by the failure to understand the stresses of pressurisation well in the case of the DH Comet and in the case of one of the V-Bombers - the Vickers Valiant - the use of some aluminium grades in its construction which led to inter crystalline corrosion in the wing spars after just a few years in service. But it wasn't only this which was an issue, obviously the inability to furnish those V-Bombers with ejector seats for all the crew was another problem, although it was certainly not the only group of aircraft with that issue, both the Lockheed F-104 Starfighter and the Boeing B-52 resorted to having downward firing ejector seats to get around issues of construction and pressurisation, and needless to say, this precluded any chance of ejecting from a take off or landing accident or even a low level incident. I think I'd have preferred to take my chances on manually bailing out over a downward firing ejection seat.

It seems this is a problem which is not totally gone too, apparently there are some issues with safe ejection from Lockheed Martin's new F-35 too which they are currently trying to resolve.

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Strange how most fighters around the world these days have properly working ejection systems and have had such systems for decades.... yet... F-35.....  It's not like they have to clear a single, monolithic fin and rudder like they do on a Tonka (Tornado).

The Victor had 2 ejection seats for the pilots, but the rest of the crew had to bail out of the main door.

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I think it's the Gen III helmet system on the F-35 which is contributing to the issue with it: it weighs a little bit more than the previous fancy flight helmets, and although it is only a few ounces more owing to it having a souped-up NV camera, the increase in weight is just enough to put more strain on a pilot's neck during some ejection scenarios.

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