January 24, 20224 yr This is why when I'm working on projects or my team, we don't give a date... 'when it's ready' however... 'when its ready' vs demanding public.... not so effective when people demand updates and 'when'... brutal crossfire of a date... might not be met... vs angry people wanting to know when they can have the shiny... case study: Cyberpunk 2077: essentially forced out early by public demand, and then slated for not being finished.
January 24, 20224 yr A multi billion dollar company like MS has never been able to issue a new version of Windows without regular updates or fixes. There's nothing like a piece of software going into millions of pc and getting that instant feed back of the bad that needs fixes. I never buy a new plane on day one. I usually wait up to a month to see if an update is in the works. It tells me if the developer is serious about supporting the aircraft. At the same time, the $30 or so I spend on a plane does not keep me up at night---even if I made the wrong decision. Such is life. tc
January 24, 20224 yr That's an important point... Nailing an aircaft or getting it super close on day one... with no updates or infrequent... meh Developer that makes an ok/decent aircraft, but drops updates like candy constantly... THAT I like. People slapped Blackbox around in fsx for poor service, but their MSFS releases have seen near constant attention. enhancement and fixes. Makes them a sure buy for me. (Example)
January 24, 20224 yr 1 hour ago, TASCHMANN said: Many are now suggesting, wisely I think, that "release day" purchases are quickly becoming a thing of the past. The wiser course of action is to wait for a thoughtful and objective review (such as your own perhaps) rather than risking money and, much more importantly at my age, time on a product that is not what it is held out to be. 3 main problems with this 1. What if everybody waits? 2. Reviews are IMHO 90% paid for (I mean real pilots supposedly help build the Twin Conner) and look at its release state! 3. Going by what MK said, MSFS is a higher, or very high percentage of new and unknowledgeable users, you know the ones that are totally blind sided by the graphics, and think pressing a button and seeing a light makes them qualified to stand up for a product they nothing about! so why would I trust that! MSFS is filled with so many easy to please and make do gamers that, the only opinion you can really trust is your own! and hence you get burnt! People keep excusing bugs and all this, its a joke. Stop simping for these companies! you do the community no favours, no nothing is perfect but the state of the Twin Conner at release was beyond a joke. And funny how all the bugs that were initially user error are now fixed!
January 24, 20224 yr Just now, a321 said: 2. Reviews are IMHO 90% paid for (I mean real pilots supposedly help build the Twin Conner) and look at its release state! Not true... At most, a developer grants early access... I personally pay for 90% of the planes I review... I've been given like 6 to review total.
January 24, 20224 yr 3 minutes ago, AvAngel said: Not true... At most, a developer grants early access... I personally pay for 90% of the planes I review... I've been given like 6 to review total. I always wondered about that. Rob (but call me Bob or Rob, I don't mind). I like to trick airline passengers into thinking I have my own swimming pool in my back yard by painting a large blue rectangle on my patio. Intel 14900K in a Z790 motherboard with water cooling, RTX 4080, 32 GB 6000 CL30 DDR5 RAM, W11 and MSFS on Samsung 980 Pro NVME SSD's. Core Isolation Off, Game Mode Off.
January 24, 20224 yr 1 minute ago, AvAngel said: Not true... At most, a developer grants early access... I personally pay for 90% of the planes I review... I've been given like 6 to review total. That's why I said most,. I love and appreciate your reviews, You are my go to. However on the Otter you did say it was going to be released in 6 days! So anything that was odd I assumed would be fixed, and that's a good assumption given Aerosoft said they had fixed the AP issues and found the problem within 24 hours.
January 24, 20224 yr 21 minutes ago, flyforever said: A multi billion dollar company like MS has never been able to issue a new version of Windows without regular updates or fixes. There's nothing like a piece of software going into millions of pc and getting that instant feed back of the bad that needs fixes. I never buy a new plane on day one. I usually wait up to a month to see if an update is in the works. It tells me if the developer is serious about supporting the aircraft. At the same time, the $30 or so I spend on a plane does not keep me up at night---even if I made the wrong decision. Such is life. tc Are you really going to compare and OS that runs your entire PC and communicates with over a million bits of hardware to a plane for MSFS?. Cost has nothing to do with it. but honestly really! Please tell me when is the last time you had to stop using your PC or just felt it was not worth using because of the OS? Edited January 24, 20224 yr by a321
January 24, 20224 yr I did too, I was told by them that there were a number of animation and sound issues with the beta that expected to be fixed for release.... that's what I said in the review to account for derpy stuff... that apparnetly didn't get updated much.
January 24, 20224 yr Just now, a321 said: Are you really going to compare and OS that runs your entire PC and communicates with over a million bits of hardware to a plane for MSFS?. Cost has nothing to do with it. but honestly really! He's not wrong... There are zero bug free game releases out there... even major titles like Rainbow Six: Siege, Counterstrike, Battlefield have persistent bugs.
January 25, 20224 yr 8 minutes ago, AvAngel said: He's not wrong... There are zero bug free game releases out there... even major titles like Rainbow Six: Siege, Counterstrike, Battlefield have persistent bugs. I know he is not wrong, but lets have perspective here! The Twin Otter (I am going to stop calling it the Twin Conner) is nothing like an OS. They did the CRJ and by and large at release it was pretty ok, not perfect and I would argue still is not perfect. What has to be distilled down is laziness VS bugs, and to me this was lazy. And if we keep excusing it and using disingenuous examples as above we will have this forever more. I get bugs I deal with them everyday, and dealt with them everyday at BAE systems, Fintech's, Banks, you name it I have seen it. Some are real curve balls, but mostly they are just because someone did not check or cant be bothered or there is a no, or a bad system of catching of them. An OS the runs your PC, talks to an 8BIT BIOS prior to booting, is constantly under attack by hackers, new hardware, hosting apps and programs some of which are awfully programmed and designed, mis treated by users, drivers and yet 9 out of 10 times still manages to work and boot up is vastly different to what amounts to a basic GA plane for a cutting edge sim, that really does nothing more that some other planes is a joke. I will concede on the games but not an OS.
January 25, 20224 yr Part of the problem with new code is the sheer complexity of it. The more features, functions, realism, etc. the more difficult it is to see, let alone fix a bug. As the complexity increases the number of potential places something can go wrong goes up exponentially. It doesn't take very many factors to make the permutations extremely difficult to completely test everyone. So decisions need to be made on how many to test. The 80/20 rule definitely applies here and it's always a balancing act for making the decision on when to release.. I9-9900, 32 GB RAM, RTX 3090 FTW
January 25, 20224 yr The problem is the Youtube-Facebook-Twitter-Instagram-etc. hype machine. Just ignore the noise and focus on reviews and evaluations from trusted sources, for example, independent reviewers who paid their own money for the addons they review. I completeley ignore "previews". Always chuckle when I see someone reviewing a sponsored product that they got, claiming they'll still provide an honest assessment. Yarite.
January 25, 20224 yr I'm mostly with you here. But in the end we need early adaptors (and the more the better as more eyes see more issues) otherwise we would go into a hen egg thingy... who was first there? hen? egg? Low sale numbers will lead to less drive behind. If we all go smart followers it def would not be an overall benefit. Another topic mentioned a lot lately is the "oh my, thx to the beta testers, did they actually test something? what a bunch of some words not allowed". I'm doing a lot of beta testing and lets put some things straight. You will post issues to the dev. But it will go to a list and eventually get some prio attached. Sometimes even marked as not doable in this addon price range. Especially short before a release some things will be marked as later by the dev even if we beta testers say omg thats a nogo and will be in every first review. And if its in the review it will stay in the review. Cause you won't get an update on the review after putting your update out usually. Sadly I can't remember a release that went without issues for a long time now. Perhaps this stopped with no more shipping of silver round things needed. With the update possibilities of the online market and supporting tools (contrail, orbxdirect etc) the tendency goes to a lot of minor fix packs after release. Agile development with us as early adaptors. Just my subjective thoughts. Not all is bad, but it could be better for sure. Cheers T.
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