Just as an example of my "still learning" that might be interesting to fellow simmers.Yesterday we were coming back thru some really nasty t storms. Over eastern New York they were real bad -and the stormscope and xm weather showed red to the north and south of us. We were flying an airway that showed that we would go thru a narrow 15 mile opening-or we could divert to the south and completely avoid. I requested a diversion to the south-atc said negative-can't do that-that he showed we could get thru the hole. Another pilot came on and said he had just made it thru and it was only moderate rain. I was about to accept that fact-but my 3x experienced partner in the right seat said-no-we are not going that way. I requested again to divert to the south and was told no-and the controller then got sarcastic. My partner grabbed the mike and said-we just saw lightening-we are turning 30 degrees left--- now! The controller now sounding less cocky approved (pic rules in urgent state) and we turned south. A few minutes later we heard the cries of a couple pilots that got caught in the hole which did not turn out so good for them-the controller now treated us much nicer.....and I learned a little more! :-)Looking forward to that kind of interaction in the sim-along with increased animals and humans-all part of the equation of complete simulation as far as I am concerned.http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/1b5baf...b9f427f694g.jpgMy blog:http://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/

Jim,Agree entirely with your points.I think we have to look at what many of us here want compared to the mainstream target audience of FS.Personally, I would much rather FS focus on core features such as weather, navigation, terrain, ATC etc. I am currently approaching flight test time for my PPL after 55 hours in C152's / C172's and I am starting to want different things from FS than I did, say a year ago.Maybe it's time for a more 'pro-sumer' simulator? Perhaps Flight 1 would be interested in getting some of the great addon designers together to develop a new sim from scratch? I know Peter Wilding was looking at this possibility a while back.......Don't get me wrong, I love FS and would buy any version without hesitation, but I think their maybe a market for something more in line with what the 'hardcore' users are looking for. Personally, I would think between $200-400 wouldn't be a bad investment for something like this. I would pay it anyway.........All the best,

>:-lol>>Anything that gets the chicks works in my book...though sadly>I am well past playing..>http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/1b5baf...b9f427f694g.jpg>>My blog:>http://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/Geofa,If you don't mind, would you change your signature block to something a wee bit smaller.Thanks.

Do you honestly believe that 'digital' people look ANYTHING like well, people?It seems we can model aircraft, buildings and such like well these days but I have yet to see any 'life like' people.I don't feel for one minute that birds, animals, cars or people add anything to the sim 'immersion' expereience whatsoever.On my real world cross country flights I am looking at roads for reference points during navigation. At @ 4500 feet amongst everything else going on, I barely notice the moving cars, hence why I run with them turned off in FSX. Not only that but when you turn them on they look so fake that IMHO it actually degrades the 'immersion' factor.Of my 55 hours, I have encoutered a flock of birds once. Yes, once. Do I need simulated birds in the sim? No.There are many things that need addressing in the next version of FS. Adding more 'eye candy' features would not be top of the list. FS is supposed to be simulating flight. For 'immersion' what could be more important than actually simulating flight? Isn't the illusion of flying the most important part of 'immersion'?I would buy the new FS if all it did was offer the same feature set of FSX with double or triple the performance. That alone would be enough for me to buy it. If the weather engine (visibility layers being my biggest gripe) and the ATC system could be improved it would be a real winner.

Done-it appears during my 2.5 weeks away that the server that hosted my sig has collapsed. Thanks for calling my attention to it.http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/1b5baf...b9f427f694g.jpgMy blog:http://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/

A point to remember is the technology for this is in TS2. I'm sure it would require extra work to integrate it into FS, but it won't be a ground up implementation.

...and I face birds on almost every flight where I live. As I documented above-I almost witnessed a crash yesterday in Bar Harbor, Maine when a twin flared in the middle of a flock of seagulls-tried to go around-then decided to land and chopped and thru many of the bodies/feathers all over the runway....sending one bird body flying towards me at the hold short line ...and -I had notams of Moose on the runways both there and in New Hampshire where I landed-going along with the coyotes and deer I have also run across where I live and in the western Us.I would like it all though-don't think improved weather/atc has to necessarily be at the expense of more improved alive beings. They both increase reality imho.My blog:http://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/

>A point to remember is the technology for this is in TS2. I'm>sure it would require extra work to integrate it into FS, but>it won't be a ground up implementation.No, the "technology for this" is in the core platform. The core platform is the common building block for TS2, ESP and FS......and any new simulator ACES may decide to build. :)

>Yesterday we were coming back thru some really nasty t storms.>Over eastern New York they were real bad -and the stormscope>and xm weatherI'll have to look into this "stormscope" and xm weather.Perhaps this could be applied to simflying in some way?RhettFS box: E8500 (@ 3.80 ghz), AC Freezer 7 Pro, ASUS P5E3 Premium, BFG 8800GTX 756 (nVidia 169 WHQL), 4gb DDR3 1600 Patriot Cas7 7-7-7-20 (2T), PC Power 750, WD 150gb 10000rpm Raptor, Seagate 500gb, Silverstone TJ09 case, Vista Ultimate 64ASX Client: AMD 3700+ (@ 2.6 ghz), 7800GT

In other words, Sirocco, what Bill is saying is that the core of TS2 *is* in fact the core of FS11.RhettFS box: E8500 (@ 3.80 ghz), AC Freezer 7 Pro, ASUS P5E3 Premium, BFG 8800GTX 756 (nVidia 169 WHQL), 4gb DDR3 1600 Patriot Cas7 7-7-7-20 (2T), PC Power 750, WD 150gb 10000rpm Raptor, Seagate 500gb, Silverstone TJ09 case, Vista Ultimate 64ASX Client: AMD 3700+ (@ 2.6 ghz), 7800GT

>No, the "technology for this" is in the core platform.>The core platform is the common building block for TS2, ESP>and FS...>>...and any new simulator ACES may decide to build. :)The implication of what I posted is that it's "core platform".It makes more sense for this to be in TS2 than in FS; a train sim without people makes less sense than a flight sim without them. Given that this is implemented for TS2 the code is by implication available in the "core platform" and therefore doesn't need to be built from the ground up for future iterations of FS.

The people waving only will happen with a dense scenery setting. If set to very dense (like some of the posters on this forum) you get the mile high club in the cabin.:-wave

I'd like to know where the moderators are? How is this continuing in the FSX forum? If there is interest in FS11 waving hands (which I have no interest in), please move this to the FS11 forum.Richard

I dont think ACES will make the same mistake twice and cant wait to see what FS11 has in it, that includes hands waving or whatever else they put in it. One poster said they wanted a bare bones SIM that could be customized how the user wished. That actually might not be a bad idea. It would free MS up and allow them to perfect the the core of the sim. It would then be up to the developers to make the water, sky, land, ect.

Hi Rhett-I have been wishing for these items in fs for a long time. I almost consider xm weather a no/no go item now and it has paid for its way many times over.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/190837.jpgThe xm weather feed goes on a unit like the Garmin 496. Here is a shot from my trip yesterday-you can see us diverting well to the left of our course line. The "flags" by the airports give you a quick sense of what the airport conditions are (green =vfr yellow=marginal vfr etc.). You can click on an airport and all the metars/tafs will show up decoded. The front lines are depicted,sigmets, airmets and the nexrad is depicted in motion-on the bottom left it shows that paint is 25 minutes old-it cycles down to the most recent which is usually a couple minutes old up to about 30 minutes so you can see the trend. The red squares are severe cells and the red circle over kteb is a tfr. Incredible information!The stormscope which is outlined in red below shows actual lightening strikes up to 200 miles away-depicted as green dots. Between the two you have a pretty idea of where not to go!http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/190838.jpgMy blog:http://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/