Landing 737 versus Fenix A 320

[Alpine Scenery 1,609]

8 minutes ago, silentghostx said:

I am wondering whether if you guys use rudder pedals and if this makes any difference? As I can see that several of you have now reverted back to .104 version. 
 

Rudder pedals are much easier, but I don't want more junk on my floor 🙂
I don't fly the Fenix, but I have issues with many planes when using the Logitech. 
The t1600m is decent ergonomically, but not enough buttons at the top. The VKB flies the smoothest.

If anyone wants to buy a "tried once" open box VKB Gladiator SCE Premium, PM me. 
Their return policy was so strict I would have lost half the value returning it, so now I'm stuck with it.

The VKB Gladiator is BY FAR the best joystick, but it doesn't fit my hand size.

Edited October 7, 2022 by Alpine Scenery

[silentghostx 66]

Just never felt the need to previously in P3D. The twist on the stick has always been what I have used. But seriously considering getting one now, as MSFS has definitely upped the game with the wind and gusts especially with this update, and I actually need to have downward aileron input with the stick which is much harder to do with a twisting motion at the same time… will need to apply for approval from the “finance” dept 🤣😜

[Bobsk8 12,879]

Just now, silentghostx said:

Just never felt the need to previously in P3D. The twist on the stick has always been what I have used. But seriously considering getting one now, as MSFS has definitely upped the game with the wind and gusts especially with this update, and I actually need to have downward aileron input with the stick which is much harder to do with a twisting motion at the same time… will need to apply for approval from the “finance” dept 🤣😜

I found using a twist grip and making good crosswind landings in any kind of aircraft in a flight sim to be just about impossible. 

[Alpine Scenery 1,609]

1 minute ago, Bobsk8 said:

I found using a twist grip and making good crosswind landings in any kind of aircraft in a flight sim to be just about impossible. 

The gladiator does a good job, you'd be surprised. It's night and day compared to the other 5 joysticks I have owned total (though right now only have 3 here). It is WAY more controllable on the twist axis than the others, the 1600m isn't terrible though, the Logitech is. 

[silentghostx 66]

Thanks Bobsk8. Happy to take recommendations on the pedals - what are you using?

[Bobsk8 12,879]

4 minutes ago, silentghostx said:

Thanks Bobsk8. Happy to take recommendations on the pedals - what are you using?

I am using Logitech right now, used to use CH Pedals, until they finally went bad after 10 years. The only problem with the Logitech is that it slides around on the floor. To fix that, I got a 2 x 2 foot piece of 1/2 inch plywood from Home depot and screwed the pedals down with that. Solid as a rock, and no sliding. 

Edited October 7, 2022 by Bobsk8

[RandallR 450]

12 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

I found using a twist grip and making good crosswind landings in any kind of aircraft in a flight sim to be just about impossible. 

It certainly is difficult, but I've been twisting away for about 5 years now and have become fairly adept at it.

I still have my rudder pedals and hope to reinstall them some day.  Though retired, I run some multimedia businesses - the additional microphones, interfaces, lighting controls, scanners, etc. require a lot of cables.  I've put them in as neat as I can but they take up some of the floor space that my rudder pedals used to occupy - there's just no room for them right now.

[F737MAX 5,738]

2 hours ago, ffantasy67 said:

The AC literally falls off the sky during flare in manual landing. Attempts to correct the attitude result in hard landings and long bounces

Same.
I should have had an absolute greaser. Speed 143 kts into light headwind, 5 nose up attitude at 50' with flaps 3, gentle back pressure on the sidestick, "5" callout on GPWS, R.O.D. trend line on PFD altittude showing horizontal.
Instead, *bam* -299 landing rate per Landing Rate Monitor app.

  

50 minutes ago, silentghostx said:

Happy to take recommendations on the pedals - what are you using?

Not the cheapest, but fantastic quality pedals are MFG Crosswind pedals.

 

Edited October 7, 2022 by F737MAX

[Bobsk8 12,879]

1 minute ago, F737MAX said:

Same.
I should have had an absolute greaser. Speed 143 kts into light headwind, 5 nose up attitude at 50' with flaps 3, gentle back pressure on the sidestick, "5" callout on GPWS, R.O.D. trend line on PFD altittude showing horizontal.
Instead, *bam* -299 landing rate per Landing Rate Monitor app.

I think any landing 300 fpm or less on the Fenix, is a greaser...

 

[jcomm 6,020]

4 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

I think any landing 300 fpm or less on the Fenix, is a greaser...

 

😂

[Bobsk8 12,879]

Just finished my 2nd flight of the day in the Fenix..  Turn off AP at 700 feet, aim at touchdown zone, speed right on the money 137 knots,  minimums,    100 feet,  50 feet, 40 feet didn't touch anything...... wait.... wait.. float,   pass the touchdown zone........  30,,,,,,, 40     30    20   10   touchdown... 305 FPM........Unreal.......  Waiting for the Kodiak update to drop, then I think I will give the Fenix a rest for maintenance. 

[WestAir 2,530]

1 hour ago, silentghostx said:

I’m interested in the issues with landing.
 

Prior to this most recent update I cannot control the plane after touchdown with a crosswind >5knots, and will almost always drift off the runway once the nose is on the ground with excessive input from the rudder axis.
 

The most recent update seems to have fixed this issue, for which I am happy about. I am using the Thrustmaster A320 stick and throttle only. 
 

I am wondering whether if you guys use rudder pedals and if this makes any difference? As I can see that several of you have now reverted back to .104 version. 
 

Thanks!

You'll really improve your control authority with a twist stick + rudder combo.

If you use the twist axis on your stick for nose wheel steering / tiller, then the rudder pedals will, at full deflection, only give you six degrees of nose wheel deflection. That's a huge increase in precision when landing or taking off. Without having an active tiller / nose wheel steering axis, you'll get the full 74 degrees of deflection on the nosewheel with full rudder deflection.

To put that in perspective, that's like putting your steering wheel hard over on the freeway at 150 mph / 241 kph. You can see how much of a difference a tiller axis can make in directional control during landing / take-off.

[Ohmsquare 101]

1 hour ago, Bobsk8 said:

Just finished my 2nd flight of the day in the Fenix..  Turn off AP at 700 feet, aim at touchdown zone, speed right on the money 137 knots,  minimums,    100 feet,  50 feet, 40 feet didn't touch anything...... wait.... wait.. float,   pass the touchdown zone........  30,,,,,,, 40     30    20   10   touchdown... 305 FPM........Unreal.......  Waiting for the Kodiak update to drop, then I think I will give the Fenix a rest for maintenance. 

Honestly, most of my landings are like that and even though the FPM might be 300ish, the landing force usually sits between 1.1 - 1.2G which I'd consider to be acceptable for an airliner.

Edited October 7, 2022 by Ohmsquare

[ha5mvo 261]

Pilots aim at attitude, not rate.

[Bobsk8 12,879]

1 hour ago, WestAir said:

You'll really improve your control authority with a twist stick + rudder combo.

If you use the twist axis on your stick for nose wheel steering / tiller, then the rudder pedals will, at full deflection, only give you six degrees of nose wheel deflection. That's a huge increase in precision when landing or taking off. Without having an active tiller / nose wheel steering axis, you'll get the full 74 degrees of deflection on the nosewheel with full rudder deflection.

To put that in perspective, that's like putting your steering wheel hard over on the freeway at 150 mph / 241 kph. You can see how much of a difference a tiller axis can make in directional control during landing / take-off.

Tiller is never used in any mode but taxiing.