I don't see a problem with the G/A mode, it seems to do exactly what the FCOM says it will, which is different to what I'm used to seeing in other aircraft. Maybe that's why it appears wrong at first sight. The first push of the TOGA button is suppose to advance the throttles to a reduced G/A N1 as the aircraft aims first for 15 deg nose up pitch, then a V/S dependent on flap setting, which can be between 1000 and 2000 fpm. With engines this powerful that means at this stage N1 will be a lot less than full G/A rating for a stabilised climb. I haven't seen anything in the FCOM to say what flap setting gives what rate, but I get 1000 fpm at Flap 15. Presumably as flap is reduced, commanded V/S increases. A second push of the TOGA button gives you full G/A N1. I'd be very surprised if PMDG had got this AP mode too far wrong. It might need some tweaking depending on how smoothly it does all this, but that is something only an NG pilot can really comment on. Kevin Hall

And I thought my weekend on the forums was going well !! And then !!!......................This idiot shows up !

Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I like how the plane is loads better than anything else the community has seen but we still have these trolls around here to say it's terrible and their business practices are wrong. I wouldn't go off criticizing the team there, boss. I especially wouldn't criticize the team who's out there to try to fix your problems. I know they gave us all a product that they should stay behind, but there are projects that they're adding in that we didn't really "pay" for that we're getting in the SPs in the future. People like that guy give them little incentive to go beyond the basics of support. It's one thing to point out they messed something up. It's quite another to rub it in.

Gentlemen, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE actually read this post. The Go Around mode is working exactly as it should. The RTM version DID have an error in the inital Go Around mode but it was corrected, tested and confirmed in the Level D sims by several individuals to ensure it does exactly what the real 737 does. The First press of the TO/GA on a Coupled approach does NOT make the throttles advance to Go Around thrust and the Air does not have a massive pitch up. The throttles advance and the aircraft establishes a 1000-2000 FPM climb and begins to fly the Missed Approach procedure. The Autopilot will fly the aircraft to the Missed Approach Altitude and then level off to the speed loaded into the FMC (usually 240 kts), If you want to get the full Go Around thrust, as indicated several times in this post, press the button a second time.

Gentlemen, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE actually read this post. The Go Around mode is working exactly as it should. The RTM version DID have an error in the inital Go Around mode but it was corrected, tested and confirmed in the Level D sims by several individuals to ensure it does exactly what the real 737 does. The First press of the TO/GA on a Coupled approach does NOT make the throttles advance to Go Around thrust and the Air does not have a massive pitch up. The throttles advance and the aircraft establishes a 1000-2000 FPM climb and begins to fly the Missed Approach procedure. The Autopilot will fly the aircraft to the Missed Approach Altitude and then level off to the speed loaded into the FMC (usually 240 kts), If you want to get the full Go Around thrust, as indicated several times in this post, press the button a second time.

Its still broke sorry just sayin.

Small addition to the previous, when you press the TO/GA button with an active approach, the aircraft will pitch up to establish a 1000-2000 FPM climb profile at VREF or MCP speed. Speed will increase as you retract flaps. If you want the throttles to advance to the Go Around thrust setting, you must press the button a second time or not have an active approach loaded.

Its still broke sorry just sayin.

How would you know!!! You have posted 21 times, never sign your name, and always a sly comment aimed at people with more knowledge than you. Now there was a user on here a while back by the name of Tamati, who said he would never post here again, that is you ?

How would you know!!! You have posted 21 times, never sign your name, and always a sly comment aimed at people with more knowledge than you. Now there was a user on here a while back by the name of Tamati, who said he would never post here again, that is you ?

Chill. Im just a customer typing words onto these dodgy forums. Dont take it too seriously... Old Man.

See FCTM 5.85. It is fully automated - both autopilots are on and initially will handle pitch and heading until another mode intervention.

I'm not 100% positive on that - it might very well be for fail-op, but I'm pretty sure it's not for fail-pass. Will check it out in the sim.

Ok I don't get it. Just yesterday I was shooting about ten approaches in a row, testing various things (until the infamous big freeze), and I don't know why I remember hitting TOGA on multiple autolands that would immediately kick off the wailer and leave me with manual control (all fail-pass). Now however I tried another fail-pass approach, and this time, for whatever reason, it indeed flies the G/A on its own. I am confused. Nutha question - can someone enlighten me as to what weird speeds the G/A mode commands?? Also during flap retraction, speed increases somehow or other, but I see no concept in there whatsoever. Especially they have nothing to do with the flap maneuvering speeds. PS Also, why on earth do I get VOR/LOC/G/P armed every once in a while?? Everything is set up correctly, ILSs tuned and identified, G/S selected active on APPROACH page (which is standard for an ILS, so I didn't touch it at all), and yet I get VOR/LOC/G/P armed on the FMA and a LOC/G/P indication where you usually see IAN info on the PFD. And that is with the G/S in view already. Hitting APP constantly will eventually exchange G/P for G/S. But I have no idea why.

My problems with the go-around:after pushing the to/ga for the first time;- power initially increases to full GA-power and then drops back to a reduced setting where it should immediately stabilize at a reduced power setting- i get a 600-800 fpm climb where you should get 1000-2000 fpm (flaps 15, gear up)

Yes, I get full power as well, for a second. Thereafter it behaves pretty much like V/S mode. I always seem to get 1000 fpm spot on, it never aims for anything close to 2000. PS2 Ok now, as I understand it, letting the AP fly an ILS is pretty much independent from the FMS. In fact I could just dig up the chart, set up the radios, get my V_REF from the manual, set her on the localizer and go. No FMS involved at any point, and I don't think I'd have to select the approach on the DEP/ARR page either. Now try the following. Shoot the approach, and to be on the same side let's fly this as a coupled approach so let the APs do the work. At some point during the approach (earlier is probably better here), hit TOGA so as to "initiate" a go around, more importantly though to leave the ILS modes. Immediately cancel all warnings, gain manual control, kill AT and the APs and recycle the FDs. So your FMA should be clean and clear now. Also try not to leave the ILS too much. Now arm APP again. To my understanding, system wise we are at a point now that is no different from a usual ILS intercept (apart from that we're already spot on the LOC and G/S, more or less). However, I promise you won't get G/S armed in this state. You'll have to reselect the approach on the FMS, and then eventually it would let you arm G/S again. Remember, radios are totally unchanged, you still had your G/S indication, even around the center. And yet it won't arm. Thoughts?

Edited October 3, 201114 yr by badderjet

My problems with the go-around:after pushing the to/ga for the first time;- power initially increases to full GA-power and then drops back to a reduced setting where it should immediately stabilize at a reduced power setting- i get a 600-800 fpm climb where you should get 1000-2000 fpm (flaps 15, gear up)

Gentlemen, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE actually read this post. The Go Around mode is working exactly as it should. The RTM version DID have an error in the inital Go Around mode but it was corrected, tested and confirmed in the Level D sims by several individuals to ensure it does exactly what the real 737 does. The First press of the TO/GA on a Coupled approach does NOT make the throttles advance to Go Around thrust and the Air does not have a massive pitch up. The throttles advance and the aircraft establishes a 1000-2000 FPM climb and begins to fly the Missed Approach procedure. The Autopilot will fly the aircraft to the Missed Approach Altitude and then level off to the speed loaded into the FMC (usually 240 kts), If you want to get the full Go Around thrust, as indicated several times in this post, press the button a second time.

I'm sorry to disagree with you Paul,but the Non-Automatic (not a dual coupled AP) G/A in the NGX is completely erroneous compared to the real plane:- It disengages the A/P but it stays "ON in the background" and if you manually pitch up, it enters the CWS Mode for pitch and roll when you were flying F/D only! (that's ridiculous)- G/A power should remain sufficient to aprox. 2000ft/m and G/A Thrust Mode should remain on, not come back to cruise and reduce power when you need it the most- The second press should give you full thrust and STAY there, independent on any other mode, that's an autothrottle mode only! If you want get my help in beta-testing around these issues, I volunteer for that, no problem, just let me know.

Edited October 3, 201114 yr by zazaboeing

- It disengages the A/P but it stays "ON in the background" and if you manually pitch up, it enters the CWS Mode for pitch and roll when you were flying F/D only! (that's ridiculous)

Ah, thanks for clarifying that one. I've wondered why I always had to hit Z multiple times after initiating the G/A - now it makes "sense", as in between CWS obviously had to be disengaged. I was also thinking that hitting TOGA would disco the AP, then hitting the disco switch once should have canceled the warning. But now that you say it, I also see CWS engaged here so no wonder. BTW Rafael, would you care to elaborate on two more things during the go-around? When you hit TOGA (once) on the real deal does it 'set' reduced thrust and leave it there? The NGX does the following throughout the procedure: Set nearly full thrust initially. Reduct thrust to achieve around 1000 fpm. During flap retraction, speed bug will increase for every change of flap setting, and so will the thrust increase. GA mode behaves like V/S for the most part then. Once the new speed is attained, thrust reduced again, and the AP maintains about 1000 fpm. Bring up the flaps even further, same game. Speed bug goes up, thrust goes up, speed increases, thrust reduces, vertical speed about same as before. Next question, what on earth does the speed bug do during flap retraction after the go-around? As I said before I really don't get it. The speeds do increase, however they seem totally random to me. All automatic, I don't touch anything there, FMA shows GA | | TO/GA.

Ah, thanks for clarifying that one. I've wondered why I always had to hit Z multiple times after initiating the G/A - now it makes "sense", as in between CWS obviously had to be disengaged. I was also thinking that hitting TOGA would disco the AP, then hitting the disco switch once should have canceled the warning. But now that you say it, I also see CWS engaged here so no wonder.

Hi Etienne, you're right, that's the the correct procedure, Press To/Ga (this disengages the A/P) and you press the disco switch on the control wheel to cancel that irritating warning, while pitching up and requesting flaps 15! Make sure to add power if you had already turned the A/T off!The CWS has nothing to do in here, it shouldn't engage anytime after A/P disconnection. See ya!

Rafael, I'm back in the sim on Thursday so I will try to get some video of the Coupled vs Non coupled G/A for comparison. What equipment type are you operating? (FP or FO)

Yes, I get full power as well, for a second. Thereafter it behaves pretty much like V/S mode. I always seem to get 1000 fpm spot on, it never aims for anything close to 2000.

That's because it is something of a VS mode. The VS you get depends on the flap angle you have set for the climbout (that's my understanding of the mode anyway). Try selecting less flap angle and you will get a higher VS. Target climb speed also increased with less flap angle. Kevin Hall Edit, just noticed Rafael's post about Manual G/A above so my assumptions about VS and flap in Auto mode may be wrong (though Boeing have used that kind of logic in the past). But G/A is trying to achieve a VS.