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martin-w

Now this is an interesting UFO documentary.

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Drip, drip, drip.

It's coming.

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I noticed as triangular vehicle was egressing the area it appeared that it was leaving contrails from multiple engines.  That suggests it has air breathing engines.  It was just brief glimpse.  I would like to have seen more of the vehicle leaving the area.

I would also like to see daylight pictures of the triangular vehicle.  It seems these things only appear at night.  And sometimes night after night.  Where are they hiding in the daytime?  At some isolated Air Force Base or behind the moon?

It's popular to say these vehicles have advanced technology we don't have.  But do we really don't have it?  So much secrecy and misinformation surrounds military development that people like us don't have a clue so whatever we haven't seen before we attribute to space aliens because if we possessed the knowledge and technology we would know about it, right?

Noel

 

Edited by birdguy
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My friend was on an exercise that night at the base where that sighting occurred at Cosford, he said there was definitely some mad stuff going on there in terms of people running about and being alarmed. It's worth bearing in mind however, that (at the time) there were fact two military bases with their entrances adjacent to one another there, one was Cosford and other one was the main SAS base, Stirling Lines. I used to go there a fair bit years ago and rather unsurprisingly, security is fairly tight for obvious reasons.

So there is plenty of reason for freaky military ops there there. There would certainly have been some operations at that location which would remain highly classified, thus not part of the records which could be easily examined even by people with a very high clearance to look at records. Some records in the UK don't get released for a long time (occasionally never).

The standard protocol for secret stuff in the UK, is the 'thirty year rule', which following the Freedom of Information Act in 2000, amended the reach of the Official Secrets Act so that only things which genuinely were 'in the public interest' being kept secret could genuinely call upon this reason to prevent them from being released to public record after thirty years and thus being in that vault you see in the film. So what you are seeing in this film is the public record stuff in the  archive; not the stuff which requires other clearances, as evidenced by the fact that they are filming in there and conducting an interview in the records vault.

Thus when people say that there is no official explanation for something, this does not mean there is no explanation at all, it just means there is no explanation available which might be contained in still classified documentation which has not been released to the public.

We also have to bear in mind that, as noted in the film, there are occasions where people who were witnesses to stuff get things wrong for any number of reasons, such as confirmation bias, and of course things we recall from years before are prone to being embellished when we have indulged in such human tendencies. 

Anyone call be susceptible to this. I am sure you have heard of witnesses to things sometimes reporting wildly differing recollections of events in spite of being genuinely honest in their intent to say what happened, such as people saying a getaway car was several different colours and that sort of thing, or sometimes not even seeing stuff at all when it was right in front of them. I did this once when witnessing a crash where I went to recue the people from it, which is a good illustration of how inaccurate you can be as a witness. Here's what happened:

I saw a car go across a set of lights on red at night. It got clipped on its back end by a motorhome which was going though the lights on green. The car skidded back and forth a couple of times as the driver over-controlled the skid, then it flipped over, rolled several times, skidded along the road on its roof and eventually came to a halt upside down. I immediately ran up the road to pull the people out of this car and help them even before it had come to a halt, despite my girlfriend at the time yelling to me not to do so because petrol was pouring out of its tank and sparks were coming off the shorted out battery whilst it was upside down, thus making it potentially possible for it to burst into flames or explode.

When I got to the car as it came to a halt, I immediately headed to the drivers door, which was crushed and so would not open, but it had a broken window, so reached into the car to try to get the people out, moments later a guy intent on doing the same thing as me reached the passenger door and also reached in from that side. We were both puzzled to find that there was no-one in the car at all, in spite of us looking in the footwells, rear seats etc. Bizarrely, I have a vivid recollection of there being loads of fluorescent green tennis balls in the thing, on the roof lining and the back window, which is another indication of us as humans taking in some weird stuff in certain situations.

Both that other guy and myself were so intent on watching the crashing car and running up to help the persons in it, that were literally never saw the other car which had followed it through the red light, stopped alongside the crashed car, nor saw the guy getting out of the crashed car, jumping into the other car which then sped off, yet numerous people confirmed that was what had occurred. Apparently he had stolen the car and his mates were in the other car behind it. Neither me or that other guy could recall having seen that other car at all when we spoke to the police who attended the incident, and we were literally the first people to get to the crash and had no desire to report things inaccurately or be dishonest about what we saw.

So what that tells you is that you tend to tune out what you think is not factually important to you when observing things in stressful situations, and that you can become so focused on what you believe to be the case, that you sometimes won't see what is right in front of you. Effectively having your own version of events which might very well not match reality. Sometimes you only see what you want to see.

This doesn't absolutely mean there wasn't some freaky alien ship over that base, but it's far more likely it was some classified military stuff that people saw and they joined the dots up incorrectly because it's 'cool' to have seen something unexplained.

Edited by Chock

Alan Bradbury

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12 hours ago, birdguy said:

It's popular to say these vehicles have advanced technology we don't have.  But do we really don't have it? 

 

The "it's our top secret tech" explanation is a possibility. The only issue is that the manoeuvres these things are claimed to perform are physics defying. Inertia seems to be non-existent, its like they have Star Trek inertial dampeners. So to believe its our top secret tech would require us to believe that the human race had suddenly advanced its technology hundreds of years. And that "in secret" we have technology that 99% of the worlds scientists say isn't possible.

The other point is that these sightings have been occurring, in modern times, for about 80 years, carrying out the same physics defying manoeuvres, so we would have to believe somebody on this planet has had such technology for at least 80 years. 

But it doesn't stop there, even the Roman Empire reported "flying Shields" in the sky carrying out crazy  manoeuvres.

The above is assuming that the reported physics defying stuff is genuine. 

The other point is that these things seem to display their crazy physics directly over populated areas,  active carrier groups and in full view of passenger aircraft. So is that really plausible that the military would expose their top secret aircraft in such a way. Wouldn't they be testing them in the desert somewhere? Would they really fry alongside aircraft and say "look at our top secret plane"? 

Edited by martin-w

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It continues to amaze me...vessels that have travelled at the speed of light, bent space and time, used wormholes, finding Earth like a grain of sand on an infinite beach, require landing / navigation lights when they arrive?? And mainly visit USA?😆

Edited by Peter Webber

Peter Webber

Prepar3D v5 & MSFS / Windows 10 Home Edition / CPU i7-7700K / MSI Z270 XPower Gaming Titanium / Samsung 970 EVO PLUS M.2 500GB / Corsair Vengeance DDR4 32GB 3000MHz / MSI Geforce GTX 1080Ti Gaming X

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2 hours ago, Peter Webber said:

It continues to amaze me...vessels that have travelled at the speed of light, bent space and time, used wormholes, finding Earth like a grain of sand on an infinite beach, require landing / navigation lights when they arrive?? And mainly visit USA?😆

 

Most sighting don't have landing lights. The recent IR triangle video clearly is flashing an aircrafts strobe though. And not a triangle, more like the diaphragm in the lens making it look triangular. And yes, an IR monocle does have a triangular diaphragm. 

And no, I know you jest but it's not mainly the USA. It's a worldwide phenomenon. Plenty here in Europe. 

Edited by martin-w
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4 hours ago, Peter Webber said:

finding Earth like a grain of sand on an infinite beach

Earth is so far out in our galaxy you would wonder how and why they found it.

I've no doubt there are civilized societies on many planets in the denser, center of the Milky Way.  And they would engage in exploration and commerce with closer civilizations.

Why earth which is so far out of the way?  Kind of like the early explorers looking for isolated islands instead of continents like Asia and North and South America.  What have we to offer them?

Was Earth and accidental finding and a living archeological an anthropological dig for galactic scientists to study?  And do they have a Prime Directive not do disturb us?  If they were benevolent wouldn't they by now have shown us ways to reverse global warming and help us clean up the mess we have made of our environments?  

Perhaps we are planet in a petri dish interesting to observe for a galactic moment.

Noel


Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

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43 minutes ago, birdguy said:

Earth is so far out in our galaxy you would wonder how and why they found it.

I've no doubt there are civilized societies on many planets in the denser, center of the Milky Way.  And they would engage in exploration and commerce with closer civilizations.

Why earth which is so far out of the way?  Kind of like the early explorers looking for isolated islands instead of continents like Asia and North and South America.  What have we to offer them?

Was Earth and accidental finding and a living archeological an anthropological dig for galactic scientists to study?  And do they have a Prime Directive not do disturb us?  If they were benevolent wouldn't they by now have shown us ways to reverse global warming and help us clean up the mess we have made of our environments?  

Perhaps we are planet in a petri dish interesting to observe for a galactic moment.

Noel

Have you ever wondered whether we are really here at all?? This idea of our existense is flawed. We perceive this universe based on our limited senses....we can't naturally detect radiation, for example. What else is around us that we have not detected yet? Colors are not what they are..We see colors for what they are not. We all fight over limited resources...countries hoarding vacines, oil rich areas that should have never been there in the 1st place, Dubai, etc .Are we really here, or is this just a dream? The greed in this world....why is there not pleasure for every creature here? Only certain countries and individuals? So are we really here, or is this just a dream? A nightmare?

Edited by Peter Webber

Peter Webber

Prepar3D v5 & MSFS / Windows 10 Home Edition / CPU i7-7700K / MSI Z270 XPower Gaming Titanium / Samsung 970 EVO PLUS M.2 500GB / Corsair Vengeance DDR4 32GB 3000MHz / MSI Geforce GTX 1080Ti Gaming X

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32 minutes ago, Peter Webber said:

Have you ever wondered whether we are really here at all?? This idea of our existense is flawed. We perceive this universe based on our limited senses....we can't naturally detect radiation, for example. What else is around us that we have not detected yet? Colors are not what they are..We see colors for what they are not. We all fight over limited resources...countries hoarding vacines, oil rich areas that should have never been there in the 1st place, Dubai, etc .Are we really here, or is this just a dream? The greed in this world....why is there not pleasure for every creature here? Only certain countries and individuals? So are we really here, or is this just a dream? A nightmare?

That is a good question. The more I think about why and how we are "here", the less I am convinced that we know anything about the true nature of "reality". People laugh about the concept of living in a simulation, but we really do not know very much at all about why anything exists.


Christopher Low

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3 hours ago, birdguy said:

Earth is so far out in our galaxy you would wonder how and why they found it.

 

Well we are progressing  our selves in terms of analysing other planets, so if you think ahead a few thousand years an advanced species would have a capability in this respect we could only dream of. 

 

3 hours ago, birdguy said:

I've no doubt there are civilized societies on many planets in the denser, center of the Milky Way

 

Nope, actually the centre is the most inhospitable place. Biology isn't likely to last long there. You have a supermassive black hole, cosmic radiation, supernova's and all kinds of scary things in the centre. 

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2 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

but we really do not know very much at all about why anything exists.

 

We don't know, no. But we do have some very good theories.

Inflation theory has quite a bit of evidence going for it and it suggests that prior to the hot big bang there was the inflation field, otherwise known as the inflaton field. When the inflaton field stopped expanding all that energy was dumped into the field, particles created, jostled together and you get the hot big bang.  Now if, before the hot big bang, the inflaton field was infinite, then the hot big bang would have occurred simultaneously across the entire infinite universe in one go. In which case think of the expansion of the universe as a reduction in temperature and density, not an increase in size. Prior to the hot big bang there may have been just an infinite inflaton field, or maybe a cosmic singularity of some kind. And if inflation is correct, it implies Eternal Inflation, and thus multiple universes, or "pocket universes" as Alan Guth calls them. 

So no, we don't know for sure but there are a number of theories. Roger Penrose has an interesting theory called Conformal Cyclic Cosmology. 

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1 hour ago, martin-w said:

Nope, actually the centre is the most inhospitable place. Biology isn't likely to last long there. You have a supermassive black hole, cosmic radiation, supernova's and all kinds of scary things in the centre.

Inhospitable to what we know of as life, yes. Does that mean there couldn't be other forms of life that have evolved to live there? We really don't know enough to say one way or the other. We're still learning about where life can survive on this planet, including places that no one would have believed even a few decades ago. In many ways I think we're still at the stage where we know enough about the universe to get ourselves into trouble, but still not enough to really understand what we don't know. Almost a collective species wide Dunning-Kruger effect in a way.

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5 hours ago, Peter Webber said:

Have you ever wondered whether we are really here at all?? This idea of our existense is flawed. We perceive this universe based on our limited senses....we can't naturally detect radiation, for example. What else is around us that we have not detected yet? Colors are not what they are..We see colors for what they are not. We all fight over limited resources...countries hoarding vacines, oil rich areas that should have never been there in the 1st place, Dubai, etc .Are we really here, or is this just a dream? The greed in this world....why is there not pleasure for every creature here? Only certain countries and individuals? So are we really here, or is this just a dream? A nightmare?

Peter, we are here for the same reason all the other animals are here.  We evolved out of the same slime and much as they did and during the evolutionary process we were cursed with intelligence.  It made us know we were superior to other creatures of the earth and after centuries of development were superior to those who didn't look like us and later superior to those who didn't amass as much wealth as us.

You can take it from there privately.  Discussing it any further here might cause a moderator to close the thread.

Noel

 


Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

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2 hours ago, martin-w said:

Nope, actually the centre is the most inhospitable place. Biology isn't likely to last long there. You have a supermassive black hole, cosmic radiation, supernova's and all kinds of scary things in the centre. 

I should have left off center and stopped at denser.  I would think the stats that exist in closer proximity would look around home first.  And who's to say the life that evolves closer in wouldn't adapt to their environments.

Which brings up the question why do we think space aliens would be anything like us form or intelligence.  Why do we assume they would think like we do?

Noel


Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

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