People shouldn't assume what the problem is from either side, but first step is to do a minimal config flight (and I don't mean "minimal" just by MSFS config), I mean completely minimal in every way possible. Fresh reboot, don't load anything, ensure there is nothing running beyond what a fresh vanilla MSFS install uses. Absolutely no addons running either, in game or otherwise. Don't even install any GPU temp monitor yet, NO A/V software, nothing from the marketplace (no scenery/airports/world updates). 

If it's not a 6800 XT issue or driver issue, nothing is OC'd, then it's probably a memory problem or an external USB fault issue. I would also unplug all USB devices and try flying from keyboard only temporarily.

That said, I cannot imagine 4 different PC's having CTD issues in a vanilla config, but with addons, sure. Well, there are a few internal vanilla config CTD's, for instance on the KingAir 350, every now and then when playing with switches (specifically the GPS), it can cause a CTD. That is the only one I know of atm, I'm sure there are a few more, but vanilla CTD's are rare.

As far as programmers trying to solve this, well some programmers are better at this kind of issue than others. I have been in both programming and networking side of things, and IMHO -- you just have to keep trying to isolate the issue, but swapping out the RAM is a good bet. Some RAM/MB/GPU combo's do not PLAY right even when everything is set correctly, this is usually a Motherboard bug. Try using only recommended RAM from MB list. If it still doesn't work, maybe MSFS issues with AMD, but I kind of doubt it honestly (it's possible though). Also, you may want to read the list of potential firmware issues on your MB site.

Edited May 7, 20215 yr by Alpine Scenery

4 hours ago, Alpine Scenery said:

That said, I cannot imagine 4 different PC's having CTD issues in a vanilla config, but with addons, sure. Well, there are a few internal vanilla config CTD's, for instance on the KingAir 350, every now and then when playing with switches (specifically the GPS), it can cause a CTD. That is the only one I know of atm, I'm sure there are a few more, but vanilla CTD's are rare.

As far as programmers trying to solve this, well some programmers are better at this kind of issue than others. I have been in both programming and networking side of things, and IMHO -- you just have to keep trying to isolate the issue, but swapping out the RAM is a good bet. Some RAM/MB/GPU combo's do not PLAY right even when everything is set correctly, this is usually a Motherboard bug. Try using only recommended RAM from MB list. If it still doesn't work, maybe MSFS issues with AMD, but I kind of doubt it honestly (it's possible though). Also, you may want to read the list of potential firmware issues on your MB site.

You must think of me as a retard then, having tons of stuff in my community folder or running lots of simconnect programs and then complaining about stability issues.
I can assure you that when I am testing why these CTD's occur, my community folder is empty. Even removing official (marketplace) addons does not make a difference. I tested for memory issues and lowered memory speed and relaxed timings etc to no avail. Even if it was the memory, it is unlikely that all 4 machines have issues.stability.

I don't want to steal this thread away from Bobsk by putting my problem forward (there is another topic somewhere in history on this site on my issues) so what I write below is just an attempt to show that these issues some of us have with MSFS is much more complicated than just "your hardware must be faulty".

My first CTD's with MSFS occured in August, but they gradually got worse with every patch/update, until around the December update, after which I can hardly complete a flight. Since then most of my flights are repeating the same routes in different hard/software configurations. Can't say I enjoy flightsimming much because of it, but at least I am simulating the job of most airline pilots who also fly the same route on a regular basis. Off course, they don't have to cope with CTD's😁

The machine is stable with everything I throw at it. Off course, MSFS is unlike most other software: Most heavy programs stress either the CPU or memory, most games stress just the GPU. Rarely do they all three at once. Most flightsims, and MSFS is no exception, are quite unique since they stress all of these at the same time and on top of that make use of lots of (USB) peripherals.

After much testing I have a likely cause but no solution yet. Most of my tests I try to keep the settings similar, so the same route, same aircraft etc.
If I fly with just the keyboard and mouse, CTD's are pretty rare regardless of addons and simconnect clients that are running.

Flying with just a USB single controller OK. With just the yoke or quadrant, I can fly mostly without CTD's. With both connected, CTD's are more likely and earlier in flight but still pretty rare.
With just rudders connected I often get a CTD, but usually much later in flight. I have tried both my old CH rudders and new MFG crosswind, and they both increase the chance for a CTD significantly. Combining rudders with yoke and/or quadrant is almost guaranteed a CTD, and they happen usually earlier in flight too.

The weird thing is, it does not matter which rudder I am using: my old CH Pro rudders affect the chance for a CTD as much as my new MFG Crosswind!

On all 4 machines, the only constant are the USB devices that I use so they are likely related to the cause of the CTD's. I ruled out USB hubs and any other USB device (webcams etc) except my flight controllers.
There is one other constant though that I have not yet mentioned: my Xbox profile is synced with the cloud. Even after a fresh installation (Windows/MSFS) this profile is downloaded from the Xbox cloud and it includes settings for my controllers, even controllers I am no longer using. I gleaned these settings are stored in c:\Users\xxxx\AppData\Local\Packages\Microsoft.FlightSimulator_8wekyb3d8bbwe\SystemAppData\wgs\000901FB94F5029A_00000000000000000000000069F80140\ folder.

At first removing these old controllers after MS synced these seemed to decrease the chance for CTD's but that was only temporarily. I've read that controller profiles without assignments (containing NULL values) can cause CTD's. Unfortunately, the default profile for my both yoke and MFG crosswind have no assignments at all since MSFS does not have offer these yet and these cannot be changed.

So while I cannot guarantee it is not computer it is highly unlikely and since I tried lots of hints, suggestions, settings and configurations I am quite at a loss. I can understand Bobsk8's frustration with MSFS, even though the cause for our issues could be very different. MSFS stresses a PC unlike most other software. Even software designed to stresstest a system rarely stress all parts at the same time and do not test the impact of USB devices. Add MSFS into the mix, which is still in its infancy with bugs even Asobo does not understand. What does not help is that the eventlog for most people are very similar even though the circumstances of the CTD's are different. That either means it's a generic error message for "we don't really know what happened" or deep down below in the code of MSFS there is a bug that ties these issues together even tough on the surface things are different. Something like a buffer overflow perhaps. Or it could just be hardware.

9 minutes ago, orchestra_nl said:

My first CTD's with MSFS occured in August, but they gradually got worse with every patch/update, until around the December update, after which I can hardly complete a flight. Since then most of my flights are repeating the same routes in different hard/software configurations. Can't say I enjoy flightsimming much because of it, but at least I am simulating the job of most airline pilots who also fly the same route on a regular basis. Off course, they don't have to cope with CTD's😁

The machine is stable with everything I throw at it. Off course, MSFS is unlike most other software: Most heavy programs stress either the CPU or memory, most games stress just the GPU. Rarely do they all three at once. Most flightsims, and MSFS is no exception, are quite unique since they stress all of these at the same time and on top of that make use of lots of (USB) peripherals.

I never said your hardware must be faulty, I specifically said people should not assume either way. I do not know, was just throwing out general advice. Since this is just the Internet and I do not know anyone, no idea on anyone's particular skill or what they have or have not tried. That's a long post, I'll try to finish reading it later.

I'm sure it's very frustrating, at this point I'd probably bite the bullet and buy an extra copy, try a fresh profile with the "other provider", hence Steam if using Microsoft, or Microsoft if on Steam. No idea to be honest, hard to say.

Edited May 7, 20215 yr by Alpine Scenery

53 minutes ago, orchestra_nl said:

You must think of me as a retard then, having tons of stuff in my community folder or running lots of simconnect programs and then complaining about stability issues.
I can assure you that when I am testing why these CTD's occur, my community folder is empty. Even removing official (marketplace) addons does not make a difference. I tested for memory issues and lowered memory speed and relaxed timings etc to no avail. Even if it was the memory, it is unlikely that all 4 machines have issues.stability.

I don't want to steal this thread away from Bobsk by putting my problem forward (there is another topic somewhere in history on this site on my issues) so what I write below is just an attempt to show that these issues some of us have with MSFS is much more complicated than just "your hardware must be faulty".

My first CTD's with MSFS occured in August, but they gradually got worse with every patch/update, until around the December update, after which I can hardly complete a flight. Since then most of my flights are repeating the same routes in different hard/software configurations. Can't say I enjoy flightsimming much because of it, but at least I am simulating the job of most airline pilots who also fly the same route on a regular basis. Off course, they don't have to cope with CTD's😁

The machine is stable with everything I throw at it. Off course, MSFS is unlike most other software: Most heavy programs stress either the CPU or memory, most games stress just the GPU. Rarely do they all three at once. Most flightsims, and MSFS is no exception, are quite unique since they stress all of these at the same time and on top of that make use of lots of (USB) peripherals.

After much testing I have a likely cause but no solution yet. Most of my tests I try to keep the settings similar, so the same route, same aircraft etc.
If I fly with just the keyboard and mouse, CTD's are pretty rare regardless of addons and simconnect clients that are running.

Flying with just a USB single controller OK. With just the yoke or quadrant, I can fly mostly without CTD's. With both connected, CTD's are more likely and earlier in flight but still pretty rare.
With just rudders connected I often get a CTD, but usually much later in flight. I have tried both my old CH rudders and new MFG crosswind, and they both increase the chance for a CTD significantly. Combining rudders with yoke and/or quadrant is almost guaranteed a CTD, and they happen usually earlier in flight too.

The weird thing is, it does not matter which rudder I am using: my old CH Pro rudders affect the chance for a CTD as much as my new MFG Crosswind!

On all 4 machines, the only constant are the USB devices that I use so they are likely related to the cause of the CTD's. I ruled out USB hubs and any other USB device (webcams etc) except my flight controllers.
There is one other constant though that I have not yet mentioned: my Xbox profile is synced with the cloud. Even after a fresh installation (Windows/MSFS) this profile is downloaded from the Xbox cloud and it includes settings for my controllers, even controllers I am no longer using. I gleaned these settings are stored in c:\Users\xxxx\AppData\Local\Packages\Microsoft.FlightSimulator_8wekyb3d8bbwe\SystemAppData\wgs\000901FB94F5029A_00000000000000000000000069F80140\ folder.

At first removing these old controllers after MS synced these seemed to decrease the chance for CTD's but that was only temporarily. I've read that controller profiles without assignments (containing NULL values) can cause CTD's. Unfortunately, the default profile for my both yoke and MFG crosswind have no assignments at all since MSFS does not have offer these yet and these cannot be changed.

So while I cannot guarantee it is not computer it is highly unlikely and since I tried lots of hints, suggestions, settings and configurations I am quite at a loss. I can understand Bobsk8's frustration with MSFS, even though the cause for our issues could be very different. MSFS stresses a PC unlike most other software. Even software designed to stresstest a system rarely stress all parts at the same time and do not test the impact of USB devices. Add MSFS into the mix, which is still in its infancy with bugs even Asobo does not understand. What does not help is that the eventlog for most people are very similar even though the circumstances of the CTD's are different. That either means it's a generic error message for "we don't really know what happened" or deep down below in the code of MSFS there is a bug that ties these issues together even tough on the surface things are different. Something like a buffer overflow perhaps. Or it could just be hardware.

I bought a powerd USB hub (8 USB ports all used)and everything is now pluged into that, and that is conected to just 1 USB 2.0 on the PC. You could try that if you have not already.

Edited May 7, 20215 yr by Nyxx

1 hour ago, Nyxx said:

I bought a powerd USB hub (8 USB ports all used)and everything is now pluged into that, and that is conected to just 1 USB 2.0 on the PC. You could try that if you have not already.

Done that. I am using a 10-port powered USB 3.0 hub with mechanical on/off switches for each device for a while now. It makes testing easier since before I had to unplug everything all the time. Used 2 different USB 2.0 hubs before that, both powered off course. Thanks for the suggestion though.

I retired as a The training Director for one of the largest Worldwide Electronic Companies in the World. In that position, my primary job was training component level technicians, in the Broadcast Industry, Commercial Video Industry, The Military,  on a weekly basis,all over North America, Canada, as well as some classes in Mexico. My training included many hours of troubleshooting and repairing highly complex computer controlled Video Display devices that cost up to a Million Dollars .  

So the few that are lecturing me on how I should go about troubleshooting a problem that many people are having with this software, always blaming the computer, are frankly getting to be really annoying. They act like I have spent the last few months not trying every suggestion I have read both from the forums I read every day as well as suggestions made by th Asobo people themselves on their website. Guess what, none of these suggestions have solved anything. The reason I started this thread was to ask if anyone had any luck reinstalling MSFS, or was it just a waste of time. Some posted that it had helped them, and on the MSFS forum, many said they had reinstalled , a few , more than once, and nothing changed. Well guess what , I reinstalled MSFS and some things did change. I got my blue progress bar back. The music that plays when the program loads, started dropping out much less than it was before.  The 530 GPS now loads the flightplan every time, so that I don't have to restart it once after starting a flight to get the FP to load into the GPS. That tells me that there were things that were not correct in the last install, along with the various "updates" that were piled on top of the original install.

I also found out that the JF Arrow 3, the only thing in my Community folder, is way more prone to causing a CTD than the Carenado Mooney. Yesterday I flew 4 different  hundred mile flights to different airports,  in the Mooney with no problems. Prior to that, every flight I flew with the Arrow had a CTD, or an AMD driver timeout. The CTDs occur  mostly within 30 miles of landing. I didn't remove the Arrow from the Community Folder, I just left it there to see what effect it would have if I just didn't fly it.

Now I am getting a new GPU from  the PC manufacturer, and frankly I think the only thing that will solve is the driver Timeout AMD driver issue. My guess is after I replace the GPU, and fly the Arrow 3 again, within a few flights, I will have a CTD. Asobo has had the CTD problem on their list of things to fix, as number 3 I believe ,  and basically they are still working on it with no apparent solution in sight.  

 

By the way, the AMD driver issues have been known for years, and many users of AMD cards have this problems, so I doubt if the replacement GPU will solve this issue. 

 

Edited May 7, 20215 yr by Bobsk8

8 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

By the way, the AMD driver issues have been known for years, and many users of AMD cards have this problems, so I doubt if the replacement GPU will solve this issue. 

So if you so PC savy and you know that AMD driver have issues and has done for years and you say you get AMD driver time outs (CTD) it beggars belief you did not go for a the rock solid nvidia card. Your right your new card might not make one bit of diffrence. I love you that even with your pased being " training Director for one of the largest Worldwide Electronic Companies in the World" you thought a AMD card was the way to go and even link a vid to show how all that knowledge you thought an AMD card was the way to go.

"AMD driver timeout" so when you coming into land and you say " how can a PC know when am coming into land?" lol it does not but it sure as hell knows when its sudenly needs it GPU to work a lot harder loading in airports/ground detail etc. and what...AMD driver timeout! 

@Bobsk8 The video says it all.. just go "green" Bob .. which is NVIDIA. I have a RTX 2070 Super .. no issues. Not a SINGLE CTD since August last year. Side note : I just fly GA [all types] and on occasion the Cessna Longitude.

Good luck and I sincerely hope the replacement GPU brings you happy simming.

Greetings

Edited May 7, 20215 yr by SAPilot

I don't doubt anyone's background, many of us come from long technical backgrounds. I go all the way back to the Apple II and 386/486 as my first build. I have installed networks consisting of hundreds to a thousand or so PC's, and used to run very large web sites, and I then switched to video processing software and went back into programming (as I started).

None of our backgrounds really matter, we were just trying to help. As experienced as I am, I still don't always think of everything, because everything means swapping parts and configs and reinstalling OS (it's the only true way to find hard to find issues), but many of us don't have spare parts at home or don't want to spend the money.

When I see hard to find (near impossible problems), like on a server, it usually turned out to be bad memory. That doesn't mean your problem is memory, but without process of elimination, no-one will know. Otherwise it's a MADDENING circle.  Not sure what else to say, just speaking from years and years of doing this. Sometimes it can be MB bug or just config issue, but these are some strange issues. Maybe it is the video card, but it sounds odd. I've seen servers reboot themselves only once every 1-2 months, it was bad memory.

Edited May 7, 20215 yr by Alpine Scenery

30 minutes ago, SAPilot said:

@Bobsk8 The video says it all.. just go "green" Bob .. which is NVIDIA. I have a RTX 2070 Super .. no issues. Not a SINGLE CTD since August last year. Side note : I just fly GA [all types] and on occasion the Cessna Longitude.

Good luck and I sincerely hope the replacement GPU brings you happy simming.

Greetings

Yeah, the original PC I ordered had a Nvidia card in it, which I had always used in all my PCs. The PC I bought finally, which was on sale, had an AMD card, and since the AMD  processor runs great, I figured possibly AMD GPU wouldn't be that bad.  Little did I know at the time. 

The issue though, is I've seen plenty of people running 6800's without problems, unless it's from the last update or two...

"I have never had a crash in game and the frame rates on my 1440p monitor are outstanding on mostly ultra with a few settings lowered that don’t do much or I don’t like (trees on medium for example) up to 87fps in a steam gage GA aircraft in country areas and often 60fps and above in many cities, meaning I can enable Vsync and have buttery smooth gameplay with no juddering (micro stutters) at all, except when scenery may be loading (I have roaming cache disabled). FPS in tubeliners is obviously lower, but still top of the shop at 1440p. It’s awesome."

I have though more commonly heard people report issues with VR on their AMD, who knows. AMD GPU is really sensitive to memory settings, faulty motherboard firmware issues, and general hardware interoperability. 

Edited May 7, 20215 yr by Alpine Scenery

8th straight 100+ mile flight with the   Mooney, zero problems. Going to see how many I can do, without issue. 

32 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

8th straight 100+ mile flight with the   Mooney, zero problems. Going to see how many I can do, without issue. 

Have you tried the latest version of JF Arrow? I also had annoying CTD problems with the previous version, but the latest version has worked flawlessly for me, even on longer flights, so hopefully they have fixed the CTD problems.

4 minutes ago, Ixoye said:

Have you tried the latest version of JF Arrow? I also had annoying CTD problems with the previous version, but the latest version has worked flawlessly for me, even on longer flights, so hopefully they have fixed the CTD problems.

Yup, just installed the latest version a couple of days ago, as soon as it was released. I am going to keep flying the Mooney until I get another CTD, and then try the Arrow again. If the Mooney  doesn't CTD , the Arrow might be put up on blocks in the hanger. 🙄

What made me think about trying the Mooney again, since all I have been flying is the Arrow, is someone posted awhile back suspecting that the Arrow might have been causing their  CTDs, because he had tried everything else to no avail. I figured it might be worth a shot to switch aircraft, because I had tried everything else. 

Edited May 7, 20215 yr by Bobsk8

23 flights so far, not one CTD . Guess my PC is Ok....😁 JF Arrow is on blocks in the hanger 

Edited May 13, 20215 yr by Bobsk8