I have been watching with interest the development of Beyond ATC, but whilst t it seems very good it is more geared to IFR and is quite expensive both for the initial purchase and ongoing premium use.

However, after following this, I get the impression that Pilot2ATCmight be more appropriate for me as I mainly fly GA VFR.

I don't have a headset or microphone yet so presumably will need to purchase these at the same time, but can anyone who uses it provide a bit of info to help me to understand how it works and it's pros, cons and limitations. E.g. how good is the voice recognition.

I was considering using the basic version with out the subscription service.  Does it work that way and is it any good without the subscription?

Thanks for any info and feedback as this is a new direction I was thinking of enhancing my simming experience.

Well I use it for IFR, but I'll try to answer anyway:

Pros:
It's very robust and solid. It's been developed for over 10 years and you can see it. Vectors etc. work perfectly, even in mountaineous regions. It just works, like a work horse. SID/STARs etc. are updated via Navigraph. For immersion it's great because it just works, it won't vector you into mountains or make you descent awkwardly. It's like real ATC, just without the human "naturality" (see below -> scripted). Works for IFR and VFR likewise. Simbrief integration. It's actively developed with current beta versions to try, if you want to.
There's a free demo to try. Many customization options like preferential runways (even if tailwind), randomized approaches (want a VOR approach every once in a while?), randomized SID/STARs (not the one you gave with Simbrief, but another applicable one chosen randomly) etc. Copilot can handle frequency change and/or responses/readbacks if you want to.

Cons:
It does not control AI traffic (although it sees it and tells you to hold short etc.). The UI is really old, but you get used to it and most things are done via voice recognition anyway, so you don't see it all the time.
Voice recognition is alright, but only if you stick to the script. Already things like adding a "Atlanta tower, ..." can make it not understand you.
Voices are either windows voices or some 3rd party voices. None of them are great or "humanlike".
Taxiways and gates are not read through the sim scenery, but through an external database. Database is good for US, but wrong for anything outside Europe (you can, however, import taxiways and gates from downloaded files, see flightsim.to [I actually published lots of them, probably more than 100 by now]).

There's no subscription, I think. I made a one-time purchase (40 dollars?) years ago, so I definitely did get value for my money by now.

Edited March 14, 20242 yr by Fiorentoni

First, the program is excellent. Speech recognition works flawlessly for me. There is no subscription. You need the ATC chatter add-on (very nominal fee) because then you have serious immersion. Your co-pilot handles the boring radio comms so you can focus on flying and interacting with ATC for critical stuff. You can also add more voices to add more variety. There are built in Windows voices that can be used and then it is really good. Some want it to control AI traffic (I don’t) or have a lot more voices, but for a flat fee this program is top notch and VERY WELL supported. You can download betas from their site and they are released frequently. 

No brainer. 

Edited March 14, 20242 yr by RobJC

Link to ATC Chatter…

https://stickandrudderstudios.com/fs-atc-chatter-overview/

 

Thanks for the info guys and very quick responses.  Looks like I need to take a look at the trial version then to get a better idea.

Does it work OK with FSLTL?

How big is the learning curve?

It works fine with FSLTL. The learning curve wasn’t too bad. I printed out a few pages from the manual related to the phrases to use. I was up and running in one day. 

Phrases are really easy to learn, because they are standard: e.g. "Request IFR clearance" or "Ready to copy clearance", "request taxi", "ready for departure", "request enroute descent" etc.

33 minutes ago, Fiorentoni said:

Taxiways and gates are not read through the sim scenery, but through an external database. Database is good for US, but wrong for anything outside Europe (you can, however, import taxiways and gates from downloaded files, see flightsim.to [I actually published lots of them, probably more than 100 by now]).

You can run Pete & John Dowson's MakeRwys utility and then import the data for your specific scenery configuration into the P2ATC database...works for airports worldwide.

15 minutes ago, cianpars said:

How big is the learning curve?

The learning curve is fairly significant.  The developer is very active and responsive to questions...but it does take some time and effort to get into the groove with the software.  I also find the integration with FS-ATC-Chatter to add some nice audio immersion.  It integrates well with Simbrief to import a flight plan, so setup for a flight goes fairly quickly once you get the hang of it.

It also works well over a LAN with FSUIPC/Wideclient--I run it linked to the sim from my laptop.

@RobJC and @Bob Scott

I currently use Pilot2ATC, but I use LiveATC.net for chatter (free).

Is there some benefit to using the pay chatter files you all are mentioning here?

7 minutes ago, Bob Scott said:

You can run Pete & John Dowson's MakeRwys utility and then import the data for your specific scenery configuration into the P2ATC database...works for airports worldwide.

That's what I do, but some scenery devs unfortunately are not that "pedantic" with taxiways, so you always have to check for missing connections etc. For the good devs it works out of the box, though, yes.

4 minutes ago, Mace said:

@RobJC and @Bob Scott

I currently use Pilot2ATC, but I use LiveATC.net for chatter (free).

Is there some benefit to using the pay chatter files you all are mentioning here?

LiveATC is not available for some countries due to legal restrictions (Germany for example). For the rest LiveATC is a good alternative, definitely.

Just now, Fiorentoni said:

LiveATC is not available for some countries due to legal restrictions (Germany for example). For the rest LiveATC is a good alternative, definitely.

Oh that's right.  I forgot about that.   That explains why there is no LiveATC.net chatter for certain countries/airports.  I have to resort to using the nearest similar country/controller.

Thanks guys. I'm really getting a good feel for it now.  I'm a lapsed PPL so pretty OK with standard phraseology.  I mainly fly in the UK and Europe most of the time except when world updates arrive and I explore a bit wider.  Is is all good for European flying (I note German restrictions)?

Off to find a headset and mike tomorrow so will give it a whirl - is a good quality headset necessary or will I be OK with a cheapy?

5 minutes ago, cianpars said:

Thanks guys. I'm really getting a good feel for it now.  I'm a lapsed PPL so pretty OK with standard phraseology.  I mainly fly in the UK and Europe most of the time except when world updates arrive and I explore a bit wider.  Is is all good for European flying (I note German restrictions)?

Off to find a headset and mike tomorrow so will give it a whirl - is a good quality headset necessary or will I be OK with a cheapy?

I use an ancient Microsoft headset, it's so old I can't remember if it was cheap or not.  Heh.

Just make sure in Windows sound settings you have your mike turned up to max volume.  That way P2ATC can better understand what you are saying.  Or maybe "hear" what you are saying is the better word.   

In my new system I am presently using the onboard Realtek sound...and I may have to run my mike thru an amplifier or get a dedicated sound card, because it's not amp'ing my voice enough for P2ATC to hear me.  I have to yell into the mike to get 28% in the windows mic test screen -- that's not good.

1 hour ago, cianpars said:

However, after following this, I get the impression that Pilot2ATCmight be more appropriate for me as I mainly fly GA VFR.

I'll comment on the above.  I find myself using Pilot2ATC primarily for *IFR* flying, and actually in my opinion P2ATC or any ATC program are better for that.  For VFR, it works well enough but I find myself talking to myself most of the time....announcing turn-to-base etc. etc. and for that you might as well use anything.  But it does flight following etc.

The real strength of Pilot2ATC is that in IFR, as Fiorentoni says, it just works.  Vectors or fully guided, it works.   
The user interface is not that great and has certain annoying quirks.  It is like a vintage C-130 cockpit -- you look at it for the first time and exclaim "OMG" -- however, you'll find that like a C-130 cockpit, once you learn what to do and when to do it, it's not that much of a mess after all.   Once you load your flight in, it can be all voice controlled (or you can press buttons on a screen if you want to, but to me that kind of ruins immersion).   I have set up a PTT (push-to-talk) button on my yoke, and also on stick.