In-game VS Satellite

[Shack95 2,665]

Larsen Bay AK, USA

[Dominique_K 10,152]

Just now, Shack95 said:

Larsen Bay AK, USA

 

Google Earth shows a floatplane along the beach. Just sayin' hey, no pressure Asobo ! 

 

[jjn47 24]

 

[Farlis 2,319]

Seems to me that the AI needs to learn about arctic vegetation.

[Claviateur 789]

11 minutes ago, Farlis said:

Seems to me that the AI needs to learn about arctic vegetation.

The question is not learning, the question is how many types are available for now in the vegetation library... If let's say you have 3 tree types in your vegetation library for the whole world and your real world database or AI scanning or OSM or any souce features 100 types of trees for the world, you will unfortunately have to divide the 100 types into 3 because your visual assets only feature 3... This an example, of course...

[Dominique_K 10,152]

3 minutes ago, Claviateur said:

The question is not learning, the question is how many types are available for now in the vegetation 

The question is to teach the AI when to add or not to add trees when it sees a patch of green. The tiny island on the right side of the cannery has no tree in the real world. 

https://www.flyadq.com/flight-information/destinations/larsen-bay/

[Claviateur 789]

3 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

The question is to teach the AI when to add or not to add trees when it sees a patch of green. The tiny island on the right side of the cannery has no tree in the real world. 

https://www.flyadq.com/flight-information/destinations/larsen-bay/

The AI does not add, it scans aerial imagery and determines the vegetation zones (polygons) like the footprints. Depending on the quality of the aerial imagery the zone is precise or rough. 

[Claviateur 789]

In Open Street Map (OSM) the vegetation zone added manually by a human contributor, is defined as forest.  

https://www.openstreetmap.org/query?lat=57.5364&lon=-153.9666#map=15/57.5341/-153.9692

Now I see a very similar zone filled with evergreen in the screenshot of MSFS. I am not saying Asobo used OSM data but the covered zone is roughly the same. 

[CaptMatto 238]

7 hours ago, Dominique_K said:

Google Earth shows a floatplane along the beach. Just sayin' hey, no pressure Asobo ! 

 

I am going to do the SLOWEST MEANDERING round the world trip ever once this comes out! I truly cannot wait to explore all these places!

Who's in?

[jlund 381]

It's not an excuse, but the ai will NEVER be able to get every place in the world correct. We'll all come over places that we know well, and will probably see things that isn't like in real life, BUT for people who doesn't know the excact place, it doesn't matter. I have no idea on how ie.Larsen Bay in Alaska looks, so I'll probably don't care if the vegatation isn't 100% correct. 

[sightseer 895]

not to mention the fact that things are constantly changing so even if the world could be recreated exactly as in some set of data, in a few weeks time it would be wrong again.

You cant  have everything. Where would you put it? - Steven Wright

[jlund 381]

Not to mention that we have never had a sim that looked anything near this, so I can live with the "inperfections" that may be in it.

[Claviateur 789]

57 minutes ago, jlund said:

It's not an excuse, but the ai will NEVER be able to get every place in the world correct. We'll all come over places that we know well, and will probably see things that isn't like in real life, BUT for people who doesn't know the excact place, it doesn't matter. I have no idea on how ie.Larsen Bay in Alaska looks, so I'll probably don't care if the vegatation isn't 100% correct. 

Absolutely...

This global scenery generation process is impossible to control or test on a granular level unless the super detailed data is met with super detailed assets library and super detailed scripting conditions... And still... 

As you said, me too, as a virtual tourist in this virtual world, I will never know that this pretty landscape is not a 100% match of the real thing because I will never check every step I make in the sim...Well except for my area of interest for which I will create custom stuff... Hopefully...

[Dominique_K 10,152]

2 hours ago, Claviateur said:

The AI does not add, it scans aerial imagery and determines the vegetation zones (polygons) like the footprints. Depending on the quality of the aerial imagery the zone is precise or rough. 

 

1 hour ago, Claviateur said:

In Open Street Map (OSM) the vegetation zone added manually by a human contributor, is defined as forest.  

https://www.openstreetmap.org/query?lat=57.5364&lon=-153.9666#map=15/57.5341/-153.9692

Now I see a very similar zone filled with evergreen in the screenshot of MSFS. I am not saying Asobo used OSM data but the covered zone is roughly the same. 

We enter an amazing age where AI will do much,much more than identifying vegetation footprints, to draw polygons for instance it will classify trees for land management. Alaska would be a good proving ground btw as the number of species is very limited.  To see trees where there is none is not a major flaw as the AI is young and needs to mature, to learn. One of the many fascinating facets of FS20 is to see how on the long run the AI will reproduce the planet and thus transform scenery making.  OSM might to the AI what the CD is to streaming. Passé.

 One thing we also have to remember is that beyond all the flaws, for the first time a flight simulator should allow us to fly where we have never flown before. For that I am ready to accept a few errors here and there in the choice of vegetation 😉.

 

1 hour ago, Matt Barraud said:

I am going to do the SLOWEST MEANDERING round the world trip ever once this comes out! I truly cannot wait to explore all these places!

Who's in?

Yes, for the first time I will also try to circumvent the world flying routes which are awful in today's sims (thinking of Central Asia for instance).  

 

[Claviateur 789]

15 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

We enter an amazing age where AI will do much,much more than identifying vegetation footprints, to draw polygons for instance it will classify trees for land management. Alaska would be a good proving ground btw as the number of species is very limited.  To see trees where there is none is not a major flaw as the AI is young and needs to mature, to learn. One of the many fascinating facets of FS20 is to see how on the long run the AI will reproduce the planet and thus transform scenery making.  OSM might to the AI what the CD is to streaming. Passé.

You might be right and the data fetched by the AI might be very sophisticated as we speak but if this is the case, then the reason why we see what we see in this or any screenshot, could be caused by at least one of the following reasons, based on my knowledge with how this global scenery is done (from any data source) :

1- As I suggested above, the types of vegetation could be (still) limited. Thus no matter how detailed the AI scanning result or any data source will be, if this is not matched by equivalent amount of variated visual assets, the result will remain rough and approximate.

And / Or 

2- The scripting to generate this procedural world from the fancy data does not have (yet) sophisticated rules or sub-conditions and sub-filters to go deep into small regions on this planet. 

Edit: The rules and filters could go down to a specific vegetation zone(s). i.e: using all its tags or making it one type... Or grouping small zones together for the sake of performance...

So data alone, as fancy as it could be, would never by itself give a result because it must be translated into a visual representation using scripting + visual assets...

So I could be mistaken but in MSFS the AI does not generate visual scenery. Asobo do from the available data with scripting they type themselves for the engine to understand and thus to render visual elements...

Edited June 3, 2020 by Claviateur