6 hours ago, jarmstro said:

It's also unusable for most Windows users because of the fps hit. 

Most windows users entire machine cost less than my GPU.

As Rafiki would say

The path to inner peace begins with 4 words

Not my ___ problem

Edited February 15, 20215 yr by mSparks

10 hours ago, tonywob said:

I can see the point that many say about just sticking to one platform such as Windows, but in the case of X-Plane, Mac OS is quite a chunk of their customer base (I'm one of them). Sadly, being multi-platform in this instance is causing problems, especially for third-party devs.

Would be nice if Laminar hired at least one specialized developer each for MacOS, Windows and Linux to test for and solve compatibility issues.

Vulkan on Linux is still inop with some plugins when using an AMD GPU and fixing things driver-side is a real uphill battle because the open source driver devs have more pressing issues to attend to and the proprietary AMD drivers that Laminar advises to use are awful and therefore seldomly used.

And I demand a proper, public issue tracker starting with XP12. That "fill out this low-tech form and wait for an e-mail reply from us" method is so 1990s.

Edited February 15, 20215 yr by Bjoern

6 hours ago, mSparks said:

Not my ___ problem

Oh, it very much is your problem. LR would be crazy not to prioritise Windows users who make up, by a good margin, the majority of its customers at present and for the foreseeable future. Geeks notwithstanding for whom XP is their only option AFAIK.

Edited February 15, 20215 yr by jarmstro

4 hours ago, jarmstro said:

who make up, by a good margin, the majority of its customers at present

Hate to break the news to you, but this hasnt been true since XP10, the last version of xplane to run well on cheap windows boxes. 

windows is dated now, Microsoft havent had a test team for like 7 years, and the last major updates were windows game bar in 2019 (which ironically makes games slower), and switching to chromium last year after internet explorer failed.

It was you who pointed out most of them dont even have the hardware needed for xenviro, Laminar would be crazy to prioritise selling even more demanding graphics to them. It only made sense for microsoft because of xbox series x (hence them not prioritising VR or multiple monitors)

Cant "pirate" expensive hardware..... the oiks are the ones left without options.

All that is why I asked you what you think "nicer" actually looks like. Because if it wont run on a $900 laptop you can forget it.

OTOH, if they went for the PS5 market.....

Edited February 16, 20215 yr by mSparks

Windows and Mac will be the focus of XP development in the foreseeable future.

I am happy for everyone who gets good results on Linux, but just like with every product out on the market, the sum of all attributes makes up the perceived value.

If you have a car that is extremely fast it will still not be popular if it only starts up when the temperature is above 20C, can carry only one person or needs Vodka for fuel.

Linux is the same, it excells in certain regimes, but lacks severly in others. That is why its market share is abysmal and that is why developers target more widespread operating systems. Which in turn hurts it´s popularity.

Kinda the same situation that we fear for X-Plane, where third-party devs would turn and go to MSFS because of superior user numbers. Or as we say: "The fish has to like the worm, not the fisherman."

1 hour ago, Janov said:

Windows and Mac will be the focus of XP development in the foreseeable future.

I am happy for everyone who gets good results on Linux, but just like with every product out on the market, the sum of all attributes makes up the perceived value.

If you have a car that is extremely fast it will still not be popular if it only starts up when the temperature is above 20C, can carry only one person or needs Vodka for fuel.

Linux is the same, it excells in certain regimes, but lacks severly in others. That is why its market share is abysmal and that is why developers target more widespread operating systems. Which in turn hurts it´s popularity.

Kinda the same situation that we fear for X-Plane, where third-party devs would turn and go to MSFS because of superior user numbers. Or as we say: "The fish has to like the worm, not the fisherman."

I suspect we wont see Carenado ever again they found a bucket to fill. As for linux, great on my old laptop, but for te haverage user it sint not friendly enough. Though install is getting easier getting some things to work still relies on the hold dos stuff.

Edited February 16, 20215 yr by mjrhealth

14 hours ago, mSparks said:

Most windows users entire machine cost less than my GPU.

As Rafiki would say

The path to inner peace begins with 4 words

Not my ___ problem

That doesnt say much, most PC users in general know very little about them.

1 hour ago, mjrhealth said:

That doesnt say much, most PC users in general know very little about them.

Which is PC's biggest problem (needing to know all about it to make it work) and why Linux has dominated software sales for the last 5 or 10 years.

In fact dominated is probably to mild, completely obliterated would be more apt, consumer alone is expected to hit $407.31 billion by 2026, and that's its small market. I'd be surprised if windows software is reaching even $1Bil these days.

Even Microsoft switched office over to a linux service. Linux platforms are now the largest portion of their ~$140Bil entire revenue.

Edited February 16, 20215 yr by mSparks

1 hour ago, mSparks said:

Which is PC's biggest problem (needing to know all about it to make it work) and why Linux has dominated software sales for the last 5 or 10 years.

In fact dominated is probably to mild, completely obliterated would be more apt, consumer alone is expected to hit $407.31 billion by 2026, and that's its small market. I'd be surprised if windows software is reaching even $1Bil these days.

Even Microsoft switched office over to a linux service. Linux platforms are now the largest portion of their ~$140Bil entire revenue.

Can you be more specific what do you mean by it has dominated software sales ? which softwares ? 

 

1 hour ago, mSparks said:

Which is PC's biggest problem (needing to know all about it to make it work) and why Linux has dominated software sales for the last 5 or 10 years.

In fact dominated is probably to mild, completely obliterated would be more apt, consumer alone is expected to hit $407.31 billion by 2026, and that's its small market. I'd be surprised if windows software is reaching even $1Bil these days.

Even Microsoft switched office over to a linux service. Linux platforms are now the largest portion of their ~$140Bil entire revenue.

 

X-Plane usage data

 

 

2 hours ago, mSparks said:

Which is PC's biggest problem (needing to know all about it to make it work) and why Linux has dominated software sales for the last 5 or 10 years.

In fact dominated is probably to mild, completely obliterated would be more apt, consumer alone is expected to hit $407.31 billion by 2026, and that's its small market. I'd be surprised if windows software is reaching even $1Bil these days.

Even Microsoft switched office over to a linux service. Linux platforms are now the largest portion of their ~$140Bil entire revenue.

Server market but not PC market, because its good for techy people not the average Joe, and besides its free, for us not so techy people, so its not really a market when you dont have to pay for it.

3 hours ago, peroni said:

 

X-Plane usage data

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure this data is for desktop only.

you can't be selective in this case a) money still goes to the same pocket (Laminar)  2) both desktop and mobile version share most of xplane code, different products but really not 2x time, probably was less.

hence, if you add the XXXXXX users that have xplane on their mobile, assuming android/linux kernel and mac, windows might be the the lowest one, we need the mobile data to get the wider picture here.

add more to it if we are also looking at "the future", this includes any possible on-app market by LR if they intend to do so, in this case it might also mean A lot to 3pds.

Edited February 16, 20215 yr by akita

36 minutes ago, akita said:

I'm pretty sure this data is for desktop only.

Yes desktop only. Also XP11 only, no previous versions.

39 minutes ago, akita said:

hence, if you add the XXXXXX users that have xplane on their mobile, assuming android/linux kernel and mac, windows might be the the lowest one, we need the mobile data to get the wider picture here.

That's a whole another interesting discussion, we don't have any data for XP Mobile except for the many hints on how the income from glomo funds the desktop version.
I admit to have tried the mobile app both on android and apple devices and got bored after 5 minutes.

11 hours ago, mSparks said:

Hate to break the news to you, but this hasnt been true since XP10, the last version of xplane to run well on cheap windows boxes. 

windows is dated now, Microsoft havent had a test team for like 7 years, and the last major updates were windows game bar in 2019 (which ironically makes games slower), and switching to chromium last year after internet explorer failed.

It was you who pointed out most of them dont even have the hardware needed for xenviro, Laminar would be crazy to prioritise selling even more demanding graphics to them. It only made sense for microsoft because of xbox series x (hence them not prioritising VR or multiple monitors)

Cant "pirate" expensive hardware..... the oiks are the ones left without options.

All that is why I asked you what you think "nicer" actually looks like. Because if it wont run on a $900 laptop you can forget it.

OTOH, if they went for the PS5 market.....

OK I give in. I'll try Linux as a dual boot OS. (I have an unused SSD drive.) I googled and looked but can't fathom which to install as there seems to be several versions but there is little info about which does what.

Which free version would you recommend I install for a novice user as a replacement for Windows? Click, auto Install and go a necessity.

16 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

OK I give in. I'll try Linux as a dual boot OS. (I have an unused SSD drive.) I googled and looked but can't fathom which to install as there seems to be several versions but there is little info about which does what.

Which free version would you recommend I install for a novice user as a replacement for Windows? Click, auto Install and go a necessity.

You can use ubuntu 20 , it will install it along side windows so no hassle with partition creation etc.. there are quite a few decent distros. I have been using Ubuntu , for browsing / watching movies etc.. its great , for gaming not much 

But if you are going to install on a separate drive then select that drive as a bootloader in Ubuntu or whichever distro during  installation

Edited February 16, 20215 yr by HumptyDumpty