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StoneC0ld

Will Microsoft keep Megis?

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What is everyones view on the matter, the situation is very political according to my flying instructor! Im sure most on here will be angry over the shutting of a much loved airport.Do you think that microsoft will keep Megis in memory? Or do away with it like Hong Kong? I think they should keep it in memory! I dont think they would even think about taking it out of FS. But maybe will they have a new signature airport? If so where do you think it should be?Love to hear peoples viewsSimon

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Meigs is definately worth keeping in FS, since it was the default airport in the Flight Simulator series since like the beginning. If Microsoft would name a new airport to take over from Meigs, I think it might be Boeing Field or SeaTac (Just a guess, since MS is located near there). If Microsoft did take Meigs out, I really think that the talented FS designers would put it right back soon after the new FS release, better than ever.

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I am sure this wont be a popular opinion but I think they should try a new airport. I have to say though I dont think I have ever bothered to fly a flight out of there. I usually fly from some of the outstanding add on scenery airports that are available. Just my opinion. Andrew

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I guess either way it isn't a big deal, since as you say whether they do or not we can just adjust it ourselves and make it work, but it would be odd not to start up at Meigs after installing fs2004. On one hand, it would be nice to keep it for sentimental value. It would also be nice to change things up a bit, as there are lots of cool airports out there that they could change to.

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Because FS is meant to model the real world, Meigs should be removed from flight sim. In fact, the sooner someone comes out with a patch to do just that, the sooner I can install it. Incidentally, it is very likely that aircraft which have used Meigs will switch to Gary...(GYY), which has multiple runways and is large enough for medium size passanger jets ala the 737. In a sense it has all that Meigs had, and more, and is an easy ride into downtown Chicago (depending on traffic.)For those of you who are also looking for a Chicago area default airport, I can recommend Waukegan...(UGN) about 40 miles north up the lake shoreline. I took flight lessons there (never able to finish, but that's another sad story...:-))...anyway, just a couple of thoughts.And, while like so many others, I am sorry to see Meigs closed, the fact is that as a redeveloped public park, joining Chicago's exisitng lakefront park system, it will benefit far more people. And, one more thought...just for the record:Those of you who do not live in or near Chicago, but know Meigs only through FS really have no right to complain. The only ones who do, are real life pilots who conceiveably could use it. Their complaints may be justified...for the rest, it strikes me as childish pique.sorry, but...that's how I feel.Sherm

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I don't really care one way or the other if MS keeps Megis. I think I have only flown in and out of their once or twice. Of course just because I don't go their, and I have changed my default start to someplace closer to real home, doesn't make my opinion matter much.Back to reality... didn't there used to be a race that was held at the Megis airport. I thought indy cars were raced there at one time. I may be wrong....

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My first comment is that Meigs should not be kept as the default airport. Chicago turned its back on the aviation community and has no right to be represented as the "signature" airfield in FS. In another thread I nominated KBKL in Cleveland, but there are many, many other vibrant GA airports in cities and towns throughout the world.My second comment is that the FS community does have the right to complain. Flight simmers, plane spotters or any kid who stands at the airport fence has a right to be dismayed and outraged at the willful destruction of a general aviation icon in this country.Many simmers go on to be pilots in the real world. It's something we should cherish in this country ... because in many other places the only thing you can fly are sims. Hundreds of public use airports are closing every year. It could get to the point where Pipers and Cessnas will be relagated to museums and the only place you can learn to fly is in the military.

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Microsoft should take out Meigs , and sue that a$$ mayor of Chicago... :) The new default airport should be something like KSEA or some smaller in the vicinity... maybe Ranger Creek (21W) :)

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Sherm,Good points! I agree that MS should be technically accurate and remove (replace Meigs). Like you said, there are many candidates in the US that can be the default for 2004. Hate to see it go but ...To your other point:"Those of you who do not live in or near Chicago, but know Meigs only through FS really have no right to complain. The only ones who do, are real life pilots who conceivably could use it. Their complaints may be justified...for the rest, it strikes me as childish pique."I have to take a position on this one. I grew up in Chicago and lived there off and on for years since then. I think I can "complain", as others in the "Windy", that Meigs was a significant part of the Historic aspect of this great city. It served a good purpose and was part of the magnificent lake front that many of us will remember forever. The "case" to remove it was never there and the EXCUSE used by Daley is pathetic and, un-substantiated.If Meigs "had to go" then it should have been done in a way where the memory could be preserved in a positive sense. Buldozing it in the darkness of a Sunday night, without notice, without involving all that will be effected, will only create controversy that will last for the years to come. It is a shame.Richard, the little Napoleon, has done something that his father would never had done (in that way). This mayor should be ashamed of his approach to this and the pompas ##### should be forced to rebuild it and do it the right way if he wants to.A great loss to a great City because of a Polictical "Hack" doing it "his way".

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Maybe MS will add loads of bulldozers with piles of soil with a sign on a post saying "Welcome to Megis"I for one never fly out of the place, maybe it's time for a change ?

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San Diego would be the next best city to me since downtown is so close to the airport. The way that town looks overall would be awesome for a default location.

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>>Those of you who do not live in or near Chicago, but know >Meigs only through FS really have no right to complain. The >only ones who do, are real life pilots who conceiveably >could use it. Their complaints may be justified...for the >rest, it strikes me as childish pique. >I think all GA pilots and aviation enthusiasts are effected by this. It wasn't just that Meigs was closed, but that it was closed in such a back-stabbing, barbaric manner. There are thousands of smaller airports that ignorant politicians all over the world would love to close to get hold of the real estate and eliminate noise issues. If they see that the mayor of Chicago can get away with unilaterally destroying an airport without repercussions then it could be another nail in the coffin for general aviation.

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I am afraid that my comments about a right to complain about the loss of Meigs and who has such rights came in a moment of high dudgeon. I take back that statement. Of course, everyone has a right to their opinion. I suppose it was some of the more childish sentiments expressed by chronic ranters that put me in a somewhat churlish mood.Sherm

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I just wanna correct something said by Skylane Pilot,You said:>Chicago turned its back on the aviation community You sound like you are blaming all the people in Chicago. The only people to blame are Mr. Daley, the police who guarded this operation in secrecy, and the constructuon workers. (And any others behind this operation). The FAA didnt even know about it, thus it was a completely secret plan- that doesnt mean it was all of Chicago.I hope that didn't sound mean, I wanted it to come out nicely to point a few things out :)No Hard Feelings,Jason

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I think that is exactly what Microsoft should do. Add bulldozers and add elevation changes to the runway so that it would be unuseable...while leaving Meigs as the start up scenario as always...this would allow millions of people to see for themselves in a vivid way what has happened.

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Meigs is not the only shuttered airport in Chicago still on FS. The Glenview Naval Air Station, located NE of O'Hare and Se of Palwaukee was decommissioned maybe ten years ago. What used to be an airbase is now a collection of single and multi family homes...upscale to say the least, in the suburb of Glenview IL...just, one more thing to rant over...:-)Sherm

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>You sound like you are blaming all the people in Chicago. >The only people to blame are Mr. Daley, the police who >guarded this operation in secrecy, and the constructuon >workers. (And any others behind this operation). The FAA >didnt even know about it, thus it was a completely secret >plan- that doesnt mean it was all of Chicago. No one even bothered to notify the tower crew. When they showed up for work at 4:30 am, they were prevented from entering the property... until a phone call from the FAA convinced the Chicago police that they must be allowed in to do their jobs. Just because no traffic could come in or out, the airspace is still under their control, until the FAA can make the appropriate changes.As far as the 16 a/c stranded there, one of 'em is a Merlin III (belongs to a good friend of mine) who's seething. There's no way he can T/O from the taxiway, so Daly's gonna have to pay through the nose to have it hauled to KGYY on a lowboy... :)The local media have been raking Daly over the coals on this issue, so I hope that it blows up in his face!

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Come on Sherm, you can't compare Meigs to Glenview... That's like trying to compare Hawaii to North Dakota. We're talking about lake front property here, overlooking one of the most beautiful skylines in the world... Toronto's downtown airport can't even compare to Chicago, in fact what city can. Not one person here is ranting about some local heartland airport very few have heard about, this is a major peace of aviation history that's going away. There must have been some reason why MS chose this airport over Glenview... Think about it Sherm and get back to me.

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No, Jason ... I certainly don't blame the people of Chicago. The blame is squarely and entirely on Mayor Daley and his Administration. I've done business in and around Chicago for years and actually like the city (the current situation not withstanding).I personally have decided to boycott Chicago moving forward. Not out of malice toward the people of Chicago, but out of respect for the general aviation community. I can't vote Daley out of office, but I can express my opinion with my wallet.Ulitimately, the only thing Daley and his ilk listen to is the tinkling of cash into their coffers.

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Marston mills Airport Shuts Down! It happened In my home town to :( This is also the site of my AMA remote control flying site!

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>Come on Sherm, you can't compare Meigs to Glenview... >That's like trying to compare Hawaii to North Dakota. We're >talking about lake front property here, overlooking one of >the most beautiful skylines in the world... Toronto's >downtown airport can't even compare to Chicago, in fact what >city can. Not one person here is ranting about some local >heartland airport very few have heard about, this is a major >peace of aviation history that's going away. There must >have been some reason why MS chose this airport over >Glenview... Think about it Sherm and get back to me. Dillo, I was not trying to compare the two airports...merely pointing out that MS was still showing another decomissioned airport in the Chicago area. I suspect it was more programmer error than anything else. As for why MS uses Meigs as its default, I posted an answer in a similar thread over at flightsim, somewhat different than the one I am about to give here, after having thought about it a little more. But, basically, or as Mayor Daley would say, "basiciiiy" (he has a hard time with his L's)...MS bought the original flight sim program written by Bruce Artwick, a Univeraity of Illinois computer science grad who was working in Champaign-Urbana, Illinois when he wrote the first program in the early 1980s. At that time, computering was in its infancy and the progrram was very primitive, with little more than wire frame images, and a lot of imagination required. I suspect that Artwick chose Meigs as his default starting airport because he could easily designate it as something unique by the image of the John Hancock Center off the the left in the distance. It is a building that was, and still is, easily depicted in wireframe format. I am only guessing about this, but, it would give sim flyers an easy and quick land reference for takeoff and landing in an otherwise fairly bare sim-landscape. When MS bought out Artiwck (in the midst of some controversy as I recall), the MS people evidently decided to keep Meigs as a measure of continuity. btw, flying vatsim yesterday afternoon the Chicago controller continued to allow the use of Meigs. A couple of pilots took advantage of that. I merely chose to do a quick touch and go in memory and have moved my FBO up the lakeshore to KUGN. I am still looking for someone to create the patch to show Meigs in its current reality...as much as I, like other simmers and pilots miss what was a great Chicago landmark and special spot for aviators.Sherm

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Getting back on topic, I would choose KSTL Lambert-St Louis International airport. This is a nice airport that is smack dab in the middle of the country with some nice scenery nearby.Tim13

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Hey allThanks for all your comments.Do you think that maybe some where totally different would be a good idea? The current software has us loading up in the middle of a brick jungle. Do you think maybe somewhere in alaska we could load up with amazing scenery all around us? Or maybe not even in the US.What is the opinion on these matters?Simon

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As a long time fan of the Flight Simulator series, I too regret the demise of Meigs, one of the most spectacular small airports.But, if you stop and think about it, Microsoft already have the perfect replacement for Meigs-it has a great reputation in aviation, particularly GA, it has a grea tie-in with the historical theme of FSaCoF (the EAA museum), highly detailed scenery is available from MS already, and it isn't all that far from Chicago either: Wittman Regional Airport(KOSH).

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