SWS first images of Kodiak 900.

[guibru 474]

It’s been more than a year since the SWS Kodiak 900 was announced. This is the first in-sim image of the bird. 

 https://www.facebook.com/SimWorksStudios/

 

[JYW 2,985]

Not touching anything SWS until the PC-12 receives a comprehensive FDE update.

(Sorry for the downer, but once bitten.....)

Edited April 6 by JYW

[Matchstick 1,888]

33 minutes ago, JYW said:

Not touching anything SWS until the PC-12 receives a comprehensive FDE update.

(Sorry for the downer, but once bitten.....)

Yeah, the state of the PC-12 really has forced a re-evaluation of their quality and support 😞

[btacon 1,829]

41 minutes ago, JYW said:

Not touching anything SWS until the PC-12 receives a comprehensive FDE update.

(Sorry for the downer, but once bitten.....)

A good plan.  I first met SWS well over five years ago when I purchased their T-37 “Tweet” for P3d 4.0.  It was a nicely done plane, with significant depth that made it stand out amount the crowd.  Problem was that depth had some serious flaws that had to be addressed before it could be called a “must have” plane, very much like the PC-12.  About six months after release P3d 5.0 was released. The tweet worked, sort of and a myriad of promises to fix it properly were issued by SWS which never occurred, then radio silence and a binned Tweet for me.

I hope I’m not having Deja Vu with the PC-12.

-B

[hangar 661]

Interesting comments about the flight model...usually all I see are folks saying how great it fly's. But I have not bought myself a copy of the pc-12 yet...anyone care to share what it is about the flying that they feel needs attention?

[lupedelupe 315]

3 minutes ago, hangar said:

Interesting comments about the flight model...usually all I see are folks saying how great it fly's. But I have not bought myself a copy of the pc-12 yet...anyone care to share what it is about the flying that they feel needs attention?

It behaves as if it has no vertical stab. Regardless of yaw damper on or off. Landing trim is well above neutral trim. Those are the two major issues for me. And I’ve been VERY patient trying to work through these issues, to no avail. 

[St Mawgan 1,393]

I'm more interested in the RV-8 which has been in development there for quite a while. 

 

[JYW 2,985]

2 hours ago, hangar said:

Interesting comments about the flight model...usually all I see are folks saying how great it fly's. But I have not bought myself a copy of the pc-12 yet...anyone care to share what it is about the flying that they feel needs attention?

 

1 hour ago, lupedelupe said:

It behaves as if it has no vertical stab. Regardless of yaw damper on or off. Landing trim is well above neutral trim. Those are the two major issues for me. And I’ve been VERY patient trying to work through these issues, to no avail. 

As @lupedelupe said above, the PC-12 currently has serious flight model issues, during moments of high load and low speed (typically on approach with flaps down).  Even with zero wind, the plane starts to yaw severely. Add to this that while this is happening, roll control virtually disappears.  So you're floating in, virtually 'sideways' and aileron movement barely changes your flight path.   Some have described it as a plane that lands "virtually sideways" or that "turns into a helicopter on finals".     I agree with both descriptions.

It's truly awful.

And the sad thing is that - in every other area - their PC-12 is stunning. Modeling, textures, stunning sounds.  It feels a little odd on take off but nothing striking.   Cruise is uneventful, high speed descent is fine.  Then you begin your approach, get the flaps down, deccelerate, and it all turns into a physics-bending ball of mush.

Edited April 6 by JYW

[Tom_L 541]

1 hour ago, hangar said:

anyone care to share what it is about the flying that they feel needs attention?

Yaw behaviour. While it is acknowledged and is said to be adressed with the next update, probably due after SU15, I can't help but notice that it is still downplayed on the developers discord. Just recently their consulting pilot told a user who was reporting his struggles with crabbing on approaches of "a slight issue with flaps 40 and it being really sensitive to wind".  I agree that otherwise it's a fantastic aircraft and I hope the update restores my faith in the developer.

Here's me trying to stay on the localizer with preset weather, no wind, turbulence set to "easy", trim as recommended. I shot this approach multiple times with all possible trim- and flaps settings, and yet I couldn't keep it on the localizer. My control inputs can be seen in the input viewer.

 

[ryanbatc 12,932]

2 hours ago, hangar said:

Interesting comments about the flight model...usually all I see are folks saying how great it fly's. But I have not bought myself a copy of the pc-12 yet...anyone care to share what it is about the flying that they feel needs attention?

In a nutshell, the real plane has an aileron/rudder interconnect.  And the way it flies in the sim is not great.  I need tons of rudder in level flight.  And during landing, even with proper rudder trim, it's basically impossible to land in a crosswind without yawing/bouncing all over the place.

I'm certain SWS will make it right, I think they're also waiting on SU15 like other companies.

Aside from the rudder issue, the plane is really nice - great sounds, nice avionics and systems etc.

[hangar 661]

@Tom_Lwow - was it like that since day 1 release, or is this something that changed after an asobo update and you're all waiting for it to be corrected?

@ryanbatcI see now...but that's too bad they actually released it this way...seems like they should have hot fixed it or at least hot "rigged" it until a better fix post su15. I too am waiting for a fix after SU15 from a different developer for the super twitchy pitch in the M500.

Edited April 6 by hangar

[outermarker 217]

Just now, hangar said:

@Tom_Lwow - was it like that since day 1 release, or is this something that changed after an asobo update and you're all waiting for it to be corrected?

It has been like this since day one. An update is pending but, like everybody else, SWS are waiting for SU15 to be public before release.

[ryanbatc 12,932]

4 minutes ago, hangar said:

@Tom_Lwow - was it like that since day 1 release, or is this something that changed after an asobo update and you're all waiting for it to be corrected?

@ryanbatcI see now...but that's too bad they actually released it this way...seems like they should have hot fixed it or at least hot "rigged" it until a better fix post su15. I too am waiting for a fix after SU15 from a different developer for the super twitchy pitch in the M500.

Yeah.  Flight model can be tricky in MSFS... I think it's always been sort of magic that devs can do a nice job, and MSFS is still fairly new compared to FSX etc.  I would like to acknowledge that SWS does a good job communicating the issue but there's a pilot on their discord who basically told me I was a moron on day 1 when I reported the issue.  He thinks he's hot stuff cause he flies a PC12.  Oddly enough the Beech I fly also has a aileron/rudder interconnect 🙂  But. hey, what do I know?

[Flic1 995]

No more SWS stuff for me unless I see marked improvement on the PC-12 which is unflyable during the most important phase of flight (approach and landing) although has a lot of potential otherwise. The Kodiak is also broken and they insist that having it fall out of the sky on short final is totally normal behavior in the real aircraft.  They also need to manage their Discord better and get rid of the 'pilot consultants' that are less than helpful and condescending to anyone that reports a perceived issue with an aircraft.  They want to include all of these quirks that are in the real aircraft but it's nearly impossible to handle them unless you have proper rudder pedals and yoke, etc.  Most use a joystick and I have to assume it is impossible to land the PC-12 properly with a joystick right now.  I have a yoke and rudder pedals and it's still difficult due to the rudder (or lack thereof) issues.  

[Flic1 995]

27 minutes ago, Tom_L said:

Just recently their consulting pilot told a user who was reporting his struggles with crabbing on approaches of "a slight issue with flaps 40 and it being really sensitive to wind".

They need to toss that dude (calls himself Captain but he's an FO on a PC-12).  He is not good for their business.  It turns out the entire time he was telling everyone on Discord that the airplane was fine and it was 'user error' he did not even have a computer to use or test the plane on. Ridiculous....

Edited April 6 by Flic1