VC Shadows Video is up

[Guest AggiePilot]

Mr. Taylor's weblog has a link to a video of the VC shadows in action, though only in slew mode.Link: http://blogs.msdn.com/sebby1234/archive/20...dowing-vcs.aspxPersonaly, I'm a bit underwhelmed, and for a few good reasons:1. Yeah, they're cool, but from the description of their implementation, it sounds so simple I wonder why they hadn't done it before.(edit: see #3)2. Relating to the whole shadow map thing, I'm suspicious how well they'll work in reduced vis/cloudy situations, having crisp shadows in a cockpit while flying under broken cumulus doesn't sound too appealing, and having the shadow function just turn off/turn back on seems like it would be distracting as ####.3. The author goes right out and says "This could have been in DX9". Dude. Seriously. This is what I get for Vista-DX10?? Shadows that could have been there already if they had the performance issues ironed-out?? Then why not give it to me as a DX9 patch? Oh, what's that, because all you'd have left to sell DX10 is pretty water and tarted-up bloom? Gotcha. I'm not usually one to hop on the 'MS is milking us' bandwagon, but jeez.....I know I'm being overly harsh and critical over just a video, but I guess I was just expecting more. Then again, they're just shadows, so hoping for anything other than 'oh neat' is unreasonable on my part. Having stated my dissapointment, I will now say openly that this IS A STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION, and I'm sure under the right conditions will add to the immersiveness of the sim. I remember Phil saying there wasn't anything "for the pilot" scenery wise (meaning in the cockpit) and I think part of it is that they already did such a bang-up job with the VC that no one noticed it anymore, so shadows weren't needed/missed.Now if they were to go in and make some more buttons (or even the expected ones) work properly......... ;)Or am I way off-base?-Josh, the greedy, needy, overly-opinionated hyper-critical guy.Edit: What the....I can't say He**?!?!

[victorwest2 0]

Mr Taylor? I'm sure he'll be pleased to hear himself being addressed so formally! :-hah As regards the point you made at the end, I think that's an American thing.

[Guest Mike707]

This is a really nice effect. Very good for immersion in the sim.

[Mace 1,902]

Well, after watching the video, I finally understand what they mean about VC shadowing. I thought it was just some shadowing under the gauge bezels and the like...I see now that it is a little more than that.RhettAMD 3700+ (@2585 mhz), eVGA 7800GT 256 (Guru3D 93.71), ASUS A8N-E, PC Power 510 SLI, 2gb Corsair XMS 3-3-3-8 (1T), WD 150 gig 10000rpm Raptor, WD 250gig 7200rpm SATA2, Seagate 120gb 5400 rpm external HD, CoolerMaster Praetorian

[Virtualwombat 4]

Nice effect. But it will delay release of 3rd party aircraft for FSX further. I'm sure many will not have 'visually closed' VCs.Cheers,Noel.

[Guest]

It's a cool effect but I've been playing games for going on a year now that did it in dx9 like Phil says. All in all I am looking forward to the dx10 patch even if its only a shadow of what I expected (no pun intended)It's also a bummer that it will only work with native fsx aircraft since i rarely fly them. Hopefully the aircraft vendors will issue patches but at the rate they are putting out products and patches for fsx I am not holding my breath.________________________________________________________________________________________________Intel D975XBX2 'Bad Axe 2' | Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 @ 3.20Ghz | 2 GB Super Talent DDR2 800 | Big Typhoon VX | eVGA 8800GTS @ 565/900 | Seagate 2x320GB SATA RAID-0 | OCZ GameXStream 700W | Creative X-Fi | Silverstone TJ-09BW | Matrox Triplehead Setup

[slashed2 53]

Just curious how difficult it would be to add this to future 3rd party aircraft? I guess it depends on the model being enclosed etc... Hopefully they'll release first and update later.

[slashed2 53]

Hah, had a bit of a chuckle. At least the expansion pack comes with some nice aircraft to use and experience this new effect until 3rd party vendors get to the updates, if they do.

[Guest Mike707]

I think it is important to note that even though SP2 does not provide all of the features that we all wanted, including all the features that the Aces team wanted too, DX10 (if you have Vista and a DX10 card) does allow more of us to use more of the features that most machines could not use in DX9 mode. Before DX10, I could not use bloom or 2x water, and run the sim well. I am thinking, that with DX10, I should be able to now run them and that to me makes the FS experience richer. Just my 2 cents.

[Manny 1,293]

I love this effect.OK.. I have been debating back and forth if I should go Vista as yet. I think, this adds a lot.The psychological effect of this really adds to the realism. I love it.. Anything like this that does not take FPS away... is good. Period.If we can expect more of such things from DX10 in FX11.... Hello world!:)Manny

[Guest AggiePilot]

Mike, I understand what you're saying, but here's the problem some people (myself included) have with that sentiment:DX10(SP2) has become little more than just that; a second service pack/performance update that adds minimal additional functionality to a product that some people spent copious amounts of money to be able to utilize under Direct X 10. Based on what we've seen, it can be argued that the improvements gained by DX10 rendering are minimal at best, and that at least one of them (cockpit shadows) can be easily instituted in DX9. ACES claims it wasn't included due to performance concerns, and while I believe them, it certainly didn't stop them from including a bloom feature that easily halved many user's FPS, and in ANY case, performance is not such a big issue after SP1 anyway, so there is no excuse not to include it for DX9 functionality now.Now, is it Microsoft's fault that people chose to be early hardware/software adopters in anticipation of a promised product that was not set in stone? No.Do I think that this is part of some corporate scheme to #### us off and take our money?Hardly. FSX is the most impressive piece of simulation software I have ever seen available to the public, and that only becomes more and more true with every subsequent release.Do I think ACES and Microsoft Marketing have been irresponsible, inconsiderate and less-than forthcoming about their development plans, engine capabilities and product functionality?Absolutely. I love FSX. I LOVE FSX. But I hate feeling like I'm being lied to. Either DX10 isn't all it's cracked up to be, or ACES can't figure out how to program for it. Either way, we were lied to. I stand by my accusation that the decision to make cockpit shadows a DX10 only feature after the release of SP1 was a marketing one, not a software develpment one.Just my 2 cents-Josh

[Tabs 2,790]

>Nice effect. But it will delay release of 3rd party aircraft>for FSX further. I'm sure many will not have 'visually closed'>VCs.>>Cheers,>>Noel.>>Just curious how difficult it would be to add this to future>3rd party aircraft? I guess it depends on the model being>enclosed etc... Hopefully they'll release first and update>later.It's a total rebuild of the VC for us with the 744... we're not going to be doing that, so no delays from this.

[PhilTaylor 45]

I am sorry you feel you are being lied to, but I have not done that to the communuty.In point of fact, adding another feature that wouldnt look good or if it did would be a drag on performance in DX9 would have the community ranting in an entirely different way. And if you read Sebby's site, he says just that. It really was a matter of time with DX10, why is that so hard to believe? And do you need to insult our skills? Really?

[Guest drdaru1]

I'm going to give you 2 cents to replace the two you gave, because it's EXACTLY how I feel about this whole situation. In the 24 years I've been sticking with FS, I really feel that this is the first time that I've even questioned the product whole-heartedly, and haven't been able to shake any doubts I've had. Very well said by you.Gig 'emFTAC 2001, WHOOP!

[Guest AggiePilot]

Mr. Taylor,We all have a great deal of respect for your efforts with both your product and in communicating with the community, and understand that you must take a high level of personal 'ownership' in the success of FSX.However, please do turn what I said into a personal attack or accusation against you or any other individual on your staff. I never said "Phil Taylor lied to us", I said we were lied to, and I was right.Specifically, I implied that the decision to upgrade to Vista for DX10 functionality was influenced, in great part, by segments such as this one:

in which a member of your parent company made claims that your studio was not able to deliver on. That video was from July 2006, well over a year ago. I think it is completely reasonable to expect that a year is sufficient time for a professional studio employed by the largest software manufacturer on the planet to have an accurate assessment of what will or will not be included in a retail release (SP2/Acceleration). So no, the time excuse doesn't fly. And I am not insulting your skills, or the skills of your team. I am insulting the hubris of your employer to announce features for a product that it's creator (you and your team) had not agreed to. Unless of course you had, in which case please correct me.The fact that bait-and-switch advertising of features and functionality has become a de-facto standard in your industry does not make it acceptable. Respectfully,Josh Morian