Take a look at those gems - C47 and DC3

[ComSimPilot 623]

They look amazing. The systems description on the page is not very explanatory. Anyone with previous experience with Aeroplane Heaven, can comment on what extent it compares with lets say PMDG or A2A in systems simulation? 

[TopGun33 124]

28 minutes ago, ComSimPilot said:

They look amazing. The systems description on the page is not very explanatory. Anyone with previous experience with Aeroplane Heaven, can comment on what extent it compares with lets say PMDG or A2A in systems simulation? 

So I got the DC-3 only. Randomly :

- the plane comes with 4 navigation options : radionav (VOR and ADF) ; Flight1 GTN750 + Rex/Milviz Weather Radar ; Flight1 GTN650 + Sperry autopilot (the same as the A2A Connie) and the freeware sextant addon (I thought this was an excellent idea). This package is well integrated and should please everyone. I have not tried to replace the F1 GTN with the RXPs (yet).

- the 3D model is beautiful. The cockpit textures are awesome, and the PBR is very well done. It has the A2A Rain Effects too.

- the cockpit animations are also very good. The needles shake depending on the engine power output and flight regime.

- sounds good too.

- she is very stable in flight. The Sperry autopilot is of good help, but she's quite easy to maintain stable with the trims. Performance wise, I'm still trying to see if the figures are respected (relation between RPM, power output and cruise speeds etc ) but unfortunately the manual is very light on this subject. I had to dig out another DC-3 manual on the internet. The good news is that so far the figures seem to check out. Clearly, there's been a lot of work done here.

I'm not rated on the DC-3 so I won't comment on handling, except that it seems to match the numerous cockpit videos you can see on the internet.

- the engine startup may seem difficult at first, but it is in the end quite easy to manage. The landing gear is another story ha ha

- it does not seem to be as advanced as the Accusim products in term of engine wear, hangar management, let's say what I'd call persistent mode.

Overall, I am pleased with it, it seems rather complete. I still need time for a definitive opinion but as a first view, if you are a classic propliner fan, I think she's good to go.

Edited April 5, 2020 by TopGun33

[ComSimPilot 623]

Thank you very much for the extensive report Guillaume. It certainly helps. It seems I will get it sooner or later : ) 

[Patco Lch 1,480]

2 hours ago, Treetops45 said:

I think you are referring to the Freeware Manfred Jahn version?

Not the payware Aeroplane Heaven just released?

I have the Freeware & find it excellent & was wondering if the AH payware is equal, better or way better ?

T45

Sorry.🙂

[Ron Attwood 3,499]

Freeware is a bit of a misnomer. It's payware but without a price tag. If you spent 40 (put you preferred currency here) on it you'd feel you'd got a bargain....Seriously.

[Treetops45 1,083]

33 minutes ago, Ron Attwood said:

Freeware is a bit of a misnomer. It's payware but without a price tag. If you spent 40 (put you preferred currency here) on it you'd feel you'd got a bargain....Seriously.

Slightly losing the plot here.

I assume Ron you are talking about Manfred's masterpiece?

Agreed, easily payware quality. Sets a high bar. There are quite a number of Freeware aircraft about that are better than some payware.

I was wondering if someone had the MJ & the AH & had compared them & what they thought.

Patco - no problem.

T45

[Chock 17,769]

I've bought it and will be doing a video review of it this week. I figured it was probably not a bad idea to do this because it is a bit on the pricey side for an Aeroplane Heaven add-on, which are usually nearer the thirty quid mark as opposed to being pretty much twice that (i.e. it cost me 72 Euros, which is somewhere around the region of 64 quid I think). So I'll be covering it in detail and letting people decide for themselves whether they think it's worth the price of entry.

As I say, look out for that video review later this week. Incidentally, the download is in three parts (two for the DC-3 and one for the C-47), totaling about 3.5Gb, and it came down the pipe real slow too; that's probably courtesy of the Covid pandemic affecting bandwidths.

Edited April 5, 2020 by Chock

[edpatino 1,979]

1 hour ago, Ron Attwood said:

Freeware is a bit of a misnomer. It's payware but without a price tag. If you spent 40 (put you preferred currency here) on it you'd feel you'd got a bargain....Seriously.

Any chance of a repaint for this magnificent plane?.

Cheers, Ed

[Ron Attwood 3,499]

1 hour ago, edpatino said:

Any chance of a repaint for this magnificent plane?.

Cheers, Ed

You know full well I've done a load of paints for the Manfred Jahn C-47. All on AVSIM library.  

[Ron Attwood 3,499]

2 hours ago, Treetops45 said:

I was wondering if someone had the MJ & the AH & had compared them & what they thought.

Me. AH is OK but lacking 'life'. MJ Top notch. It's hard to see why there is a question.

EDIT: To be fair the AH I bought on Julius Caesar's recommendation. Maybe the latest issue is better.

Edited April 6, 2020 by Ron Attwood

[SolRayz 392]

2 hours ago, Chock said:

I've bought it and will be doing a video review of it this week. I figured it was probably not a bad idea to do this because it is a bit on the pricey side for an Aeroplane Heaven add-on, which are usually nearer the thirty quid mark as opposed to being pretty much twice that (i.e. it cost me 72 Euros, which is somewhere around the region of 64 quid I think). So I'll be covering it in detail and letting people decide for themselves whether they think it's worth the price of entry.

As I say, look out for that video review later this week. Incidentally, the download is in three parts (two for the DC-3 and one for the C-47), totaling about 3.5Gb, and it came down the pipe real slow too; that's probably courtesy of the Covid pandemic affecting bandwidths.

Please link your review videos here when completed! Or what is your youtube channel? 

[AnkH 2,282]

Just watched the engine startup video and already found several things I do not like (in comparison to MJ rendition). I wonder if this was just the video or if the actual plane is really like this:

- you need the GPU for engine startup. I have seen a lot of startups of a DC-3 in modern days, never ever was a GPU like the one shown in the vid used. Mostly, no GPU at all was used...

- the run up where you count blades is way to fast. The MJ propeller turns much slower and steadily, and this is how it looks like in reality.

- the starting sequence is to fast. Same as for the spinnging by the starter, the engine basically instantly starts. Very little smoke. And the sound does not seem right neither.

Could anyone already owning this bird shed some light on the engine startup? Is it really as shown in the video or a little closer to reality (or what I think is)?

[Chock 17,769]

1 hour ago, AnkH said:

Just watched the engine startup video and already found several things I do not like (in comparison to MJ rendition). I wonder if this was just the video or if the actual plane is really like this:

- you need the GPU for engine startup. I have seen a lot of startups of a DC-3 in modern days, never ever was a GPU like the one shown in the vid used. Mostly, no GPU at all was used...

- the run up where you count blades is way to fast. The MJ propeller turns much slower and steadily, and this is how it looks like in reality.

- the starting sequence is to fast. Same as for the spinnging by the starter, the engine basically instantly starts. Very little smoke. And the sound does not seem right neither.

Could anyone already owning this bird shed some light on the engine startup? Is it really as shown in the video or a little closer to reality (or what I think is)?

That they use a GPU is not incorrect, in fact it is actually not a bad idea to use a starter cart on a DC-3 these days. An airworthy DC-3 could now be over 80 years old. That's getting on a bit. Now of course one maintains the engines on any vintage machine, but the Pratt and Whitney R-1830 Twin Wasp engine is an engine which can be damaged if you don't take care of it, and that includes being kind to it when you start it. This means a few things.

Like most radial engines, if the aircraft has been stood for any length of time, it suffers from oil dripping down into the lower cylinders, especially on older engines where the tolerances are loose. This means two things: The upper cylinders may not have much lubrication, so you want to do something about that, and the lower cylinders could potentially be hydraulically locked, although with those loose tolerances on things, it would be reasonably unlikely unless the thing had been stood for weeks.

So, to avoid bending a crankshaft from trying to turn the engine with a cylinder full of fuel/water/oil, you can slowly turn the prop through some revolutions by hand to check if there is a lock, and if there is you can bleed it out. With that sorted, you next need to consider the oil getting to the moving parts before the engine fires up and starts heating up because you don't want to be grinding metal on a vintage engine.

And this is where a starter cart comes in...

You invariably see engines on things such as DC-3s, B-17s etc being cranked on the electric motor starter for a good few revolutions before they are engaged, to have them fire from the inertia of rotation when there is a spark present. But, and here's the problem, you only get a few goes at that if you are starting from a battery, which is fine if your engine is warm and oiled and such, but if it is not, you need to pre-oil it by rotating the engine on the starter for lots of revolutions and that will use up the battery quickly. This means people are inclined to fire up the engine before it really is properly oiled because they are concerned that they might run out of battery juice. BUT, if you use an electrical starter cart, you can pre-oil that thing with as many rotations as you like because you're not going to run out of electrical power, and that means you can treat your engine better than if you're rushing to start it for fear of not being able to because of a flat battery.

As far as smoke is concerned, how much smoke you're going to get from an engine depends upon its condition, how you pre-oil it and how you start it. Some old engines will be leaking a lot of oil through seals and so there'll probably be a lot of smoke out of the manifold when it cranks up. Others might no be inclined to smoke very much at all if things are in better shape.

Anyway, as noted, I will be doing a full review of the Aeroplane Heaven DC-3/C-47 and I will be honest about it, if it sucks/is great, I will say so because I bought it, as is the case with all my video reviews, i.e. it's not a freebie review copy whereby I have to blow sunshine up the developer's wazoo because I got it for nothing.

in the interim, here is a DC-3 starting on a ground cart and an explanation of why they do so with their old bird...

 

[AnkH 2,282]

Nice video and thanks for the explanations. The video also shows that those propeller spin way to fast in the Aeroplane Heaven video... Really waiting to buy this bird until I checked your review, already thanks for doing this.

[markadeane 274]

Couple of observations. Not sure where AH does their support, as I see no link to a forum. If there is one, perhaps someone could kindly point me at it?

Summary: I really like it! There are, however, some things that might need polishing.

 

- Texturing is amazing all round, but I notice some speckling on the flight deck windows once you're moving, and on the right side window you can make out the reflection of the engine. It's almost as if the external reflection is showing up on the inside of the pane?

- On the external model, the spinning prop blade blur is visible at all times. Even with engines off, you can see the stationary prop blades and also the blur disc.

- White tail light is always on, even with aircraft de-powered.

- The engine sound is quite 'tinny' to my ears, and suffers from considerable phasing, especially on the ground. Also engine RPM sound appears to be tied to the MAP setting and not the RPM itself.

- Performance is buttery smooth from the 30 minute flight I took.

- The flight model is excellent and one of the best hand-flying models I've encountered. Feels very stable and is very easy to fly hands off.

- The Sperry autopilot works really well. I do wonder of the pitch index control dial should be labelled L and R though, and not UP and DN, or similar?

- The gear operation is going to take quite some time to get used to, though that's hardly a fault, it's just... idiosyncratic, shall we say?

- I am a little confused about the blower high and low settings. I was in the cruise at 4000ft, 30" MAP with the blowers in HI. I switched them to LOW and then re-set 30" MAP. The aircraft then performed better at the equivalent power setting, Perhaps this is a misunderstanding on my part of how the blowers impact on engine performance at lower levels?

 

Interested in everyone's thoughts, and whether anyone else is seeing the same as me above?