36 minutes ago, TechguyMaxC said:

Do you have a screenshot of task manager that shows the activity you speak of?

No, it was a reading from the same overlay Rob uses. I agree that for most users at the moment 16Gb is enough, but as I said it can be pushed higher, and my input was based on future proofing the system not just for P3D4.5

1 minute ago, TechguyMaxC said:

Task manager is a bad way to look at RAM usage?  Why do you say that?  It provides an accurate measure of RAM utilization across all running processes in real-time.  What are the technical deficiencies of task manager's resource utilization reporting, as you see them?

 

As for DCS - you're comparing apples and oranges there.

 

As for your problems with 8GB RAM, that was 8GB RAM.  No one is recommending Dominik (or anyone else) use only 8GB RAM.  16GB is the sweet spot.  I don't see your argument here.  It seems to me that you're conflating a problem you once encountered with a demonstrably inadequate quantity of RAM with what is pretty much universally accepted as the correct amount of RAM for enthusiast P3D simmers that make use of numerous complex add-ons simultaneously.  

I've said more than once that 16GB today is fine, looking forward more than 6 months IMO 16Gb is short-sighted. Agree or disagree and in my case I also use DCS and it clearly needs 32GB.

Just now, Nyxx said:

Going back to pentum 333 I've always when for the best GFX but Nvidia charging £1100-£1900 for a RTX 2080Ti is........Also, watch any youtube compare and unless you on 4k your throwing money away that could be put aside for a new card in 2-3 years time to refresh your PC.

Yeah, graphics cards are expensive today and no one likes that.  We can all thank the lack of competition at the high-end for that situation.  As for the 2080 Ti being a waste of money at less than 4k resolution, I disagree.  Dominik mentioned an ultra-wide monitor with (half 4k) resolution.  That's still a lot of pixels to push.  Besides, better to have too much graphical horsepower than not enough and wishing you had spent more money on a faster graphics card.  I never saw anyone complain that their graphics card was "too fast" 😄

2 minutes ago, kevinfirth said:

No, it was a reading from the same overlay Rob uses. I agree that for most users at the moment 16Gb is enough, but as I said it can be pushed higher, and my input was based on future proofing the system not just for P3D4.5

Allow me to spell it out then.  I've seen Rob claim this, and a few other people parrot Rob's claims.  Does anyone have proof of this claim?

Are you implying Rob is misleading us?

The only way someone can justify a 2080Ti for P3D imo is with 4k, with 2k P3D would run fine on 2070s or a 2080s, the bang for bucks on a 2k to a 2080Ti is silly. Totaly overkill. Show me just how many more FPS on a 2k screen your going to gain on a 2080Ti over a 2070s/2080s or options you can turn ON, I can only think of the EXP 10 tweak and that's not worth it. Not for £500 and the huge increase in load time for very very little difference.

One second you saying buy 2080Ti because " Besides, better to have too much graphical horsepower than not enough" and then your implying stay with 16Gb. It makes no logical sense for someone to buy the best RTX and then short change the RAM. then you could say just the same "Well better to have too much RAM horsepower than not enough" ?

You are happy to recommend someone to spent £500-£1000 more on an RTX 2080Ti and recommend them not spending £100-£200 more on super-fast RAM. Really!

Edited August 2, 20196 yr by Nyxx

21 minutes ago, TechguyMaxC said:

Allow me to spell it out then.  I've seen Rob claim this, and a few other people parrot Rob's claims.  Does anyone have proof of this claim?

I'm not parroting anyone it was my own observation on my own system. If you choose not to believe me then fair enough, it's no skin off my nose 🙂 

38 minutes ago, TechguyMaxC said:

I never saw anyone complain that their graphics card was "too fast" 😄

No, but many people have claimed that the RTX 2080ti was too expensive, given the incremental performance benefit. 

7 minutes ago, Nyxx said:

One second you saying buy 2080Ti because " Besides, better to have too much graphical horsepower than not enough" and then your implying stay with 16Gb. It makes no logical sense for someone to buy the best RTX and then short change the RAM. then you could say just the same "Well better to have too much RAM horsepower than not enough" ?

Not a great analogy between memory and GPU capability...P3D can still bring a 2080Ti to its knees with the right settings on a 4K display, and having reserve horsepower even in a less aggressive configuration greatly reduces the number of times when GPU utilization gets saturated to the point of inducing stutters.  Having an extra 16GB of RAM sitting out there doing nothing has no effect at all.

I have yet to see total RAM usage come anywhere close to the 16GB mark in P3Dv4 on Win 10, with a fairly high-end system, aggressive settings, and close to 300 add-on airports.  I opted for 16GB because there are options for good fast 16GB RAM kits that don't exist for 32GB kits, and the overclock drill for 2-DIMM setups is generally less likely to be a problem than with 4-DIMM setups.  *If* the day ever comes that i discover I need 32GB while the current rig is still in use, I can upgrade (with a likely compromise in my memory overclock).

The 32GB as a future-proofing move did not pan out when I did it on my i7-7700K build several years ago, and I don't see anything on the horizon that's likely to change that.  if it does, it's a minor problem that won't require anything more to fix than swapping out a few memory DIMMs.

Regards

 

21 minutes ago, Nyxx said:

Are you implying Rob is misleading us?

The only way someone can justify a 2080Ti for P3D imo is with 4k, with 2k P3D would run fine on 2070s or a 2080s, the bang for bucks on a 2k to a 2080Ti is silly. Totaly overkill. Show me just how many more FPS on a 2k screen your going to gain on a 2080Ti over a 2070s/2080s or options you can turn ON, I can only think of the EXP 10 tweak and that's not worth it. Not for £500 and the huge increase in load time for very very little difference.

One second you saying buy 2080Ti because " Besides, better to have too much graphical horsepower than not enough" and then your implying stay with 16Gb. It makes no logical sense for someone to buy the best RTX and then short change the RAM. then you could say just the same "Well better to have too much RAM horsepower than not enough" ?

You are happy to recommend someone to spent £500-£1000 more on an RTX 2080Ti and recommend them not spending £100-£200 more on super-fast RAM. Really!

This isn't a subjective issue.  Either there is benefit to > 16GB RAM for P3D, or there isn't.  All I'm asking for is proof.  If you *can't* provide it, that tells me everything I need to know.  Others can draw their own conclusions.

As for not recommending someone buy fast RAM - show me where I did that.  Show me where one time I said "don't buy fast RAM". Go back and read this thread again.  Read my RAM recommendations.  

What I have said is that MORE RAM may not be beneficial.  Quantity and speed are not equivocal.  

 

16 minutes ago, kevinfirth said:

I'm not parroting anyone it was my own observation on my own system. If you choose not to believe me then fair enough, it's no skin off my nose 🙂 

Should be a pretty simple matter to demonstrate your claim.  Firing up the sim + add-ons, loading a scenario, and taking a screenshot and uploading it takes a few minutes.  If you're simming anyway the only extra step is to take a screenshot and upload it - what, 2 minutes?  

3 minutes ago, jabloomf1230 said:

No, but many people have claimed that the RTX 2080ti was too expensive, given the incremental performance benefit. 

And I never disagreed.  Not sure what there is to argue here?

Halo products have always been disproportionately more expensive in EVERY consumer market.  You pay a "luxury tax" to have "the best" of anything.  This isn't news.

18 minutes ago, TechguyMaxC said:

This isn't a subjective issue.  Either there is benefit to > 16GB RAM for P3D, or there isn't.  All I'm asking for is proof.  If you *can't* provide it, that tells me everything I need to know.  Others can draw their own conclusions.

As for not recommending someone buy fast RAM - show me where I did that.  Show me where one time I said "don't buy fast RAM". Go back and read this thread again.  Read my RAM recommendations.  

What I have said is that MORE RAM may not be beneficial.  Quantity and speed are not equivocal.  

 

Should be a pretty simple matter to demonstrate your claim.  Firing up the sim + add-ons, loading a scenario, and taking a screenshot and uploading it takes a few minutes.  If you're simming anyway the only extra step is to take a screenshot and upload it - what, 2 minutes?  

Apart from the fact you assume Im at my PC and not half way round the world in a developing country that's superbly simple yes 😉 I'm approximately 4,000 miles away from my sim machine LOL

Anyway, let's not get combative about this, observations are what they are.  I'm interested though, do you dispute that it is possible to get a system to use more than 16Gb?

Edited August 2, 20196 yr by kevinfirth

6 minutes ago, kevinfirth said:

Apart from the fact you assume Im at my PC and not half way round the world in a developing country that's superbly simple yes 😉 I'm approximately 4,000 miles away from my sim machine LOL

Anyway, let's not get combative about this, observations are what they are.  I'm interested though, do you dispute that it is possible to get a system to use more than 16Gb?

I'm not trying to be combative, and you're not the only person in this thread making this claim.  I just find it interesting that I have seen this claim made by a number of people but no one has ever bothered to post a simple screenshot, so I'm asking for said screenshot.  If you're unable to post it now, no worries.  Your previous response indicated to me that you were uninterested in doing so at all, hence my pushback.

I run 16gb 4266 c16 on my old X299 a run 32gb 4x8gb 4000mhz c16 , had no problem with the faster 2x8 !6gb 

gpu i run a single 2080Ti 4k but i begin to bottleneck it this weekend a do a rebuild change my 2080TI with micron mems to a SLI config take 2 of the bench GPU.s to the SIM.

To get a wellbalanced system cashe is one but you need the system run ok , the cashe i run is multi 50 , no critic to Rob but his cpu Timespy score was way off 11.4k at 5.2ghz  at that point when he showed the results , think hi get all things right now.

 

38 minutes ago, w6kd said:

Not a great analogy between memory and GPU capability...P3D can still bring a 2080Ti to its knees with the right settings on a 4K display, and having reserve horsepower even in a less aggressive configuration greatly reduces the number of times when GPU utilization gets saturated to the point of inducing stutters.  Having an extra 16GB of RAM sitting out there doing nothing has no effect at all.

I have yet to see total RAM usage come anywhere close to the 16GB mark in P3Dv4 on Win 10, with a fairly high-end system, aggressive settings, and close to 300 add-on airports.  I opted for 16GB because there are options for good fast 16GB RAM kits that don't exist for 32GB kits, and the overclock drill for 2-DIMM setups is generally less likely to be a problem than with 4-DIMM setups.  *If* the day ever comes that i discover I need 32GB while the current rig is still in use, I can upgrade (with a likely compromise in my memory overclock).

The 32GB as a future-proofing move did not pan out when I did it on my i7-7700K build several years ago, and I don't see anything on the horizon that's likely to change that.  if it does, it's a minor problem that won't require anything more to fix than swapping out a few memory DIMMs.

Regards

 

I have said countless times for P3D right now 16GB is fine, I've also pointed out with a link that DCS right now needs 32GB. 2080Ti on less than a 4k is totally overkilling and at around £500 -£1000 is money badly spent. IMO investing £100-£200 extra makes far more sense than wasting £500-£1000 on a 2080Ti for 2k.

Its also a minor problem Swapping out an RTX for another come the day it needs doing.

17 minutes ago, TechguyMaxC said:

I'm not trying to be combative, and you're not the only person in this thread making this claim.  I just find it interesting that I have seen this claim made by a number of people but no one has ever bothered to post a simple screenshot, so I'm asking for said screenshot.  If you're unable to post it now, no worries.  Your previous response indicated to me that you were uninterested in doing so at all, hence my pushback.

I definitely made it happen of that I can assure you. If I can do it again I'll happily post a screenshot, but it will be some time before I will be able to try I'm afraid.  The fastest PC where I am now would struggle with anything more demanding than FS98... ;)