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MSFS 2020 is really getting there!

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2 hours ago, Scottoest said:

It still blows my mind that we have a few users who spend non-trivial amounts of time in this subforum

Avsim does have more than the odd manchild.

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i910900k, RTX 3090, 32GB DDR4 RAM, AW3423DW, Ruddy girt big mug of Yorkshire Tea

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2 hours ago, jarmstro said:

The original and continuing attacks on MSFS arose for several reasons not least from those (and one in particular who has posted on this thread) with vested monetary interests in a particular sim and the perceived threat that MSFS poses to its future development and their bank balance. (I remember when, early on, he stated this publicly on another forum).

There are also strong emotional brand loyalties at play and an almost cult like devotion to a single individual. Heresy prevents them from even trying out MSFS for £1. All their knowledge of it comes from reading what they want to hear and YouTube videos.

Summed up pretty neatly! 🙂


Happy with MSFS 🙂
home simming evolved

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The funny thing is - since you guys are talking about me here - that it seems to bother you so much...like somehow deep inside you are not so absolutely certain that your simulator of choice is as perfect as you would like to believe. Further corraborating my assessment is the fact that several users feel the need to post self-reassuring threads like this one or this one https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/601341-one-sim-to-rule-them-all/ with astonishing regular frequency 😆.

As to worrying about my bank account (thanks, Jarmstro) - the money I DO earn with selling one X-Plane addons and making airports for LR (I freely admit it) is just a small fraction of my main income I make driving Airbus 320 family aircraft all over Europe (and occasionally to Africa). I don´t think having a financial interest (even a small one) prohibits me from expressing my views on other simulators, according to forum rules? If you go carefully through all my posts I think you will find it impossible to find anything I stated to be factually wrong - which in turn makes it even more bothersome to some here 🙂

Flightsimulation has been my hobby since the mid 80s, long before I started my real flighttraining and I have used all of Microsoft´s flightsimulators before - even when they didn´t have the things like angle of attack (FS4.0) and slip modeled.

I am happy for everyone enjoying MSFS - but when people start spreading false facts about X-Plane, I feel the urge to set it right - and not for fear of loosing money at all.

Edited by Janov

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4 minutes ago, Janov said:

The funny thing is - since you guys are talking about me here - that it seems to bother you so much...like somehow deep inside you are not so absolutely certain that your simulator of choice is as perfect as you would like to believe.

Oh please, spare us this ever same story packed into new outfit.

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Happy with MSFS 🙂
home simming evolved

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4 minutes ago, tweekz said:

Oh please, spare us this ever same story packed into new outfit.

Oh, I hit the mark 😁

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5 minutes ago, Janov said:

Oh, I hit the mark 😁

Tough buddy! 😉

I find it amusing that you don't understand people within a domain being enthusiastic about their sim of choice. What's the problem? I guess you'll be just as upset reading those XP threads about the new gen technology of XP12, right... right? 👀

So, I wonder what is more sad - people being overly excited with their sim, or people coming to spoil their fun...

Edited by tweekz
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Happy with MSFS 🙂
home simming evolved

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Just now, tweekz said:

I find it amusing that you don't understand people within a domain being enthusiastic about their sim of choice.

I totally understand that! And you won´t find me posting in a thread like the one I mentioned...unless people start saying things about X-Plane.

See, we are on the same page, really! 😉

 

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21 minutes ago, tweekz said:

Tough buddy! 😉

I find it amusing that you don't understand people within a domain being enthusiastic about their sim of choice. What's the problem? I guess you'll be just as upset reading those XP threads about the new gen technology of XP12, right... right? 👀

So, I wonder what is more sad - people being overly excited with their sim, or people coming to spoil their fun...

To be fair to Jan having fun is not something that enters his mind. Flight sims are an extremely serious matter. As he has previously said he uses X-Plane to familiarise himself and practice approaches which he may have to carry out in the real world. And that, it seems to me, is a very scary thought!🥵

Edited by jarmstro
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43 minutes ago, Janov said:

I am happy for everyone enjoying MSFS - but when people start spreading false facts about X-Plane, I feel the urge to set it right - and not for fear of loosing money at all.

Twaddle. The constant stream of ‘fly over your house’, ‘just eye candy’ ‘lol, it has tool tips’ etc. you inject into every forum you participate in (here or at the Org) has absolutely nothing to do with people misrepresenting XPlane. 
 

I don’t mind the trolling myself (as long as it doesn’t involve misogynistic references to waking up with, ‘ugly chicks’, was it?), but the childish ‘What, me?’ evasions I can do without.

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i910900k, RTX 3090, 32GB DDR4 RAM, AW3423DW, Ruddy girt big mug of Yorkshire Tea

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13 minutes ago, scotchegg said:

but the childish ‘What, me?’ evasions I can do without.

Alright then, none of that anymore. Now go fly over your house! (there should be a tooltip to help you find it) 😆

Edited by Janov
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58 minutes ago, tweekz said:

 

So, I wonder what is more sad - people being overly excited with their sim, or people coming to spoil their fun...

I was thinking exactly the same thing reading the latest posts of  what has become a sorry thread over my coffee and found a solution. We should marry Janov and Beansprout or Abrams_Tanks. They have so many thing to say to each other and that would keep them busy enough.

Edited by Dominique_K
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Dominique

Simming since 1981 -  4770k@3.7 GHz with 16 GB of RAM and a 1080 with 8 GB VRAM running a 27" @ 2560*1440 - Windows 10 - Warthog HOTAS - MFG pedals - MSFS Standard version with Steam

 

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36 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

We should marry Janov and Beansprout or Abrams_Tanks.

What a great idea! 😄 Throw in Jarmstro, FlyBaby and Scotchegg and we can really have some fun!

Look, I know I said things a few months ago that were not totally objective and I am willing to move beyond that and discuss things on a more level-headed basis...without the personal attacks and name calling. I tried a few times, but it is tough if people start attacking my posts on a personal basis every time I do - I am not a Jedi and though I tell myself to not stoop to their level, it is sometimes tough for me to live up to that standard.

I stand by my initial assessment of MSFS - but what I was wrong about is the commitment that Asobo/MS show in improving it beyond the initial version. I now believe that it could turn into a solid flightsimulator at some point in time and is therefore worth discussing on a grown-up, hobbiest level.

If you are willing to reply to me in a grown-up manner like abrams_tanks is, I will gladly carry the discussion on the same level.

If you resort to childish or nonsensical replies like some other folks here, showing the lack of maturity or knowledge to discuss things ("Laminar Researct has never interacted with the users!"🙄 "or not understanding the mosaic of techniques and technologies it uses to create it's world" 🙄) I find it hard to restrain myself to not push your buttons a bit...just like I do with my teenage kids 😉 But I will work on it!

Cheers, Jan

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12 minutes ago, Janov said:

Throw in Jarmstro,

As I am a proud and grateful member of your ignore list it would not feel at all  strange if I married you. My wife has also ignored me for over 40 years.😂

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1 hour ago, Dominique_K said:

I was thinking exactly the same thing reading the latest posts of  what has become a sorry thread over my coffee and found a solution. We should marry Janov and Beansprout or Abrams_Tanks. They have so many thing to say to each other and that would keep them busy enough.

Hi Dominique_K.  You can block me if you want, if what I say annoys you.  But I would like to continue to discuss the current situation of the home flight simulator market as it is.  I don't think we should tip toe over discussing what is the current reality of the home flight sim market.

For me, I went through business school before and in business school, you spend day and night assessing various business case studies.  MSFS vs X-Plane vs P3D is a textbook business case study and it also happens to be related to my hobby of flight simming.  I like to discuss the home flight simulator market because I actually find it very fascinating, from a business perspective.  I think we should be able to discuss certain news in the home flight simulator market rather than suppressing that discussion.  For example, the news about PMDG's latest comments on MSFS.  And also various reports that some 3rd party developers in P3D have shifted their priorities to MSFS.  Of course, sometimes we extrapolate based on the news we hear and we discuss our extrapolations on the forums as well.  I think that's normal human nature to extrapolate what you think may happen.  And by the way, in business school, you have to extrapolate and make a prediction on what will happen for your case studies.

You seem to imply that I am biased for MSFS and of course I am because I am very impressed with MSFS in the first place and lately, I like the attitude of Asobo (ie. hiring Working Title) and the fact that Asobo listens to the community and interacts with the community each month in the Twitch Q&A (we didn't have this openness and interaction of the community and developers after FSX was released).   Also, if you read carefully what I said before, I have said that X-Plane can make a comeback with X-Plane 12 and even the playing field with MSFS, if X-Plane 12 is a "revolutionary improvement" and not just an "incremental improvement" over X-Plane 11.  And yes, I celebrate competition, because that will push flight simulation forward.  I mentioned before that the improvements in new versions of X-Plane and P3D were very incremental in the past, and it was like they moved the ball forward by an inch with each new version.  Unfortunately, I don't think X-Plane or P3D really advanced flight simulation for the home market very much in the last 10 years.  Then MSFS comes into the market in 2020, and MSFS moves the ball forward by 100 yards (ok, a little exaggeration there, but I think you get the idea).  MSFS has advanced the home flight simulation market by a lot.  Maybe we can hope that X-Plane or P3D can move the ball forward by another 200 yards because in the end, we as flight sim enthusiasts will benefit from it (I have also stated in the past that I would be more than happy to jump ship to another flight simulator if that flight simulator is cost effective and also more advanced than MSFS).

 

 

Edited by abrams_tank
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Whoever make a new flight simulator, MS, LR or LM, they must use new technology to achieve a significant improvement compared to MSFS2020. Those improvements together with a good marketing will attract customers and move them from MSFS2020 to the new flight sim. Business plan to make a new flight simulation game must be attractive to the investors because actually all this about money.

Edited by OSM
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