In-depth interview: Jorg & Seb on MSFS 2024 after FSExpo'23

[lwt1971 7,425]

We as a community can also try to get a question upvoted enough to land in a future Q&A so that Henrik and his work get on their radar.

Hopefully Helisimmer's interview will give us even more details/tidbits 🙂 He says above VR support is confirmed, so sounds like they are at least considering VR as part of the whole picture rather than a tack-on post release.
 

[NZ255 309]

I’m hoping a streaming sim means if someone has a plane or helicopter you don’t have installed, you’ll see the correct version on your screen, rather than a TBM for example. If the marketplace supports freeware, and the moderation gets sorted we might see an end to flightsim.to

You'll want everything from the marketplace because it’ll support features like above. Potentially free trials too!

 

If it could work with vatsim clients too it could be the end of downloading huge AI models packs.

Edited June 26, 2023 by NZ255

[SamYeager 245]

51 minutes ago, NZ255 said:

If the marketplace supports freeware, and the moderation gets sorted we might see an end to flightsim.to

You'll want everything from the marketplace because it’ll support features like above. Potentially free trials too!

 

If it could work with vatsim clients too it could be the end of downloading huge AI models packs.

They've been talking about freeware stuff appearing in the market for ages. Yet to happen although the backlog in market approvals may have something to do with that.

[Noel 4,519]

4 hours ago, MarcG said:

The point is they're essentially wasting their time incorporating something that they could work with the free modders instead, they're now paying employees to do the same job. By working with the free modders they could incorporate those mods in as well, Henrik for example does a brilliant job and it will be interesting to see if the "official" version is any better.

Free modders aren't reliable essentially.  They have a huge team and want control over output which sounds vastly more reliable then depending on free modders to do anything.

[MarcG 3,021]

1 minute ago, Noel said:

Free modders aren't reliable essentially.  They have a huge team and want control over output which sounds vastly more reliable then depending on free modders to do anything.

Hmm sorry can't agree to that at all, just because they're "free" doesn't make them any less reliable than those who create mods for a living. Working Title were free modders before they joined forces don't forget, also look at the scrupulous modders making money off the unwary users, many of them are far less reliable!

[Sethos 4,379]

26 minutes ago, MarcG said:

Hmm sorry can't agree to that at all, just because they're "free" doesn't make them any less reliable than those who create mods for a living. Working Title were free modders before they joined forces don't forget, also look at the scrupulous modders making money off the unwary users, many of them are far less reliable!

Good example is Bijan's seasons pack. Wildly popular when it released, often recommended. One day he ups and leaves, everybody was defending him at first. Then it became this weird farce of him being back, making excuses and talking through other people who contacted him via mail. Then he comes back in November last year and says great news, the issue he was having is fixed and he will go over reported bugs and release an update as soon as it's ready... All while sitting in a completely locked down Discord, nobody able to speak, every reaction on his post that isn't positive is removed and it has been locked down ever since. No updates, no messages.

Just an abandoned piece of software that still sells, has bugs and performance issues after updates and people aren't being informed because they are just banking on enough suckers buying this dead addon.

Edited June 26, 2023 by Sethos

[abrams_tank 7,426]

21 minutes ago, Sethos said:

Good example is Bijan's seasons pack. Wildly popular when it released, often recommended. One day he ups and leaves, everybody was defending him at first. Then it became this weird farce of him being back, making excuses and talking through other people who contacted him via mail. Then he comes back in November last year and says great news, the issue he was having is fixed and he will go over reported backs and release an update as soon as it's ready... All while sitting in a completely locked down Discord, nobody able to speak, every reaction on his post that isn't positive is removed and it has been locked down ever since. No updates, no messages.

Just an abandoned piece of software that still sells, has bugs and performance issues after updates and people aren't being informed because they are just banking on enough suckers buying this dead addon.

I agree with this. I love freeware mods and they are great and all that. But if MSFS can incorporate what they are doing, that's all the better because then it will be reliable. For example, I hope MSFS can incorporate Global AI Ship, AIG/FSLTL, in the core MSFS engine one day.  I don't want to install a separate add-on like Global AI Ship, AIG/FSLTL, etc, if the MSFS team can make it just as good (or make it better) than the freeware add-on. Keyword here is "just as good or better." Of course, if MSFS's version of AIG/FSLTL is worse, I don't want that. But if it can be better, than I want that as part of the MSFS core engine.

Edited June 26, 2023 by abrams_tank

[ShawnG 1,823]

34 minutes ago, MarcG said:

Hmm sorry can't agree to that at all, just because they're "free" doesn't make them any less reliable than those who create mods for a living. Working Title were free modders before they joined forces don't forget, also look at the scrupulous modders making money off the unwary users, many of them are far less reliable!

Long history says otherwise, here and anywhere else free modding is done.  In every modder space there are a few shining lights that are in it for the long haul, but most only do what they do until they don’t feel like it any more.  Payware devs can be the same, certainly, but we aren’t comparing freeware devs to payware devs in this case, we are comparing freeware devs with employees or contractors for the sim developer.  In either case, the advantage here is there is likely to be structural improvements to ship traffic that modders can then use to improve upon the likely gaps left after the official version is here.

[Noel 4,519]

52 minutes ago, MarcG said:

Working Title were free modders before they joined forces don't forget

I'm not comparing free modders with paid content suppliers, I'm comparing them with the 180 person Asobo team of which WT contracts or was hired.

[Krakin 5,805]

1 hour ago, MarcG said:

Working Title were free modders before they joined forces don't forget,

Well they aren't free anymore, are they? And the only reason they were able to accomplish so much since joining the MS team is because they're getting paid now. Bringing them up is not helping your point at all. If Asobo think they can bring core features to the sim and make them really good then I say let them.

Edited June 26, 2023 by Krakin

[Noel 4,519]

14 minutes ago, Krakin said:

If Asobo thinks they can bring core features to the sim

100%

[MarcG 3,021]

39 minutes ago, Krakin said:

Well they aren't free anymore, are they? And the only reason they were able to accomplish so much since joining the MS team is because they're getting paid now. Bringing them up is not helping your point at all. If Asobo think they can bring core features to the sim and make them really good then I say let them.

#Facepalm you've clearly missed the point, free modders can still be hired on...just like working title...so ya know they are, as I said, not any less reliable than any paid other teams.

[PlumCrazy 228]

15 hours ago, Epgd said:

why there is no word about VR support???

for me personaly there is no FS simulator without VR...... 

since start using reverb G2 I ended with 2D monitor...

 

 

Why would they specifically mention VR, when it is already incorporated into MSFS2020?  I think it goes without saying MSFS2024 will have VR support.

I have no idea what sent you back to "pancake mode" after using the Reverb G2.  I personally fly 100% in VR (G2) and would have zero interest in continuing my MSFS hobby if I couldn't use VR.  I'm not saying the MSFS VR implementation is without issues, but certainly no problems that would make me want to go back to 2D monitor(s).

[Krakin 5,805]

6 minutes ago, MarcG said:

#Facepalm you've clearly missed the point, free modders can still be hired on...just like working title...so ya know they are, as I said, not any less reliable than any paid other teams.

You are the one missing the point. MS recognized that WT were talented but the hired them to ensure that they would be reliable. They're not going to just talk to Henrik and take his word that updates will be regular. They want to make live ships part of the core sim so let them. It makes no sense for them to put their massive resources on hold for a freeware dev. Did you see that animal mod from Sofly? Compare it to what Asobo showed in their trailer and tell me which one you prefer. Let Asobo cook where they want to cook.

[MarcG 3,021]

1 minute ago, Krakin said:

You are the one missing the point. MS recognized that WT were talented but the hired them to ensure that they would be reliable. They're not going to just talk to Henrik and take his word that updates will be regular. They want to make live ships part of the core sim so let them. It makes no sense for them to put their massive resources on hold for a freeware dev. Did you see that animal mod from Sofly? Compare it to what Asobo showed in their trailer and tell me which one you prefer. Let Asobo cook where they want to cook.

Where did I ever say that free modders should work for free once hired or in partnership with Asobo? That's right I didn't, I was clearly suggesting that free modders - WHO ARE NO LESS RELIABLE - as per why this conversation started in the first place, should be considered alongside others and if the opportunity arises then they could work with/alongside the dev team in a contractual/partnership or even full time sense.

 

Good god I'm going for a lie down 😄