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While we await the release of the Vertx DA62 here is an article from Flying Dec 2015 of the real thing.
We Fly: Diamond DA62

 

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5 hours ago, pracines said:

No it does not mean the Vertx G1000 is up to date, because a G1000 will store airport approach and departure procedures and these are updated monthly.

FSAerodata can only update DEFAULT P3D GPS units.

Maybe there will be an announcement, but until then, FSAerodata DOES NOT update the Vertx G1000 with approach/departure procedures.

 

The fsaerodata will update all your sid/stars and iap's and fixes

Also about the a2a rain ...  It doesn't work with multi engine planes yet because of an issue with how the props clear the windscreen

Edited by ryanbatcund
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6 hours ago, rudi0310 said:

testers who might acknowledge or correct me. FSAerodata users, please correct me, if I am wrong.

You are correct on how fsaerodata works.

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Waiting for the release and looking at the screenshots, what Sean has created is an absolute masterpiece, a true revolution in visual rendering and G1000 modeling.This is by far the best model I have ever seen in any simulator. I'm sure there will be much more to be impressed with when we get this in our hands. The website is also the best I've seen in any simulator aircraft. A joy to look at. I can't thank him enough for this top class job that he has done. 

Edited by Daedalus
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5 hours ago, rudi0310 said:

Regarding LPV I can say nothing at the moment.

To me, all have been said at the Vertx website. Isn't that right?.

44320959570_99e4718448_b.jpg

Cheers, Ed

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1 hour ago, ryanbatcund said:

The fsaerodata will update all your sid/stars and iap's and fixes

Then I'm good to go.:biggrin:

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Not to sound redundant here. From the fsAerodata FAQ. https://www.fsaerodata.com/faqs-main-2

What Navaids are updated?
Instrument Approaches, SIDs Departures, STAR Arrivals worldwide. Airways, Enroute VORs, NDBs, Waypoints, Terminal Navaids, Magnetic variation, TACANs, Runway designators or heading, ILS frequencies,  Navaids frequencies. Obsolete navaids disabled.

BTW Whenever updating/reinstalling P3D versions (scenery) it will overwrite all updated fsAerodata files. So afterwards you'll have to rerun the fsAerodata app to update.

Edited by BillS511

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3 minutes ago, BillS511 said:

Not to sound redundant here. From the fsAerodata FAQ. https://www.fsaerodata.com/faqs-main-2

What Navaids are updated?
Instrument Approaches, SIDs Departures, STAR Arrivals worldwide. Airways, Enroute VORs, NDBs, Waypoints, Terminal Navaids, Magnetic variation, TACANs, Runway designators or heading, ILS frequencies,  Navaids frequencies. Obsolete navaids disabled.

BTW Whenever updating/reinstalling P3D versions (scenery) it will overwrite all updated fsAerodata files. So afterwards you'll have to rerun the fsAerodata app to update.

No doubt there, the doubt was whether the procedures were reflected in the Vertx G1000 - you see A2As GPS is not updated by FSAerodata and Carenado GPS's need to be updated by Navigraph.

It appears Vertx is doing it different - amazes me that A2A does not do this; it must be a very difficult thing to have a GPS just work off the P3D data.

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XP11 has a unified navigation database. No gauge developer ever had to worry about including nav data in the gauge since it could just be read directly from the sim. In contrast other than a few minor exceptions (like Center frequencies), nav data was contained in individual BGL files containing from one to dozens of airports grouped geographically. This design made it easy for 3rd party developers to update a single airport, but it made updating the entire navaid database process a major nightmare. Except for minor edits, MS and subsequently LM left the navaid database unchanged. This forced gauge (mostly GPS and FMC units) developers to turn to Navigraph to update each aircraft's navaid data with each new AIRAC.

fsaerodata is an add-on which updates the entire FSX/P3d navigation database with every AIRAC. It's too bad that the concept behind fsaerodata wasn't adopted by LM because then each gauge would not need its own Navigraph file. But that's water over the dam at this point. If I was LM I would just license fsaerodata and then tell other developers to rely on that.

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Hi Guys. First I just want to say thanks for the many supportive emails and posts over the last few weeks. I've been keeping off the forums in an effort to get things done as quickly as possible. The last 1 or 2% of the DA62’s development has taken much longer than expected—which I probably should have expected because that is always the case…

I thought I should provide some definitive answers to some of the main concerns. I'm sure many of you will already know a lot of what I am about to say but I just want to be as clear as possible regarding some of the questions raised.

Regarding the navaid database—The Vertx G1000 uses the internal navaid database—the same database used by the default P3D GPS. Included in that database are approach procedures, so basically any GPS in P3D that relies on the internal database will use the internal approach database. 

If you want to update the internal database, that can be done via FSAerodata or the free Aero Sors update. FSAerodata updates all navaid data, including approaches, and adds new departure and arrival procedures. I don't personally have experience with Aer Sors so I am unsure what it updates. With FSAerodata installed into P3D, the Vertx G1000 will have up-to-date navaids and approach procedures. At this point in time the Vertx G1000 does not include support for the FSAerodata SIDs and STARs (see below).

I do hope to continue adding features to the G1000 over the coming months and years, and an updated navaid database is a top priority. There are two paths that can be taken here. The first is to add further support for FSAerodata. To implement FSAerodata SIDs and STARS in a GPS, the GPS developer needs to add support for that. With the G1000, that's not a small job. New pages need to be coded to allow the user to browse, select and activate SIDs/STARS, and these pages need to be coded specifically to work with the new FSAerodata SID/STAR database. Whether this is worth doing will really depend on customer feedback, and whether there is sufficient demand. At this stage I don't know how many people are using FSAerodata.

The alternative to adding further FSAerodata support is to move to an external Navigraph database. That is a very big job but it could be worth doing - the internal navaid and approach database is tremendously difficult to work with. Once the aircraft is released and I start getting more customer feedback, I should have a better feel for which is the better direction to take. I need to point out here that this has been a mostly solo project and there are only so many hours in the day, so I have to pick what I work on very carefully.

Regarding LPV approaches—as has been pointed out there is no data in the default navaid database for this type of approach. What I have done is create simulated LPV approaches for certain GPS approach types. The Vertx G1000 code takes the final approach fix altitude of certain GPS approaches, and uses that to calculate an approach glidepath to the runway. So as far as the pilot is concerned the Vertx G1000 functions the same as a real life G1000 when it comes to LPV approaches, aside from certain caveats regarding the approach database as mentioned above. WAAS/EGNOS augmentation is not a concern because (unlike real life GPS) the P3D GPS is perfectly accurate straight out of the box, and as a P3D developer you have access to perfectly accurate aircraft position data.

I hope to add other features in the future, such as SVS, weather radar, and traffic. But the goal up to this point has been to get the current aircraft released. What I have really concentrated on getting right is the core G1000 usability—that it's nice to use, that text is clear and readable, that you can zoom right into it without it becoming blurry or jaggy, that the animations are all smooth and precise, that the maps work nicely and so on. In particular if you like flying IFR by hand (rather than autopilot) it's a joy to use. While at the moment it doesn't have 100% of the real G1000's functionality, the functionality that is does have is very realistic. I spent a huge amount of time on the official Garmin sim to make sure that when it comes to button press sequences and so on, it works as closely to the real thing as I could manage.

 

Sean Moloney

Vertx

 

 

 

 

Edited by Sean Moloney
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I'm not one to split hairs over a navigation database. When it comes down to it, on paper and preview pictures, what you have done looks to be a top quality DA-62 that I will love to fly. Up until this very thread, I didn't even know what FSAerodata was. I just have a subscription to Navigraph and if an aircraft I own doesn't support it, it's not the end of the world. But it sure is nice 🙂

Best of luck with the upcomming release!

Edited by PWJT8D
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product looks good.

don't understand the nav database currency obsession, sounds like a deal breaker for many here...

getting a decent g1000 gauge package without fps getting hammered is more important?

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35 minutes ago, Sean Moloney said:

Hi Guys. First I just want to say thanks for the many supportive emails and posts over the last few weeks. I've been keeping off the forums in an effort to get things done as quickly as possible. The last 1 or 2% of the DA62’s development has taken much longer than expected—which I probably should have expected because that is always the case…

I thought I should provide some definitive answers to some of the main concerns. I'm sure many of you will already know a lot of what I am about to say but I just want to be as clear as possible regarding some of the questions raised.

Regarding the navaid database—The Vertx G1000 uses the internal navaid database—the same database used by the default P3D GPS. Included in that database are approach procedures, so basically any GPS in P3D that relies on the internal database will use the internal approach database. 

If you want to update the internal database, that can be done via FSAerodata or the free Aero Sors update. FSAerodata updates all navaid data, including approaches, and adds new departure and arrival procedures. I don't personally have experience with Aer Sors so I am unsure what it updates. With FSAerodata installed into P3D, the Vertx G1000 will have up-to-date navaids and approach procedures. At this point in time the Vertx G1000 does not include support for the FSAerodata SIDs and STARs (see below).

I do hope to continue adding features to the G1000 over the coming months and years, and an updated navaid database is a top priority. There are two paths that can be taken here. The first is to add further support for FSAerodata. To implement FSAerodata SIDs and STARS in a GPS, the GPS developer needs to add support for that. With the G1000, that's not a small job. New pages need to be coded to allow the user to browse, select and activate SIDs/STARS, and these pages need to be coded specifically to work with the new FSAerodata SID/STAR database. Whether this is worth doing will really depend on customer feedback, and whether there is sufficient demand. At this stage I don't know how many people are using FSAerodata.

The alternative to adding further FSAerodata support is to move to an external Navigraph database. That is a very big job but it could be worth doing - the internal navaid and approach database is tremendously difficult to work with. Once the aircraft is released and I start getting more customer feedback, I should have a better feel for which is the better direction to take. I need to point out here that this has been a mostly solo project and there are only so many hours in the day, so I have to pick what I work on very carefully.

Regarding LPV approaches—as has been pointed out there is no data in the default navaid database for this type of approach. What I have done is create simulated LPV approaches for certain GPS approach types. The Vertx G1000 code takes the final approach fix altitude of certain GPS approaches, and uses that to calculate an approach glidepath to the runway. So as far as the pilot is concerned the Vertx G1000 functions the same as a real life G1000 when it comes to LPV approaches, aside from certain caveats regarding the approach database as mentioned above. WAAS/EGNOS augmentation is not a concern because (unlike real life GPS) the P3D GPS is perfectly accurate straight out of the box, and as a P3D developer you have access to perfectly accurate aircraft position data.

I hope to add other features in the future, such as SVS, weather radar, and traffic. But the goal up to this point has been to get the current aircraft released. What I have really concentrated on getting right is the core G1000 usability—that it's nice to use, that text is clear and readable, that you can zoom right into it without it becoming blurry or jaggy, that the animations are all smooth and precise, that the maps work nicely and so on. In particular if you like flying IFR by hand (rather than autopilot) it's a joy to use. While at the moment it doesn't have 100% of the real G1000's functionality, the functionality that is does have is very realistic. I spent a huge amount of time on the official Garmin sim to make sure that when it comes to button press sequences and so on, it works as closely to the real thing as I could manage.

 

Sean Moloney

Vertx

 

 

 

 

Sean,

Thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule for explaining all that you are doing with your DA62 + G1000.  Looking forward to release day, I have been showing my wife the real videos about this aircraft.  I can not believe that I never knew about DA62 till I saw the youtube beta videos of your work.

Again, I am not fully versed in the complete aviation navigational know how - but dealing with Navigraph will be the best imho for example, I believe G1000 can show charts in real life, and with navigraph chart subscription the charts will show up (as PMDG 747-8 is doing).  You get the source data directly.  The best solution is talk to the developers of FSAerodata & Navigraph and figure something out.  Maybe even official Diamond Aircraft company employees can help.

From what I can tell - you have put lot of time on this project (and on the amazing website).  We all are looking forward and super excited to see your work in action.

Thank you 

Skywolf

Edited by Skywolf

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Hi Sean,

Thanks for taking the time to post on this thread.

When you get the time I would also add my +1 for the Navigraph approach (pun intended 🙄)

In the meantime looking forward to many hours flying your new plane.

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23 minutes ago, PaulFWatts said:

Hi Sean,

Thanks for taking the time to post on this thread.

When you get the time I would also add my +1 for the Navigraph approach (pun intended 🙄)

In the meantime looking forward to many hours flying your new plane.

That's definitely the preferred option. I need to look into what's involved in more detail before I'm able to make any promises. As it is the Vertx G1000 uses its own flight planner logic and makes its own flight plan tracking calculations (for the enroute phase at least), and most of the autopilot functions are custom coded, so it's already part way to being removed from the default GPS logic.

 

Sean

 

 

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+1 for Navigraph too, mainly because of additional costs that FSAerodata brings. 😉 I can buy a Navigraph cycle once a year or once a decade and keep on using it and reinstalling it. AFAIK FSAerodata needs an active Navigrpah subscription at the moment of install (afaik you can't reinstall FSAerodata later on, after a system reinstall, like you can with Navigraph). So you need to buy BOTH and you need them both active for a reinstall. Hence my preference for Navigraph support. 😉

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One more vote for navigraph. I fly only online so an up-to-date cycle is necessary and in my opinion navigraph is the best. Pay for your subscription and you are good all year long for all your products. Thanks for your considering it!

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+1 for Navigraph

They have a very dedicated Team which I think is necessary to support developers. 

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Thanks for the update Sean. 

Upto date navdata is important ultimately but certainly not a dealbreaker. 

One very important piece of information is missing though. WILL SANTA BE ABLE TO BRING ME THIS MUCH ANTICIPATED ADD ON??

cheers

Dean

Edited by Dean33
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Congrats to Sean for being so clear about what to expect for the upcoming DA-62.

I'm also +1 for the Navigraph solution, it's cheaper for the users and we could have all the navdata add-ons cycles available on a single site.

Cheers, Ed

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9 hours ago, Sean Moloney said:

I thought I should provide some definitive answers to some of the main concerns. I'm sure many of you will already know a lot of what I am about to say but I just want to be as clear as possible regarding some of the questions raised.

This is what I call integrity. 

Every developer has the right to defend their product tooth and nail to the very last, but to concede that a feature was not included, and NOT make excuses as to why the product is "better without", but instead to work towards that inclusion at a later time when resources and time permit the investment is very commendable, it's just outstanding from my point of view. 

Now it's up to the community to make sure that they support this developer so that the resources they need to add these features they feel are so strongly about (myself included), do become available at some point in the future.  

Good on you Mr. Moloney.  I have the "competitors" product, but you sir have earned my patronage, and I will purchase your's as well based on this statement of clarity, and because I want to add my support to your continued development.    

To those who insist the feature is not important, please realize that actual pilots who use simulators to practice procedures are also part of this community and deserve to be heard. (+1 for navigraph data)

Best of fortunes to VERTXSIM!   

Edited by jalbino59
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11 hours ago, Sean Moloney said:

don't personally have experience with Aer Sors so I am unsure what it updates

It is a subset of what fsaerodata does and only updates NDBs, VORs, runway identifiers, and ILS information.

It seems more clear now that even though fsaerodata provides arrival and  departure updates via Navigraph, the G1000 will not utilize this information, at least for the initial release. But the good news is that all other navigation data for default airports will continue to match the current AIRAC.

 

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1 hour ago, jabloomf1230 said:

It seems more clear now that even though fsaerodata provides arrival and  departure updates via Navigraph, the G1000 will not utilize this information, at least for the initial release. But the good news is that all other navigation data for default airports will continue to match the current AIRAC.

Correct, AFAIK.

 

4 hours ago, Dean33 said:

WILL SANTA BE ABLE TO BRING ME THIS MUCH ANTICIPATED ADD ON??

Be sure that Sean reads all my postings in detail. And corrects if anything is not accurate. Also the announcement on the website is still valid.

But...

(I am one of these old bags who always responds by long exhaustive stories from "good old times" to the grandson`s questions)

More than 30 years ago, the water pump of my car needed to be replaced. How long does that take? Loosen 8 screws, replace the pump, tighten 8 screws. 10 minutes? It turned out that the blower and the cooler has to be removed first. It turned out that to remove the cooler, other parts have to be removed first... After removing the pump it turned out, that the paper seal was damaged and firmly burned at the engine block. And no replacement at hands... OAT was -20 deg c. During these two evenings.

 

To support Sean so he can continue his excellent work.

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8 minutes ago, rudi0310 said:

More than 30 years ago, the water pump of my car needed to be replaced. How long does that take? Loosen 8 screws, replace the pump, tighten 8 screws. 10 minutes? It turned out that the blower and the cooler has to be removed first. It turned out that to remove the cooler, other parts have to be removed first... After removing the pump it turned out, that the paper seal was damaged and firmly burned at the engine block. And no replacement at hands... OAT was -20 deg c. During these two evenings.

Lol - Being totally cryptic here on the launch date.  From what I can tell - 8 days from now.... or in 2 days (either way that that makes it early December)

Edited by Skywolf

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32 minutes ago, Skywolf said:

Lol - Being totally cryptic here on the launch date.  From what I can tell - 8 days from now.... or in 2 days (either way that that makes it early December)

30-8+8+10-20+2=22 22 hours.

Edited by BillS511
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