I attended a funeral of a friend’s father today and afterwards we went to the Avro Heritage Museum at Woodford in Cheshire, England.

For those not familiar with it this was the former site of AV Roe (later British Aerospace) where the Lancaster WW2 bomber was built and later, the Vulcan bomber.

I noticed they had a flight sim setup running FSX. The system was updated to that version in 2018.

The Museum was closed to the public so I couldn’t ask anyone about the simulator.

The reason I’m posting here is to ask if this museum would be able to purchase a licence for P3D. Educational use seems to fit the bill; personal entertainment definitely not.

I would need to check the spec of the computer first of course but first I need to establish if a museum qualifies for a licence.

Anyone able to confirm please?

It's my understanding that yes, their use would fit the bill for the Academic Licence, but with one caveat, and that is they'd possibly need not one, but two copies, or more correctly, two licences.

This is because to use the thing for educational purposes, one would presumably be in an 'instructor and student' scenario, and the licence for P3D Academic states that a licence is for use 'by no more than one user at any one time'. Of course this can be a bit nebulous, since even if two people are taking turns at a PC with one copy of P3D, technically there is only 'one user at a time' when they take turns, however, this is exactly why, when I used to use it for some training stuff with my students, I bought two licences for it.

This also had a benefit in meaning I was able to legitimately install it on my desktop and my laptop, but since I only ever used my laptop for training, I had two licenses when using that thing with someone else whilst on just one computer, and so I was definitely covering myself in regard to that stipulation in case anyone tried to get funny with me about whether I was legitimately licensed to do that.

Of course the sensible thing to do would be to contact LM and get their take on it, since you can't really go wrong with an opinion on the matter from the people themselves who write the rules on it.

Edited February 22, 20224 yr by Chock

@Chock, thanks for that. When you look at the photo in the link whilst the right-hand seat has the yoke there is a joystick on the left-hand seat so yes, technically it could be used by two people simultaneously thereby requiring two licences.

I asked here first because trying to get an answer from LM might end up being directed to a FAQ link which may not cover this scenario.

I’m sure a second (dormant) licence would not be a problem financially. I’m more concerned about the power of the computer and whether graphically it meets minimum spec.

Use of the simulator is free once the admission fee to the museum is paid so there’s no question about it being used for financial gain.

I’ll post the question over on the P3D forums.

Ray - sorry - but maybe my Lancashire - Aussie humour - but when I first glanced at the thread title -

my first reaction was - "Already ?" 😂

1 hour ago, jaytee73 said:

Ray - sorry - but maybe my Lancashire - Aussie humour - but when I first glanced at the thread title -

my first reaction was - "Already ?" 😂

Don’t follow, sorry. ☹️

4 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Don’t follow, sorry. ☹️

Must be an MSFS fan, thinking P3D is dead and consigned to a Museum😆.

Edited February 23, 20224 yr by IanHarrison
spelling

11 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

I’m sure a second (dormant) licence would not be a problem financially. I’m more concerned about the power of the computer and whether graphically it meets minimum spec.

Use of the simulator is free once the admission fee to the museum is paid so there’s no question about it being used for financial gain.

I’ll post the question over on the P3D forums.

If it can run FSX, there's a good chance it will at least run P3D, since they are essentially the same thing, but whether it runs it well enough without throwing a bit of an upgrade at the PC is another matter.

Incidentally, if anyone is reasonably close to Stockport, I can certainly recommend that museum, it is worth a visit just to check out Vulcan XM603 which they have there; you can get really close to it as you can see on this video of mine below when there was a Lancaster and an Anson doing a fly-by of the place. Inside there is a lot of cool stuff if you like Lancasters, Ansons and other vintage AVRO stuff.

Here is a video of a day out there, showing a Lanc and an Anson doing flybys and some old aero-engines being run, the Spitfire and the 109 which you see on this video are not genuine ones, they are glass-fibre film prop replicas intended for background shots in movies, but they do stand up to reasonably close inspection. If you want to know how oily old aero engines are, check out how much oil gets flung onto the lens of my camera when these things crank up:

 

14 minutes ago, Chock said:

If it can run FSX, there's a good chance it will at least run P3D, since they are essentially the same thing, but whether it runs it well enough without throwing a bit of an upgrade at the PC is another matter.

If the PC was a decent one purchased in 2018 then hopefully it's of a decent spec. Nothing back from LM yet.

Agreed it a nice museum and well worth a visit. Here's a shot I took of XH558 when it flew a couple of circuits of Woodford back in June 2015. Ye gods, nearly 7 years ago.

I went along to the aviation fair with the family, in 2018 and had a quick go on that simulator, I think it may even have been FS9 it was running at that time, not sure, but if it was FSX it was in a vanilla form.

They had a saved scenario with a Lancaster on finals to Woodford that you could attempt.

The two old gents running it kept looking at each other as I flew it down the approach, then one said you’re very smooth most people are all over the place by now, I just kept quiet.

Apparently one said the same to my wife who was watching and she let the cat out of the bag and said he should be he’s flying a 747 to New York tomorrow. However it was my flight sim skills with the joystick which were in play not my RW experience.

I’ve been wanting to go back there because I have an old saitek yoke and throttle and the horizon scenery disks which I thought they might like as a donation to improve their set up , however with the way things have been it’s not been possible. Hopefully it’s open to the public again and they’ll have another fair this summer, it’s a great day out.

29 minutes ago, jon b said:

The two old gents running it kept looking at each other as I flew it down the approach, then one said you’re very smooth most people are all over the place by now, I just kept quiet.

Haha, did a similar thing at a computer equipment convention at Earls Court many years ago where if you could land the plane on a somewhat ropey approach scenario they had paused in Flight Simulator running on a Mac you won a prize. It was pretty close to the airport and not very well lined up, but if you managed it, you got a T-shirt. Of course for most flight simmers that's an easy challenge, so I racked that thing into an S turn to line it up, then greased it in perfectly, right on the touchdown markers and dead-centre on the middle line, much to their annoyance. 🤣

Back with the original topic, I would also suggest possibly seeing if LM would help out in return for sticking a sponsorship logo on the simulator. I'm sure it would be absolute pocket-change for them to do that, and a good advert for them. Chances are it would get them a few sales of P3D since by definition, pretty much everyone who has made the effort to go to that museum is likely a plane nerd with some disposable income.

Edited February 23, 20224 yr by Chock

1 hour ago, jon b said:

I went along to the aviation fair with the family, in 2018 and had a quick go on that simulator, I think it may even have been FS9 it was running at that time, not sure, but if it was FSX it was in a vanilla form.

The notice said FSX so it’s possible they moved to that after your visit.

If they’re only flying in the UK then P3D plus GB True Earth might be attractive to them. That’s as close as you can get to the real thing with that sim.

I’m sure that all the aircraft they fly will have versions for v5.

It’s open at weekends only currently although that may change come the warmer weather.

53 minutes ago, Chock said:

Back with the original topic, I would also suggest possibly seeing if LM would help out in return for sticking a sponsorship logo on the simulator. I'm sure it would be absolute pocket-change for them to do that, and a good advert for them. Chances are it would get them a few sales of P3D since by definition, pretty much everyone who has made the effort to go to that museum is likely a plane nerd with some disposable income.

Very good point. I’ll suggest that to them if the museum can use P3D without having to invest in new kit.

I might also point them to Fulcrum for an improvement over the Saitek. It’s solidly built and with Hall-effect sensors nothing to wear out.

3 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

Here's a shot I took of XH558 when it flew a couple of circuits of Woodford back in June 2015. Ye gods, nearly 7 years ago.

 

Love the Vulcan pic Ray!👍

It brought back memories of one I saw thundering down North Weald Aerodrome (at an Airshow I attended back in the early 80's) with steeeeepp climb out. LOUD is the word I would use, but a truly amazing sight. They don't make them like that any more!

24 minutes ago, 787flyer said:

Love the Vulcan pic Ray!👍

It brought back memories of one I saw thundering down North Weald Aerodrome (at an Airshow I attended back in the early 80's) with steeeeepp climb out. LOUD is the word I would use, but a truly amazing sight. They don't make them like that any more!

Thanks! I took loads and that turned out the best. The "whine" is also memorable. Unique to the Vulcan.

Last time I saw her at a show was Duxford in 2015. 75th anniversary of BoB so lots of Spitfires and Hurricanes there. Fantastic!

Just had a reply from Rob McCarthy...

"Lockheed Martin and Prepar3D are very involved in education and outreach activities. Please contact [email protected] and we would be happy to discuss what's possible."

Excellent! 👍

Just a note to Woodford - 2 days before we left England to Emigrate to Australia - July '71 - I took my kids to see the Concord take off from there - If my memory serves me right ??

Currently in MSFS  - am flying a Canberra out of Warton near Blackpool where English Electric had their factory - and also built the lightning