First of all: English is not my native language, so bear with me.I realized late that If I had been reading the topics here in AVSIM about captain sim, I would not have lost 40 Euros in a 767 that should not have been released for the public (that value equals to R$ 123,00 brazilian money).Although I respect the work art that developers did with the VC and exterior model, that is about it with this product.I will try to be as polite as possible, giving the circunstances of dealing with a company that refunds only products "not installed". I wonder who would by a software, not install it and then return it back without knowing the contents... anyway.There is no point for me to be here complaining about the product if they had a refund policy. Why would I bother complaining If I could return? In a perfect world, they would be out of business by not making any money from the returned software, either that or make better stuff. But NO, unlike Flight 1 that offers 30 day refund, CS makes you install first and then loose your refund. But Hey, that's my fault: I didn't read the EULA. But at least I can go on Twitter and spread the word about the CS policies and to let people know that the product is not ready yet for consumers.To the airplane itself:Very good VC without almost any documentation. The manuals provided barely touches the plane and systems. If you don't know the 767 you are on your own. Want to know what to put in the ZFW field on the FMC? Good luck... look on the Level D manual, you'll find there.Started cold and dark, tried to run APU from VC.. no help. See this lil' video I did about the engine start procedure. Again, forgive me for the bad english.

Engine start is a joke: The engine "lights off" like there is a bomb in the combustion chamber. But hey, it is just a sim... I am not giving up enjoying it just because of engine starter flaws, EPR indications in GE engines, no electrical load shed and worng clicable spots among other things, right? right?Lets fly the bird then!.Taking off with MTOW... 3000 feet runway used and climbed and accelerated like a rocket... humm... ok, it is just a sim, lets not be sooo picky.FMC programmed, LNAV having a hard time to follow the magenta line... eventually it got there. Then a decided to do a little test: I deleted one way point and put the next one in the LSK2 as active, clicled EXEC and them.....link to the FULL Sized ImageYeap... that's it. Almost 90 degres curve to intercept the new way point (see image in full size - CMD , LNAV & VNAV are visible on the PFD to prove I was on those Autopilot active modes). It was not immediately after I activated the new way point, it stayed off set for minutes before doing this curve.But hey...it is just a sim... I am cruising now... let me scan the overhead and see whats going on...Link to full sized picWhat??? External power cart available and connected??? In CRUISE???? (don't believe me? try for yourself).But, ya know... it is just a sim, we can tow external power carts around.Let me do the approach... I have the STAR for SBGR correct (GURU9) but I hear the runway has changed to 27L.. ok, no problem, new STAR selected, EXEC and.... pow... route deleted. Yeap, the route was completely deleted, no DISCO inserted, nothing.. just "END OF ROUTE" on the scratch pad.... But hey... it is just a Sim. Several people may have beta tested and never found a problem, so that might be only me.I wouldn't have bothered If I had payed US$15 on this... but

There are honest developers, who bank their reputation on quality products (see PMDG and Flight 1), and then you have others who are in for the quick dollar. Sure, CS will come back that the beta testers did not catch these glaring problems-- or that they were not replicable. The quality developer will not argue with the customer, and will work hard to fix the issue. Let us see how CS reacts...

First of all: English is not my native language, so bear with me.I realized late that If I had been reading the topics here in AVSIM about captain sim, I would not have lost 40 Euros in a 767 that should not have been released for the public (that value equals to R$ 123,00 brazilian money).Although I respect the work art that developers did with the VC and exterior model, that is about it with this product.I will try to be as polite as possible, giving the circunstances of dealing with a company that refunds only products "not installed". I wonder who would by a software, not install it and then return it back without knowing the contents... anyway.There is no point for me to be here complaining about the product if they had a refund policy. Why would I bother complaining If I could return? In a perfect world, they would be out of business by not making any money from the returned software, either that or make better stuff. But NO, unlike Flight 1 that offers 30 day refund, CS makes you install first and then loose your refund. But Hey, that's my fault: I didn't read the EULA. But at least I can go on Twitter and spread the word about the CS policies and to let people know that the product is not ready yet for consumers.To the airplane itself:Very good VC without almost any documentation. The manuals provided barely touches the plane and systems. If you don't know the 767 you are on your own. Want to know what to put in the ZFW field on the FMC? Good luck... look on the Level D manual, you'll find there.Started cold and dark, tried to run APU from VC.. no help. See this lil' video I did about the engine start procedure. Again, forgive me for the bad english.Engine start is a joke: The engine "lights off" like there is a bomb in the combustion chamber. But hey, it is just a sim... I am not giving up enjoying it just because of engine starter flaws, EPR indications in GE engines, no electrical load shed and worng clicable spots among other things, right? right?Lets fly the bird then!.Taking off with MTOW... 3000 feet runway used and climbed and accelerated like a rocket... humm... ok, it is just a sim, lets not be sooo picky.FMC programmed, LNAV having a hard time to follow the magenta line... eventually it got there. Then a decided to do a little test: I deleted one way point and put the next one in the LSK2 as active, clicled EXEC and them.....Yeap... that's it. Almost 90 degres curve to intercept the new way point (see image in full size - CMD , LNAV & VNAV are visible on the PFD to prove I was on those Autopilot active modes). It was not immediately after I activated the new way point, it stayed off set for minutes before doing this curve.But hey...it is just a sim... I am cruising now... let me scan the overhead and see whats going on...What??? External power cart available and connected??? In CRUISE???? (don't believe me? try for yourself).But, ya know... it is just a sim, we can tow external power carts around.Let me do the approach... I have the STAR for SBGR correct (GURU9) but I hear the runway has changed to 27L.. ok, no problem, new STAR selected, EXEC and.... pow... route deleted. Yeap, the route was completely deleted, no DISCO inserted, nothing.. just "END OF ROUTE" on the scratch pad.... But hey... it is just a Sim. Several people may have beta tested and never found a problem, so that might be only me.I wouldn't have bothered If I had payed US$15 on this... but

I will chime in here which is something I don't do often. I have never used any of their products and can't personally attest to the facts in any way at all but over the years reading through the forums I have read enough things about CS as to never purchase a product from them myself. You get a feel for the quality vendors after you have spent some time here and CS is definitely not high on the list of preferred vendors from the info that I have gathered. Do your research better before you buy is the only advice I can offer you. PMDG and Level-D are the way to go if you are a jet jockey. You live and learn mate. I have made a few blunderous purchases myself in my time but I have learned who NOT to buy from by doing it and to ALWAYS do your research. Oh and I meant to add ALWAYS buy from flight1 if at all possible. Their return policy is the best! A recent airport purchase that didn't work out for me was quickly and effortlessly refunded, no questions asked.

Your English is fine! Nice job on the material. I am not finding some of the same things as you (e.g. my APU starts fine from VC -- you sure you're right-clicking?) I also did not have the weird AP behavior. A close reading of the website gives you a good idea of what's there and what's not yet, such as some manuals. As a 757 owner, I'm pretty familiar with Captain Sim's implementation of things, but I can see how it could be frustrating first time around. This is 1.0, and we'll see 1.1 before too long, I'm sure. Being the first kid on the block with a new release of software is fun if you know what you're getting into, but pioneers catch the arrows, too.About some of the technical stuff, I have no idea, so I'll take your word for it. While I know they are working on changes, I don't know if they are planning on modeling engine differences and the like on the first upgrade. I'm not a 767 pilot and could tell you if a Cessna 172 is starting realistically or not, but have no idea if it takes the amount of time modeled to start an engine, or 15 seconds longer, or whatever.As always, it helps to have a good idea of whether your expectations are a good match for any product. Your FPS are a little lower than mine, but there is no doubt there is a price to pay for the visuals your're getting. I don't think Captain Sim is known as a procedural trainer, but a consumer entertaintment product that will leave people who enjoy having the very most realistic representation feeling unsatisfied.Guess it never occured to me to see if I could get ground power in the air LOL. Flight 1's return policy is definitely nice, and definitely the exception not only in flight simulation but most things. EDIT: Your frustration is evident, and may very well be warranted; I'm not sure where the deception part comes in though.

Your English is fine! Nice job on the material. I am not finding some of the same things as you (e.g. my APU starts fine from VC -- you sure you're right-clicking?) I also did not have the weird AP behavior. A close reading of the website gives you a good idea of what's there and what's not yet, such as some manuals. As a 757 owner, I'm pretty familiar with Captain Sim's implementation of things, but I can see how it could be frustrating first time around. This is 1.0, and we'll see 1.1 before too long, I'm sure. Being the first kid on the block with a new release of software is fun if you know what you're getting into, but pioneers catch the arrows, too.About some of the technical stuff, I have no idea, so I'll take your word for it. While I know they are working on changes, I don't know if they are planning on modeling engine differences and the like on the first upgrade. I'm not a 767 pilot and could tell you if a Cessna 172 is starting realistically or not, but have no idea if it takes the amount of time modeled to start an engine, or 15 seconds longer, or whatever.As always, it helps to have a good idea of whether your expectations are a good match for any product. Your FPS are a little lower than mine, but there is no doubt there is a price to pay for the visuals your're getting. I don't think Captain Sim is known as a procedural trainer, but a consumer entertaintment product that will leave people who enjoy having the very most realistic representation feeling unsatisfied.Guess it never occured to me to see if I could get ground power in the air LOL. Flight 1's return policy is definitely nice, and definitely the exception not only in flight simulation but most things. EDIT: Your frustration is evident, and may very well be warranted; I'm not sure where the deception part comes in though.

Unfortunately almost every single one of your complaints/issues was/is evident on the 757 too yet people continue to compare CS to some of the FS Elite developers like LVL-D and PMDG. Try shutting off all your fuel pumps mid-air, or kill your hydraulics, the realism is non-existent. The engine starts are classic, if you blink you will miss it...No doubt they can make a visually beautiful product but under the pretty model it is still a squirrel on a wheel... No flaming here; taking the time to document these issues so they might help another simmer is commendable and your English was better than a lot of my fellow Americans ;)-Paul

I understand you are frustrated, but any particular reason you decided to post here instead of in the CS forum and see what their responce is?

Your English is fine! Nice job on the material. I am not finding some of the same things as you (e.g. my APU starts fine from VC -- you sure you're right-clicking?) I also did not have the weird AP behavior. A close reading of the website gives you a good idea of what's there and what's not yet, such as some manuals. As a 757 owner, I'm pretty familiar with Captain Sim's implementation of things, but I can see how it could be frustrating first time around. This is 1.0, and we'll see 1.1 before too long, I'm sure. Being the first kid on the block with a new release of software is fun if you know what you're getting into, but pioneers catch the arrows, too.About some of the technical stuff, I have no idea, so I'll take your word for it. While I know they are working on changes, I don't know if they are planning on modeling engine differences and the like on the first upgrade. I'm not a 767 pilot and could tell you if a Cessna 172 is starting realistically or not, but have no idea if it takes the amount of time modeled to start an engine, or 15 seconds longer, or whatever.As always, it helps to have a good idea of whether your expectations are a good match for any product. Your FPS are a little lower than mine, but there is no doubt there is a price to pay for the visuals your're getting. I don't think Captain Sim is known as a procedural trainer, but a consumer entertaintment product that will leave people who enjoy having the very most realistic representation feeling unsatisfied.Guess it never occured to me to see if I could get ground power in the air LOL. Flight 1's return policy is definitely nice, and definitely the exception not only in flight simulation but most things. EDIT: Your frustration is evident, and may very well be warranted; I'm not sure where the deception part comes in though.

Thank you for your balanced comment. I guess my deception comes from the false expectation that I had for the price I payed. Like J0nx said above, I should have researched before comitting to buy, and in fact I bought it because I read a review from a guy in a brazilian forum. He posted some nice pics and stated: "I put Level-D aside after installing this CS 767". I kindly asked him to let know how would him compare de FDEs from LD and CS. He replied saying that no difference was observed but he was learning the FMS yet. That should have raised a warning light for me about his knowledge, but I was so "blindly" looking for a full FSX replacement for Level-D that I forgot to double check on AVSIM. Deception with myself maybe? You live, you learn right?I realy hope the 1.1 fix several problems, but I doubt itAs for engine differences or "exploded start", those are really minor things, but correct representation of taking off heavy is a must.Regards,

I understand you are frustrated, but any particular reason you decided to post here instead of in the CS forum and see what their responce is?

I Thought of posting at their forum, but if you already bought their product, what is the point if you can not get a refund? At least here in AVSIM you can reach people who didn't buy yet and can be well informed and decide what is more important: nice looking machines or nice flying birds. BTW, like Psolk (Paul) said above, I will document all the problems I've found and post in CS forum. That may help other users and the developers.Rgds

No problem. I don't know that anyone is necessarily comparing Level D and Captain Sim's 767, apart from one or two enthusiastic comments from fans on their forum (not CS, certainly). If you thought you were getting Captain Sim graphics with Level D fidelity, I can see why you would be disappointed.Captain Sim is a purveyor of beautiful aircraft for people who have the systems for them and have different expectations as far as faithfulness to the real thing. For me, they're great. I enjoy a lot of airplanes, and am pretty tolerant of a general treatment of things.Truth to tell, I'm one of those who is probably going to be flying the CS 767 instead of Level D from now on, but that' s me. I am not doing so because I think it is more realistic, but because I think it looks better. Everyone has their own preferences, especially when it comes to demands for realism. I drive a Mini Cooper because it looks better, and is a fun spin, not because I really enjoy hearing people sitting in the "back seat" complain LOL I could have had a full-sized car for the same price, but the Mini is what I wanted.For everyone else, I've said it before and I'll say it again, if you like the CS757 you will probably like the CS767. The latter is starting out where the former left off at 4.3 and already shows some improvement. We probably need to wait awhile until we can separate isolated, system-specific issues from general bugs (e.g. the startling bank angle). I flew across Brazil virtually a couple of times and have some VARIG paints on different stuff.

All,I normally wait several weeks of watching forums and reviews before I buy payware planes. I cannot explain why I bit into this one. Maybe I assumed that the same developers who just brought the 757 to 4.3 would not deliver so poorly on the 767. I have also posted on CS so this is a little broader warning about this thing. I saw enough wrong with this thing as soon as I saw the cockpit that I didn't even bother trying to takeoff. EPR-GE Engine, I thought this was a sim so why didn't version 1.0 just come with alias to the default 737 panel or something? I would say that if you plan to buy this 767 wait until all the updates are released. I'm not seeking a refund, but a service pack to bring this to higher standards should be available to previous buyers. Okay, I'm done. Keith

I Thought of posting at their forum, but if you already bought their product, what is the point if you can not get a refund? At least here in AVSIM you can reach people who didn't buy yet and can be well informed and decide what is more important: nice looking machines or nice flying birds. BTW, like Psolk (Paul) said above, I will document all the problems I've found and post in CS forum. That may help other users and the developers.Rgds

The point is that you may find others with similiar problems, and fixes they have found. It also gives the developers a chance to see your issues and address them. It may be your setup and not the plane, if others arent reporting them. It is also just 'plane' courteous to give the developer a chance to rectify your problems, before complaining about them without giving them a chance.I can't speak to their refund policy because I have never tried. I have their C130, 727, and 757, and all fly beautifully. I didn't get the 767 because it is basicly a 757 in a different package, so I can't speak to your specific problems with it, but I can tell you that any problems I had with the 757 have long been resolved, and most 'fixes' came from other users in the CS forums.BT, I am not a 'fan' of CS, but I am a user of their products and in general very happy with them.

No doubt they can make a visually beautiful product but under the pretty model it is still a squirrel on a wheel...

Gotta agree here. Treating CS products as even half-serious simulation is a mistake, these are primarily entertainment titles that gained their market niche solely on their visuals. Documenting the bugs here is just waste of time - wrong market.

Maybe once a year CS have a sale and you can pick up one of their products for about USD$15 or so. At that price I can just ignore it if it doesn't meet my needs.scott s..

It is really a shame CS seems to be falling flat on their face with these more complex modern jets (or perhaps our expectations are too high for them...?). I love their C130, and though I don't fly it often, it is nice to have when I do want to use it. I don't regret buying it at its normal price at all. That being said, I don't even know why I have their 757 installed anymore... its just taking up hard drive space and increasing my FSX loading times. Seeing opinions like this will definitely keep me away from their 767.Thanks for posting your honest criticisms. CS, stop working on these t00bs and finish that B-52 ;)

Here Here kiwicat :(