Sign in to follow this  
LoicAF

NAVRAD page / ILS

Recommended Posts

Hi everybody,

 

I have a big problem with the ILS of the PMDG 777. When i want to enter the frequency of the ils and the course (xxx.xxx/xxx), it's written: "PARK".

So I click on "DEL" to delete it, and it says "INVALID DELETE". How can I fix that, Thanks you very much!

 

Loïc

 

P.S.: Sorry for the english

 

Edit: I start with the Cold and Dark state.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Help AVSIM continue to serve you!
Please donate today!

Loïc,

Could you take a snapshot and put it up, so that everyone could see what your trying to say.

Also this is a known issue, which was ironed out in sp1 I think.

Trying to delete will give you a error message. Instead manually put in the frequency in the NAV/RAD page. You'll see a M also shown once the frequency and course (both must be inserted!).

 

Also the format is 3 digit for the course as well.

Eg:

110.3/88 is the wrong format

Instead 110.3/088 is correct

- example given above was stated by Alpha Floor on another post.

Hope this helps,

H.M

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes of course!

 

1.

mini_954507PMDG01.png

 

2.

mini_312623PMDG02.png

 

3.

mini_988456PMDG03.png

 

And when I try to enter directly the freq/course it shows "Invalid Entry"

 

Loïc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And when I try to enter directly the freq/course it shows "Invalid Entry"

 

Loïc

You are showing an invalid Delete in your pictures, which of course is correct behavior. You have to enter a valid ILS frequency and course in the formal mentioned by H.Manish, note that only ILS frequencies will work. What are you trying to enter as a ILS/Course entry?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok thanks! I will try that, but when I enter that, I always use the good format (xxx.xxx/xxx) or I try other things, hopping they'll work. And it shows "Invalid Entry". Anyway, thank you

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does "PARK" not actually refer to the fact the frequencies are literally parked, as in, they have no current value?

 

Also, why are your ILS radios not auto-tuning? They won't auto tune until you have selected the arrival runway ILS procedure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
LoicAF, on 23 Nov 2015 - 7:06 PM, said:

Yes I'm so dumb! :) I'll try that and tell you if it's working :) Thanks!

 

No you are not dumb, you are just learning. It is perfectly fine to ask questions, although I will point out that if you do Tutorial 1 and 1.5, you will learn a lot about these sorts of procedures.

 

Also, you should have enough posts now to configure a forum signature with your name so we know who we are talking to (it is a requirement here)

 

RE your ILS, generally you would not load the arrival (STAR) and approach (ILS, in your case) until you are airborne and on your way at cruise level, unless it is a very short flight and you know for sure what arrival and approach you will be using. I am not sure if the FMS will tune the radios on the ground before departure, to a frequency at another airport.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi, Loic,

 

You should be able to enter an ILS frequency/course in PARK even if no destination runway is selected -- I just tried it.

 

Are you sure you are using a frequency that is a possible ILS frequency (as Dan noted is required)? No deleting of anything

is necessary, unless you manually enter an ILS frequency and want to delete it.

 

Mike

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mike is correct, you need a frequency between 108.10 and 111.95

 

See here for more: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_landing_system

Thanks, Wes, I didn't know the precise range.

 

It is a good idea to know how to enter the frequency and course manually, as with FSX eventually you

will come across old airport scenery that has different ILS frequencies from the more

up-to-date FMC nav data. Otherwise, I let it autotune by selecting an ILS approach (interestingly, if

you select a non-ILS approach for an ILS-equipped runway, the FMC WON'T autotune the frequency).

 

Mike

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just to be clear. The example I gave also worked.

It just needs to fall under the frequency band that's all. No destination required. No programming(FMC) required. Nothing. Of course during approach and planning the star..ils frequency is most of the times autotune

H.M

Just to be clear. The example I gave also worked.

It just needs to fall under the frequency band that's all. No destination required. No programming(FMC) required. Nothing. Of course during approach and planning the star..ils frequency is most of the times autotune

H.M

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks, Wes, I didn't know the precise range.

 

It is a good idea to know how to enter the frequency and course manually, as with FSX eventually you

will come across old airport scenery that has different ILS frequencies from the more

up-to-date FMC nav data. Otherwise, I let it autotune by selecting an ILS approach (interestingly, if

you select a non-ILS approach for an ILS-equipped runway, the FMC WON'T autotune the frequency).

 

Mike

 

Think about what would happen if said ILS equipped runway was using alternate approaches for a reason, say ILS maintenance and testing, or an ILS error, and the 777 came along and auto-tuned the ILS whilst doing a VOR or NDB or GPS approach, and the crew, so used to the magenta cross, neglect to follow the actual approach they are supposed to be flying... This is I think why it won't autotune in that case.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

(interestingly, if you select a non-ILS approach for an ILS-equipped runway, the FMC WON'T autotune the frequency).

 

And it definitely shouldn't. There exists in the study of human factors a concept of familiarity and habit. If you're used to having guidance there, you will likely follow it without giving it a second thought. As Wes mentioned, if it is activated for the wrong runway, or if the signal is unreliable (for various reasons: maintenance, testing, etc) it could lead you astray.

 

When I was doing my long cross country for my instrument rating, the final leg was to finish on an RNAV(GPS) approach. Upon departure for the 5 hour triangle of Virginia (ATC revisions/directs shown) the instructor and myself were making comments about how the GPS was acting weird. It was a dual GPS aircraft, and I'd planned the flight to use VORs anyway, so the main unit acting up occasionally was not of any operational concern to the flight. The first flight was a VOR approach, so any anomalies from the GPS were not noted on approach. The second approach was an ILS approach, so again, no GPS issues were noted on the approach. On the leg home, we should have remembered the original issue with the GPS and briefed an RNAV(GPS) LNAV-only approach. The GPS hadn't acted up since the beginning of the flight, and the lateral path was just fine for the whole flight...evidence:

201508013ROAJYO.jpg

 

With a line like that, there's clearly nothing wrong with how the thing is telling where it is - laterally, at least. Vertically, though, it was a different story. I followed the vertical guidance (the GPSs are both WAAS capable, so they had LPV, or "localizer performance with vertical guidance," which offers ILS-like indications and accuracy) and ended up well under the actual glidepath when my position was compared against the charts. Luckily we caught it and leveled out to transition to an LNAV-only approach, but it was tough to ignore that faulty indication.

 

Anyone here who has gone through instrument training with an actual partial instrument failure (better described as an instrument degradation) would probably agree there. If you'd like to try it out yourself, load the sim with hard IFR conditions, and fail your attitude indicator. Shot an approach in the summer this year with an attitude indicator that was partially failed (indicated a turn while level - always check your instruments prior to departure). Even when I noted it prior to departure, it was tough to ignore the habit of leveling the indicator, which would've put me in a turn. Once I got used to it, you can see my track line straighten out significantly, but prior to that, it was a bit wavy.

 

Sounds terribly simple, but eliminating the indication altogether is usually a lot better for avoiding issues stemming from following compromised indications.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this