Alcides Segovia

Trueglass (Fog) Preview

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Preview in the TFDI forums. Really excited to see this.

Also noticed that they restructured the pricing. It went from being 3% of all previous sales to $2100 for the project. Still free for freeware. 

 

Again can’t  wait to see this in action. 

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I haven’t been following this at all. Any idea if they’re selling this to PMDG by any chance?

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12 minutes ago, Drumcode said:

I haven’t been following this at all. Any idea if they’re selling this to PMDG by any chance?

I should think PMDG would develop their own version, I know that's what Aerosoft said they would be doing. I know it's pretty impressive, but any developer worth their salt can probably create their own similar effect and wouldn't then be tied to a licence agreement.

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16 minutes ago, Chock said:

I should think PMDG would develop their own version, I know that's what Aerosoft said they would be doing. I know it's pretty impressive, but any developer worth their salt can probably create their own similar effect and wouldn't then be tied to a licence agreement.

$2100 is probably peanuts compared to the cost of developing your own solution from the ground up. Particularly if you're a low model volume producer like PMDG, FSL or QW.

That's like a week's salary for a skilled c++ programmer. No way you could provide a turn-key solution in a week.

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57 minutes ago, odourboy said:

$2100 is probably peanuts compared tot he cost of developing your own solution from the ground up. Particularly if you're a low model volume producer like PMDG, FSL or QW.

If you're a developer and you intend making more than one add-on in the future, then it's a couple of grand off the costs of each subsequent add-on to have your own solution rather than use a TPD solution in preference.

I know it looks impressive, but really, it's not rocket science in terms of development, especially now LM have put support in P3D for rain effects; sure you need some decent artwork for it, but that's true for all the other bits of your aeroplane too. For icing and fog on a window, it's a few textures with an alpha channel for transparency, loading in sequence and triggered by a sim parameter. I could knock up the artwork for that in an hour or so, as could any half decent Photoshop user; if I was developing aeroplanes for FS and it was a choice between that and paying someone two grand for the privilege, I know which choice I'd go for.

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2 hours ago, odourboy said:

$2100 is probably peanuts compared to the cost of developing your own solution from the ground up. Particularly if you're a low model volume producer like PMDG, FSL or QW.

That's like a week's salary for a skilled c++ programmer. No way you could provide a turn-key solution in a week.

My thoughts precisely, chump change especially since it's already developed. 

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11 hours ago, warriorpilot said:

Also noticed that they restructured the pricing. It went from being 3% of all previous sales to $2100 for the project. Still free for freeware. 

Where you got this information from? I couldn't find it on their forums.

Best Regards,
Simbol

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11 hours ago, Chock said:

I should think PMDG would develop their own version, I know that's what Aerosoft said they would be doing. I know it's pretty impressive, but any developer worth their salt can probably create their own similar effect and wouldn't then be tied to a licence agreement.

Hmm what about RAAS ? Also no rocket science and you would think, PMDG could devlop it themselves... or Aerosoft. Yet it is licensed for all of their planes.

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3 hours ago, simbol said:

Where you got this information from? I couldn't find it on their forums.

Best Regards,
Simbol

It’s on the blog post for TFDI. Last week I checked it and it was 3% of current sales for an existing project. Now it’s just a flat fee. I like that pricing better if I were a developer. 

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Just now, warriorpilot said:

It’s on the blog post for TFDI. Last week I checked it and it was 3% of current sales for an existing project. Now it’s just a flat fee. I like that pricing better if I were a developer. 

I can't find this on their forums, I must be lost, can you send me a link privately please?

Thanks,
Simbol

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1 minute ago, simbol said:

I can't find this on their forums, I must be lost, can you send me a link privately please?

Thanks,
Simbol

 

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2 hours ago, officercrockey said:

Hmm what about RAAS ? Also no rocket science and you would think, PMDG could devlop it themselves... or Aerosoft. Yet it is licensed for all of their planes.

Well without knowing how much or what was involved in such a deal then we can't say, although if I had to make an educated guess, I would say it would be the result of some kind of contradeal, so not the same thing.

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1 hour ago, warriorpilot said:

It’s in their blog not forums.https://tfdidesign.com/TrueGlass.php 

Thanks found it:

Compatibility and Requirements

TrueGlass is compatible with the following environments.

Lockheed Martin Prepar3D v4.X on Windows Vista and later (x64)


The following items are requirements for TrueGlass.

Access to the source model of the aircraft implementing TrueGlass

DirectX June 2010 runtime

Microsoft Visual Studio 2015 Runtime (x64)

Pricing

TrueGlass is available under the following pricing models.

For products released as freeware or at no cost to the receipient of the product, TrueGlass is free to use.

For a commercial product, TrueGlass is available for $2100 USD.

Volume discounts may apply if licensing multiple technologies simultaneously. 
Additional licensing options may be available upon request. 


Interesting facts reading they requirements, now If I was PMDG I wouldn't be happy to give my aircraft source model to another company that also make planes.. if I was an add-on plane developer that would be a deal breaker for me.

Regards,
Simbol

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15 minutes ago, simbol said:

Thanks found it:

Compatibility and Requirements

TrueGlass is compatible with the following environments.

Lockheed Martin Prepar3D v4.X on Windows Vista and later (x64)


The following items are requirements for TrueGlass.

Access to the source model of the aircraft implementing TrueGlass

DirectX June 2010 runtime

Microsoft Visual Studio 2015 Runtime (x64)

Pricing

TrueGlass is available under the following pricing models.

For products released as freeware or at no cost to the receipient of the product, TrueGlass is free to use.

For a commercial product, TrueGlass is available for $2100 USD.

Volume discounts may apply if licensing multiple technologies simultaneously. 
Additional licensing options may be available upon request. 


Interesting facts reading they requirements, now If I was PMDG I wouldn't be happy to give my aircraft source model to another company that also make planes.. if I was an add-on plane developer that would be a deal breaker for me.

Regards,
Simbol

I'm not sure thst you're interpreting that requirement as intended (though I completely agree that if you did need to turn your model source over to TFDi to enable the technology, it would be a non starter )

I suspect what they are saying is you'll need you add a layer to your cockpit glass with some specific materials settings in your source model in order to enable trueglass.

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1 minute ago, odourboy said:

I'm not sure thst you're interpreting that requirement as intended (though I completely agree that if you did need to turn your model source over to TFDi to enable the technology, it would be a non starter )

I suspect what they are saying is you'll need you add a layer to your cockpit glass with some specific materials settings in your source model in order to enable trueglass.

Well that sentence reads to me as: "We need access to your aircraft source model".

Regards,
Simbol

 

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11 minutes ago, simbol said:

Well that sentence reads to me as: "We need access to your aircraft source model".

Regards,
Simbol

 

Not to start a bun fight here, but nowhere does it say "We". Perhaps a poor choice of phrasing on their part, but again, my interpretation is that you'll need to make changes to your model source to support Trueglass, so "you" need access to it, not "we". I.e., you can't implement Trueglass without changing your model source.

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Just now, odourboy said:

Not to start a bun fight here, but nowhere does it say "We". Perhaps a poor choice of phrasing on their part, but again, my interpretation is that you'll need to make changes to your model source to support Trueglass, so "you" need access to it, not "we". I.e., you can't implement Trueglass without changing your model source.

I see your point but of course I would have access to it if I developed it lol.

If it doesn't mean what I believe it does they should rephrase it as it sends the wrong message.

Regards,

Simbol

 

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48 minutes ago, simbol said:

If I was PMDG I wouldn't be happy to give my aircraft source model to another company that also make planes.. if I was an add-on plane developer that would be a deal breaker for me.

Regards,
Simbol

You misunderstand. Once licensed, the developer is given access to the SDK to install it themselves. The licensee does not send their proprietary source model to TFDi. :cool:

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It does dispel any notion of some tweaker adding Trueglass to somebody else's add-on, but I totally agree that the requirement phasing could be better!

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1 hour ago, simbol said:

Interesting facts reading they requirements, now If I was PMDG I wouldn't be happy to give my aircraft source model to another company that also make planes.. if I was an add-on plane developer that would be a deal breaker for me.

Obviously there are legal documents that could address any concerns that the purchasing party may have. Anyways, I guess the bottom line is that we all desire to have the rain and fog effects in the PMDG's products. I'd hope they're working on something right now as if the TG gets released, they're already behind on current technology. I'd be very pleased with an update to the T7 and 73N's. :)

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2 hours ago, simbol said:

Interesting facts reading they requirements, now If I was PMDG I wouldn't be happy to give my aircraft source model to another company that also make planes.. if I was an add-on plane developer that would be a deal breaker for me.

Regards,
Simbol

Yup, I could see where that might be a bit problematic for some developers.

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As a company that has a license to use this, I can straight up tell you that we don't have to send TFDi our models.  We just have to add the "code" to the material for the glass. Fairly easy.

@Chock.  It's not art work.  It's code.  The fog is based in code and not artwork.  So it's really REALLY fast and with almost no overhead. So, sure, other devs COULD spend the money and the time and the effort to dev their own... But, as someone who actually already DID the dev on our night lighting tech that works in a similar manner to this, it's not as easy as you seem to think.  It took nearly a year to get it right... and it cost a HUGE amount of money as well.  

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28 minutes ago, Milviz said:

As a company that has a license to use this, I can straight up tell you that we don't have to send TFDi our models.  We just have to add the "code" to the material for the glass. Fairly easy.

@Chock.  It's not art work.  It's code.  The fog is based in code and not artwork.  So it's really REALLY fast and with almost no overhead. So, sure, other devs COULD spend the money and the time and the effort to dev their own... But, as someone who actually already DID the dev on our night lighting tech that works in a similar manner to this, it's not as easy as you seem to think.  It took nearly a year to get it right... and it cost a HUGE amount of money as well.  

Fair enough. So is the code calling a particle effect, or a texture?

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