My thoughts after purchasing XP10

[JasonHarris 96]

XPX a niche market...Actually I hope it stays that way, I don't give a crap about Flight I personally have had enough of MS.XPlane will continue to grow whether PDMG or Orbx did something or not.

I would certainly hope it doesn't stay the way it is, I like flying with nice scenery as I never fly large jets at 30000. Xplane won't grow without 3rd party developers because from what I read on these boards LR are looking for 3rd parties to fill in the gaps. I like doing some flying in xplane, but it doesn't cover enough things for me to want to do most of my flying in it, maybe some specific kinds of flights. I find it interesting that you called out geoffa and told him to stick with FSX. Reading his posts I would call him an advocate for xplane while at the same time being realistic about it. I could see you having that kind of stance with 'colt' from the other thread, which you did btw. By calling it niche I think you are accepting it's quirks but wanting it to stay that way can't be good for the product. Here is one quote about complacency. 'We shall have no better conditions in the future if we are satisfied with all those which we have at present.' A lot of the stuff I read here comes from people saying what they would like to see different, thats how things get better and while I have no history in xplane I would think thats how you got whatever improvements you have through different versions. LR could learn that in some areas the customer is always right.

[VegaSS 2]

There's nothing to solve when those reactions are more knee-jerk than honest. As I said, my impression of the OP is that he decided he was going to dislike XP10 before his copy even arrived in the mail.

What the heck makes your opinions about the game more valid than mine MM? So what, I purchased the sim, flew it for 3 days straight, didn't like it, and you call that "knee jerk"??? Who the hell are you??? I've been simming for 15 years, at least. I've played everything on the marked, including the sims at the flight schools. I've owned XP sims and most MS sims, so, now, because I didn't like you precious XPX, I'm not a valid opinion? You sir, are arogant with XP. You need to get over the fact that it's not perfect, and needs alot of help, and is very dissapointing ot some consumers.

[Mountain Man 142]

You were doing so well, until you typed this.

You need to know m_av's history around here: he has an admitted passion for Microsoft flight simulator and never has anything good to say about X-Plane or its developers.

[JasonHarris 96]

You need to know m_av's history around here: he has an admitted passion for Microsoft flight simulator and never has anything good to say about X-Plane or its developers.

Come on MM, you are highlighting every perceived bias people have in this forum that you can't play two sims, that xplane people dont like FSX'ers coming here. You should re-read this and then ask why you were serious in typing it. Honestly, it feels comical that a statement like that is here, its not the great inquisition :)

[Mountain Man 142]

Scratch the word "shoddy" out of m_av's discription of XP10, and you have an entirely accurate description.

Yes, "shoddy" is definitely right out, but I wouldn't say buggy is particularly accurate, either. "Buggy", to me, suggests a predominant number of bugs, which doesn't describe XP10. "Unpolished" is arguable and largely in the eye of the beholder, I think. That leaves "incomplete", which is something that could be accurately said of XP10 at this point and something Laminar has openly admitted.

[rburke3608 0]

I get it. I get the complaints and the let downs and the frustrations of flying a flight simulator on a home computer. I got my private pilots license back in '79 and since about 1998 have been buying every flight sim on the market; joysticks, rudder pedals, endless computers/computer upgrades/video cards etc etc. All in the vain attempt to duplicate climbing into any airplane and flying. Essentially I am chasing the "questing beast". Honestly I can't afford to rent airplanes enough to stay proficient and definitely will never be able to own a plane (I am 52 with an adopted 5 year old). So these days all of my "flying" happens at my computer. I am always basically disappointed with flight sims. There is the feeling of flying that can never be duplicated and it is like Captain Kirk in Generations when he jumped that gully on horseback. It always scared him to make that jump because the consequences of messing it up were real in the real world, but not the Nexus.Flying, like motorcycling across country, places you in situations with consequences for ignorance or stupidity. The joy comes from mastering a craft as much as you can master something that can throw curves you anytime. Curves that if not handled with practiced skill can swiftly end your life.All of the above is obvious. So why bother with flight sims? Until Kurzweils's Singularity, flight sim's on a computer are make believe. I am currently taking a single engine prop plane and starting on the east coast am flying "real weather," downloaded as I fly each segment as if it was 1926. No radio, using maps and dead reckoning to fly from place to place and plan to pop by Troy Ohio because if it was 1926 I would be begging Clayton and Sam for a job -- even sweeping the floors and taking out the trash at the WACO factory with the hopes to do more someday. I average 30 fps, have a Dell XPS 8300, i7 2600 processor, 8 gig of system ram. Upgraded the computer to a 650 watt power supply in order to cram an ATI 6970 with 2 gig of video ram into the chassis. I have Saitek Pro joystick and rudders. The power connection to the joystick is touchy and if it gets just a little loose my plane is all over the virtual sky. Generally I will see a couple of lights flashing on my joystick when the plug isn't making good contact. It really is touchy.I have the texture resolution set at "Extreme res!" My default monitor setting is 1920 x 1080 for my Samsung 23 inch LED monitor. Gamma at 3.5. Anisotropic filter level at 16x. Anti alias level at "none". All blocks to the far left of the next section checked. Trees at "filled in". Number of objects and roads at "tons". Number of cars at "Siberian winter". World distance detail at medium. Airport detail at high. Shadow detail at "overlay". I played a lot with this one and the higher level shadows kill frame rates and quite frankly look crappy. Water reflection detail at default. Next block, I do not need to check compress textures to save VRAM. Everything else is checked across this whole line. I can do FXAA for HDR anti-aliasing but my machine can't handle 4xSSAA. Cloud detail is set at 22% (some) for number of cloud puffs. 23% + hits my machine hard. 40% (normal) for size of cloud puffs and 60% (nice) for opacity of cloud puffs. I set my field of view at 75 degrees as Carenado recommends this for their aircraft.For the bigger picture I disabled hyper threading for my processor in the BIOS. I also turn as many background processes off as I can before I start the sim. I use Game Booster 3 which is part of Advanced System Care 5. I make sure all of Advanced System Care 5 is shut off because it has interrupted the sim with the Malware fighter and quick care both of which don't seem to care if you are writing an email or running a program. They will stop whatever you are doing for routine system checks. I have to look at the keyboard to type so when I type an email I only occasionally look at the screen. I know ASC 5 is doing something when I look up to see only half what I typed and my cursor gone. Frustrating. It will stop the sim to tell you it finished a quick check of your system.I also have a Trackir 5. This is not optional. Get one if you don't have it. Trust me. It is really cool.So, with all of that I can run real world weather and fly around in some pretty thick, rainy soup at times keeping around 30 fps. Much better fps if the weather is clear. That is enough to let go and make believe for a little while. Of course this is late at night when my daughter and wife are asleep. No flying once either are up. And also, I do not follow Robert Buck's weather flying recommendations. That is, in the real world there are more good weather flying days then bad so on the really bad weather days leave the plane on the ramp. Since this is the "Nexus" I have no compunction about taking off on a crappy weather day.No, nothing about flight sims are like the real thing. A real Cessna 150 is a VERY stable beast to fly. I have had some experiences with sim planes bordering on ludicrous with regards to flight characteristics. Any of you with kids know the SpongeBob episode where he and Patrick used their "imagination" and played inside a cardboard box. You kind of have to embrace that concept with flight sims. I am liking x-plane X. But I have liked every version of x-plane, Microsoft flight simulator, Fly, Red Baron, Red Baron 3D, Rise of Flight, IL2 all versions through Cliffs of Dover... You appreciate the parts that are close to real and the rest is imagination. It's 12:58 am and writing this is cutting into my Friday night flying time...Cheers!

[Mountain Man 142]

I purchased the sim, flew it for 3 days straight, didn't like it, and you call that "knee jerk"???

Yep. With something as complicated as a flight simulator, three days is barely enough time to scratch the surface.

[thepitts 30]

rburke3608---what a great post from a true aviation fan.Moderators is there any chance of "stickying"(pretty sure that's not the correct term) this at the start of the X-plane general discussion forum with the bye-line.....Please Read Before Entry...It would be a pity for it to vanish into a fog of mediocrity.TIM

[VegaSS 2]

May I suggest opening a RANT section in these forums where we can put all these endless destructive topicsso that the creative and constructive ones left can have some peace ENJOYING our hobby without being accusedof who-knows-what just because one happens to like a sim the majority doesn't?M

It's a general disscusion forum, this is where we talk about anything X-Plane. It seems to me some times that "constructive critisizm" to some people is only possitive, but that's not true. If you want to be constructive, you have to learn to except the negative, which can also be constructive. Why do so many people defend XP like it's their 1st born child???? It IS just a game. I, with many others, critisized FSX when it was released also. Many will critisize FLIGHT when it's released, that's what we do, and it's our right to do so. I didn't start this thread to offend anyone personally here, that's not the point, so why do so many take that way? XP is what it is, and it lacks in so many ways, it's a FACT. It doen't even have 4 seasons in the release. That shouldn't be exceptable for any of us, and needs to be talked about. 3rd party add-ons are developed to make a sim experience more enjoyable, not to make the sim flyable or tolerable, right? If a sim needs to have these 3rd party add-ons to make it a viable simulator, than the developers missed the mark in a huge way. Even some of the big supporters of XP have stated that, "if you just purchase some add-on aircraft, XPX is much more flyable". Why shouldn't it be flyable out of the box? This is constructive, not a personal "Rant". Keep an open mind. :(

[urthgental 181]

Yes, open free speech here. You can have any opinion, critizise and flame here about every simulator as you wish.Dear Wisenheimer, please pick up a protest sign, go to the capital of your country you live in and protest there. There are still some open issues left in the world.

[Longranger 148]

It doen't even have 4 seasons in the release. That shouldn't be exceptable for any of us, and needs to be talked about.

That's your opinion. I don't really care about the four seasons, especially if it only depends on the date. At least we don't have snow when it is 10 degrees above zero, while FSX is totally sure that there must be snow on everything. This has nothing to do with reality, that's a fairy tail. And if you consider the need for four versions of nearly every texture...

[VegaSS 2]

That's your opinion. I don't really care about the four seasons, especially if it only depends on the date. At least we don't have snow when it is 10 degrees above zero, while FSX is totally sure that there must be snow on everything. This has nothing to do with reality, that's a fairy tail. And if you consider the need for four versions of nearly every texture...

At least we don't have snow when it is 10 degrees above zero, while FSX is totally sure that there must be snow on everything. This has nothing to do with reality, that's a fairy tail. And if you consider the need for four versions of nearly every texture...

Seriously, a fairytale? Well, than I guess that would explain why you don't feel that there is anything wrong with this sim at all. You feel that everything that is lacking from it is just a fairytale. Well, than I guess I live in fairytale land, because just about every sim in the past 10 years, except XPX has had these things. And you know, there is a better chance of having snow on the ground when it's 10 above zero, than no snow on the ground in michigan in January. But, than again, I must live in a Fairytale.

[60North 120]

Why do so many people defend XP like it's their 1st born child???? It IS just a game.

I'll tell you why!Historicaly XP is a very small community with a much higher average user age (cost 200$ about ten years ago)XP was originally designed as an aerodynamics engineering tool more than a simulator "game". I'm an engineer and I'vebeen working on flightmodels in XP for over 12 years. Currently I develop at IXEG where everyone are engineers and pilots. Everyonehave there been involved with X-Plane development and Laminar for over a decade. X-Plane has been my hobby for 12 years. Most of us old timers have in one way or another been actively directly or indirectly involved in XP's evolution and made it what it is today. (and I don't mean just addons)X-Plane offcourse isn't perfect. Do you really think we need a 14 year old FS'er that tried the demo for 10 minutes to tell us that??We have been tweaking and improving X-Plane for over a decade, and we'll probably do so for the next decade as well.It is part of what X-Plane is! X-Plane isn't just about flying, it is as much about BEING CREATIVE! We don't have hugecommercial companies that makes everything for us, scenery, aircraft, addons - we have always had to do everything ourself! EVERYTHING!Maybe 2% of everything ever made for XP is payware! The rest is freeware made by idiots like myself!So, it ####### us off when some 18 yo punk or comes in here and tells us that we have waisted the last 10+ years of our lives and that we don'tknow how an aircraft should perform and that the other sim is much better in every way. Because thats BS!And XP is not "just a game", X-Plane is also a hobby that some of us are passionate about, a great engineering tool, a trainer, and a fantasticwaist of time!So yes we will defend it from ignorance and "first impression" rants like yours which are counter productive, demotivating,intentionally exaggerated and unfair to a community which up until now mostly is driven by freeware contributions.In addition, there is a huge commercial FS industry present in this forum that has financial interests in X-Plane NOT succeedingsince they have large investments in FS that will get lost if the users jump ship. So some here also have an agenda.So it's posts like yours that are a threat to simulator diversity in general - and yes that ####### me off.M

[GoranM 3,772]

I've refrained from posting in the last week or so, but these last bunch of posts by the so-called experts have been absolutely hilarious. And I see Morten has finally spoken his piece and echoed the thoughts of every other x plane developer out there.

[Mountain Man 142]

Come on MM, you are highlighting every perceived bias people have in this forum that you can't play two sims...

Not at all. It is certainly possible to enjoy more than one sim, but you have to question someone's motives when he has an admitted passion for Microsoft flight simulator and spends all of his time in this forum doing nothing but ranting about X-Plane and bad-mouthing Laminar Research. Like I said, you have to know something of m_av's history around here.