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Guest Charlie Delta

Fun talkin' with heavy pilots...Boeing vs Airbus!

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Every Friday night I get to talk to a right seat pilot on Delta 737-800 who comes into a pub I frequent. He doesn't fly out 'til Tuesday following. He flies for Delta and he tolerates me talking about MSFS and all the airports I fly to and the various ILS' approaches, and the "trickiest" airports, etc. He flies into Denver regularly. He actually respects me for the knowledge I gained from MSFS, and can't believe I know as much as I know. So........we have some good conversations. He introduced me to a Captain tonight... who flies for American, and he was a really cool conversationalist. He flies the Caribbean route currently and flies an A-300 most of the time. Both he and the Delta pilot said...."If it ain't Boeing...I ain't going". I found out tonight that both pilots prefer the Boeing jets over the Airbus jets (although the American pilot flies the Airbus). I thought this was quite interesting, and gave me a whole new respect for the Boeing planes over the Airbus. Supposedly, the Airbus Autopilot is finicky, and unpredictable when disengaging (sound accurate?).Have any of you ever heard this? I always thought the Airbus was a techonological marvel ( with the "fly by wire" thing and all).I'd love to engage a conversation on the Boeing vs the Airbus from all you REAL pilots out there. Do you feel the same as my friends do? Stan

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Stan I really do feel we've slung far too many spears bothways over The Pond "discussing" Airbus/Boeing comparisons. If you care to search the forums you'll find lots of patriotic preferences one way and another.Do lets leave it alone and stay with your pilot friend's opinions - you're lucky to have the opportunity.RegardsTony

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Well the fly by wire is not a relatively new thing. The first aircraft to adopt is was the AVRO Arrow. Beautiful canadian aircraft that was demolished by some prim minister that would never have got my vote but hey, there is always Bombardier!

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Yea, tbe Boeing Vs Airbus thing has been discussed to death. But SO WHAT???This is a discussion forum......... nothing wrong with discussing something that has been discussed already. Doing so brings new perspective as well since people who didn't participate in previous discussions can bring fresh perspective.So I say, if you want to discuss it, then by all means do so.And if some people don't want to see it well they can simply not enter the thread.

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because it invariably turns into a flamewar...I agree discussing different products on technical merit should be possible, but apparently that's not the case.FBW is as old as aviation btw. The Wright brothers used wires to control their aircraft :-waveIt's Fly By Electricity that's relatively new, being first attempted in the 1960s. Airbus certainly didn't invent it, they weren't around at the time.They were AFAIK the first to use it in a civilian airliner class aircraft.

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I would greatly enjoy a technical discussion comparing systems and the handling of Airbus and Boeing airplanes; call it technical entertaintment. But I would definitively would not like to hear juvenile or mature opinions outside of the technical fields surrounding these two types of machines. These could be expressed in a non-flight simulator forum. Dave Vega

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I regularly get to talk to Air New Zealand pilots about the various aircraft, and while there is a bit of variation, they pretty much all agree that it actually comes down to specific models.Remembering that ANZ only has A320s, and doesn't fly 757s or 777s, the order of preference amongst the jets is pretty much:747-400A320737-400767737-300Of course, this may have something to do with the A320s all being brand new, too.Note also that ANZ's 737s have been upgraded so far they pretty much match the NGs for equipment, if not ergonomics, and all of these aircraft were pretty much optioned-out to start with.My preference as a *passenger* is pretty much:777A320, ANZ options767747-400737-300 or laterA310 or 320, other airlinesAnything earlier than the above, except:Tied for last, A340 and any 757.That's for economy class, get a better class ticket and the difference between the airlines is far greater than between the aircraft.

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and even in economy I've had sometimes better seats than the defaults A320s come with...Everything depends on the airline, the seatrow you get (exitrow, etc.), time since last service, etc. etc.My father once flew businessclass on KLM which was a nightmare. Different flight on KLM, same aircraft type and seat number was excellent.The difference: his seat was damaged, causing the cushioning on the seatback to fail completely so he was sitting effectively with his back against a metal plate for 10 hours (he has severe hernia).

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I think this belongs in the "Hangar Chat" forum :)

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>Remembering that ANZ only has A320s, and doesn't fly 757s or>777s, the order of preference amongst the jets is pretty>much:Ahh, but did you see that ANZ recently put in an order for 777s? :)

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That airbus pilot flyes an old model of airbus. It doesn't have FBW or glass cockpit (the a300-600 does have glass tough, an I guess it's what he flyes), it's alot like a regular boeing. So unless he has another type rate in an modern FBW airbus he does not qualify for an 1st person opinion. I'm not defending AIRBUS, in fact I'm not even a ppl, I only fly as a pax, and I'm not related in any way with the manufacturers, I don't even have a preference between BOEING and AIRBUS, but we for clarity sake have to compare aples to aples.... :-wave

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I will think of it this way when I have a flying job: I'm an airline pilot flying one of those glorious jets which I know millions of people can only fantasize about. Airbus or Boeing, I'm still living my dream.Jason :-wave

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I agree with this entirely although on a recent flight there were seats available on the exit row but BECAUSE I am disabled I was not allowed to sit there for safety reasons. I'll tell you that since my affliction concerns my legs I would have welcomed that extra room! I will say that a damaged seat should not be occupied - I'm certain, at least in the UK, that would contravene safety regs and I have been on many flights were a seat has been vacant because of a faulty reclining mechanism.Which aircraft you rave about most is like choosing a car - purely a personal preference.

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I totally agree with you Jason! I have always said; if it has wings, at least 2 jet engines and I get to fly it I'am happy :-)I have become quite familiar with the whole airbus/boeing discussion, I have friends flying the 757, 737 and A320. I don't pretend to be an expert, I only have about 40 hours on the A320/321 and about 35 on a 737-800 sim, but I like to add my $ 0.02 to this discussion. First of all, you can't compare miss piggy (The A300) to the A320/330/340 series, the 300 is a conventional aircraft. Also, on the A320 series I have never noticed a finicky autopilot, if you take it out and don't touch the sidestick it wont change attitude or bank at all (no wind and no turb) My opinon on the whole Boeing vs /Airbus thing is; I see them as different, not better or worse. What I like about the Boeing: Simple, they look good :-), have a normal yoke and are supposed to be better in verry gusty crosswind conditions. What I like about the Airbus: Autotrim!!, the table, flying manual with the autothrust in (doesn't work that well in the 737), the (FBW) technology, combined type ratings (318/319/320/321) A final point, In my opinion there is no difference in safety if either aircraft is flown by a professional crew, so I am not to crazy about the whole; "If it ain't Boeing...I ain't going" and Scarebus thing.Mazzl,Joost

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Thank you Charlie Delta, finally a reasonable post, not colored by blind patriotism or over-generalization of single experiences!- Oyvind

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charliedeltaWell said - you put things very well. I would say though that pushing the envelope (not actually) in avionics developement and sophistication can only lead to better safety for all of us.Tony

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"It's Fly By Electricity that's relatively new, being first attempted in the 1960s.... (Airbus) were AFAIK the first to use it in a civilian airliner class aircraft."Nope, that would have been the 1950 Bristol Brabazon - which never entered commercial service :-(The Brabazon was an astounding technological marvel, but an economic disaster. The designers built a plane bigger than a B-747, that was expected to carry about 80 passengers. The assumption was that air travel would remain attractive to only the wealthy, who would never tolerate being packed into rows of seats. The design called for 200 - 270 cubic feet of space per passenger.Bristol also stuck to tried and true piston-engined props for the plane (8 of them) even though by 1944 when the decision was made the Worlds first production jet - the Gloster Meteor - was already demonstrating the superiority of the jet engine.Richard

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"I agree with this entirely although on a recent flight there were seats available on the exit row but BECAUSE I am disabled I was not allowed to sit there for safety reasons."On a recent hop from Long Beach to Oakland a guy had checked in online and selected the aisle seat in an exit row. He had a metal leg brace actually screwed into his bones above and below the knee. The flight attendant told him he couldn't sit there, they would need to reseat him. He got very angry about it, yelling at her that his injury made it necessary for him to have the exit row with its extra legroom. She tried to be polite and explain why he couldn't stay, but he wasn't having any of it.Suffice it to say that he got obnoxious enough that legroom on the plane ceased to be an problem for him :-)Richard

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I don't like the fact that all Airbuses have the same flight deck. I think that its inviting confusion. What do you think.

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I think i's actually less confusing, you know where to find everything no matter what type. You just have to be aware of what type you are flying. My company operates the 320 and 321, that's why we start every briefing with "This is a 321(or 320)... " Like I said, it makes type ratings for different aircraft less complicated, you can have two different types on your license 320/330 for example. And you will notice the difference between these two :-)Mazzl,Joost

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Just off a BA 737 where reclining mechanism was in permanemt recline!Steward asked me to sit in upright position on landing which was impossible. I told crew as I left aircraft that seat 8a was ********.I receives a polite thank you!Bet you its occupied for the rest of the day/week/year anyway.

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