snake3321

North America waypoint?

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Hello, today on my flight departing from Chicago Simbrief gave me curious air waypoint which I've never seen before. The waypoint is IGN084037. How can I write this into the FMC and navigraph route please?

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Posted (edited)

It appears Simbrief is in error because there is no such waypoint name, but more info is needed please:

Which airport?

List the whole plan?

Destination?

Which FMC what plane?

The closest possible point is the IGN VOR Radial 084 at 37 NM in the State of New York

 

 

Edited by pracines

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24 minutes ago, pracines said:

It appears Simbrief is in error because there is no such waypoint name, but more info is needed please:

Which airport?

List the whole plan?

Destination?

Which FMC what plane?

The closest possible point is the IGN VOR Radial 084 at 37 NM in the State of New York

 

 

So my departure is KORD and arrival airport is EHAM.

Theres my route: KORD/10L DCT IGN084037 DCT WHALE N75A SUPRY NATU XETBO DCT LIFFY Q37 MALUD UL975 WAL M16 DOLAS L603 LAMSO LAMS2A EHAM/06

When entering my route into the FMC I found that NATU isnt working too. I'm flying on pmdg 777.

 

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IGN is a VOR, not really sure what the numbers mean. Maybe a heading and distance? I don't know.

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Posted (edited)

I get IGN as Kingston VOR 117.60 as well, heading from KORD is 087 degrees true and 629 NM

Edited by Matthew Kane

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The "waypoint" is a Place Bearing Distance - IGN VOR, 084° at 37NM
In the FMC type in - IGN084/37

More info is here --> https://support.precisionmanuals.com/kb/a59/fmc-custom-waypoint-entry-notes.aspx

NATU = North Atlantic Track Uniform with SUPRY as the entry & XETBO as the track exit.

SUPRY 46/50 48/40 50/30 52/20 LIMRI XETBO   *valid for flight levels  320 330 340 350 360 370 380 390 400
FMC entry for the lat/lon points would be 4650N 4840N 5030N & 5220N

This link is the only one I've found with the eastbound tracks included.
https://blackswan.ch/northatlantictracks

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I believe the official source for NATs is https://www.notams.faa.gov/common/nat.html

Also, at https://skyvector.com/ you can see the tracks overlaid on the aeronautical chart (select “layers”) and, if you left click on a track it will list the waypoints.

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13 hours ago, snake3321 said:

So my departure is KORD and arrival airport is EHAM.

Theres my route: KORD/10L DCT IGN084037 DCT WHALE N75A SUPRY NATU XETBO DCT LIFFY Q37 MALUD UL975 WAL M16 DOLAS L603 LAMSO LAMS2A EHAM/06

When entering my route into the FMC I found that NATU isnt working too. I'm flying on pmdg 777.

 

There is no doubt that this plan is flawed. 

I used to use Simbrief as well, but I switched to PFPX. Simbrief is still a very nice service, don't get me wrong.

To compare exact same results for today AIRAC 1806:

Simbrief -

KORD RAYNR BRTMN DNIKA TAAYZ PETTY PECOK NOTAP YYB ANCER TUDEP 52N050W 53N040W 54N030W 55N020W VENER KOKIB CON LIFFY UL975 WAL M16 DOLAS L603 LAMSO LAMS2A EHAM

Not a valid NAT for today

PFPX -

KORD ORD DCT PMM DCT ECK DCT YYZ DCT CERAW DCT ATENE Q907 MIILS N361B LOPRO N331B ELSIR NATR NETKI DCT NIBOG DCT REMSI L603 BELOX DCT BUKUT L603 LAMSO LAMS2A EHAM

NAT R is valid for today

I think the issue with Simbrief is the NAT track info is not current or more likely it does not have NAT info, and it tries to use current Flight Aware plans and gets confused. But like I said all in all if you have a current AIRAC and do a little research, with some editing, Simbrief is very good. 

The official source for NAT's is https://pilotweb.nas.faa.gov/common/nat.html

PFPX stays current (NOAA,NATS,PACOTS,AUSOTS,NOTAMS) as long as you pay the subscription fee. http://www.flightsimsoft.com/pfpx/

 

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That plan definitely came from Flightaware. I’ve seen numerous flight routes that started with such PBD-waypoint on Flightaware. I’m not sure why, but my guess is that it might be related to aircraft being vectored on departure instead of following a published departure procedure.

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Just a quick correction if I may:

On 6/16/2018 at 10:32 AM, pracines said:

The issue with Simbrief is the NAT track info is not current or more likely it does not have NAT info, and it tries to use current Flight Aware plans and gets confused. But like I said all in all if you have a current AIRAC and do a little research, with some editing, Simbrief is very good.

This is incorrect, SimBrief does update NAT tracks, NOTAMs, and weather on a regular basis (every few minutes actually), without the need for any subscription fee. This information is all freely available on the internet after all.

It should be noted that there is no absolute requirement to file a NAT track when crossing the Atlantic.  Just like real world airlines, you will occasionally see SimBrief propose an off-track routing (officially referred to as a Random Route) defined as a sequence of custom lat/long waypoints (for example, TUDEP 52N050W 53N040W 54N030W 55N020W VENER KOKIB)

As far as routes go, SimBrief does try to use FlightAware routes whenever possible. Generally, this tends to give the best results as FlightAware routes are sourced from the real world and therefore should comply with any restrictions and preferential routings. Lately, there has been an increase in routes that begin with either a PBD (Place/Bearing/Distance) waypoint or a custom Lat/Long. I don't know why FlightAware has started altering routes like this, but Marc's theory on vectoring sounds logical. I'm going to look into identifying, filtering, or correcting these routes prior to including them in SimBrief.

I'd like to also note that you can always select one of the other Suggested Routes on SimBrief if you don't like the default route it proposes. Generally there are up to 5 different route suggestions you can choose from. You can also generate your own custom route from scratch by using the "Route Finder" tool on the Dispatch Options page, which gives options to enable, disable, or force a specific NAT track depending on your preferences.

Hope this helps!

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