Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

ja99

To Mip or not to Mip

Recommended Posts

Morning all,it`s09:00 Hrs here,my question is, what is the difference between Textures that are Mipmaps or 32bit or the straight texture as in most aia b737-800 ai aircraft.Waiting John Allen FAPS.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Help AVSIM continue to serve you!
Please donate today!

Mipmaps are a separate thing compared to the texture format (DXT or 32 bit), you can have either with or without Mipmaps.32 bit is very memory consuming since it's uncompressed RGBA, and should be used very sparingly for things that requires maximum precision, like a very smooth light halo, for example. Otherwise, in 99% of the cases, DXT it's far better and faster. A texture in DXT takes 6 times less video memory than a 32 bit one.Not having Mipmaps, instead, is very wrong, it's a cheap trick to make textures "sharp" if one doesn't know how to properly configure its video card for Anisotropic filtering. If, instead, one *does* how to configure it, loading something without Mipmaps will result in terrible flickering, shimmering, and all nasty moire effects that results from applying a 1024x1024 texture over a surface which might be just a few pixel in size (like an AI in the distance). One should always MipMap *everything*...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
A texture in DXT takes 6 times less video memory than a 32 bit one.
This depends on which type of DXT compression is used. DXT1 is a 8:1 compression ration where DXT3 is 4:1
One should always MipMap *everything*...
...except user aircraft textures. Using mips on user aircraft will result in blurry textures when viewed in spot view.regardsJoe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
...........One should always MipMap *everything*...
Not always, in given situations MipMaps do cause blurry errors in FS9.Sometimes its of benefit - depending on the scenery. Sometimes, rarely, I have had to remove mipmaps from add-on scenery textures in order for the scenery to work properly and stop dramatically blurring everything when flying closer to it.As already mentioned on flyable aircraft (including the VC) mipmaps will blur the textures. But they are absolutely necessary for AI (especially if a lot of AI is used).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This depends on which type of DXT compression is used. DXT1 is a 8:1 compression ration where DXT3 is 4:1
More precisely, it's 6:1 for DXT1, if the original source was a 24 bit image, or 4:1 for DXT3 if the original source was 32 bit.
...except user aircraft textures. Using mips on user aircraft will result in blurry textures when viewed in spot view.
I believe the OP was asking what to do with AI airplanes, the whole point of Mipmapping is to improve image quality for distant objects, so that doesn't really apply to the user airplane.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Not always, in given situations MipMaps do cause blurry errors in FS9.Sometimes its of benefit - depending on the scenery. Sometimes, rarely, I have had to remove mipmaps from add-on scenery textures in order for the scenery to work properly and stop dramatically blurring everything when flying closer to it.As already mentioned on flyable aircraft (including the VC) mipmaps will blur the textures. But they are absolutely necessary for AI (especially if a lot of AI is used).
This may explain a problem I inquired about once and couldn't get any information on. There is an outstanding freeware scenery entitled Mega Scenery Zvartnots - Armenia 2008. But when you are on approach, at around 800 ft as I recall, all the textures go blurry. It happens no matter what aircraft you use or with AI on or off, any weather, any time of day. Would this be caused by mipped textures and if so, if I use DXTBmp to convert them will that work?CheersIan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This may explain a problem I inquired about once and couldn't get any information on. There is an outstanding freeware scenery entitled Mega Scenery Zvartnots - Armenia 2008. But when you are on approach, at around 800 ft as I recall, all the textures go blurry. It happens no matter what aircraft you use or with AI on or off, any weather, any time of day. Would this be caused by mipped textures and if so, if I use DXTBmp to convert them will that work?CheersIan
I like Zvartnots, its a fantastic scenery - Flying from here to Sochi is among my favorite routes.The problem at Zvartnots is definitely caused by some of the scenery's textures. I've been hunting around for the culprit textures but I just haven't had enough time to go over all of them yet. When I finally fix it - will upload the texture fix to the AVSIM library. Its embarrassing, I've been meaning to do this for the last 2 years now - but something always comes-up...... or I just want to fly and not mess around with textures.Zvartnots and its textures have proven 'touchy' and some of them - taxi-way, line markings.... can not be re-edited because then they will not show up at all. The scenery has a lot of textures, so its proving time consuming to go over all of them.If you are using a mesh in the region try to remove/deactivate it and see if that helps, in some cases the problem only comes up when you use the scenery in conjunction with a mesh.Some of the add-on sceneries where I've experienced and fixed this problem was at Varna, Plovdiv, Tivat and some Russian freeware. With Istanbul Ataturk airport too, but here the original creators released texture fixes themselves. Problem is usually caused by DXT3 textures with mipmaps. Usually re-editing the textures to DXT1 is enough to fix the issue, other times it is necessary to re-edit some textures as 32-bit bmp because they will not show up if re-edited as DXT1, and yet other times it is also necessary to remove mipmaps in addition to re-editing the texture format. Also in some cases just getting rid of the mipmaps is enough. It can depend on the scenery.Give it a try with DXTBmp or the ConvIm batch conversion tool. If you fix it before me, feel free to share biggrin.png!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I like Zvartnots, its a fantastic scenery - Flying from here to Sochi is among my favorite routes.The problem at Zvartnots is definitely caused by some of the scenery's textures. I've been hunting around for the culprit textures but I just haven't had enough time to go over all of them yet.
I've also experienced the Zvarnots problem. Fly around, shift view to pick up the scenery and pow, all goes blurry.scott s..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I've also experienced the Zvarnots problem. Fly around, shift view to pick up the scenery and pow, all goes blurry.scott s..
Yes, I just tried converting the textures to DXT but it made no difference. It's really quite strange as it happens like clockwork. You are on approach, pass through 800 ft (if I remember correctly) and bam, all the textures except the addon airport ones go blurry. I've never experienced this with any other scenery. It's a shame as it really is an outstanding freeware product

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Zvartnots .... not bad ...KEPxD.jpgpg6t9.jpgK1TXT.jpgzfSJ7.jpgyVMuy.jpgSBQlq.jpg
I don't think anybody would dispute that it's an outstanding scenery - it is one of the best freeware sceneries I've seen. The problem is that at certain altitudes on approach all of the surrounding textures become blurry on my system and everything I've tried to do to fix it hasn't worked. Nobody is criticizing the scenery - it is wonderful. I just wish I could come up with a solution to the intermittent blurry textures

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello!It`s very easy to fix the blyrry`s on this scenery, you just have to convert two bmp. files to dxt3; ugee-wall05_lm and ugee-wall05.That`s all.R.Thor Henning

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hello!It`s very easy to fix the blyrry`s on this scenery, you just have to convert two bmp. files to dxt3; ugee-wall05_lm and ugee-wall05.That`s all.R.Thor Henning
So these could be the culprit textures I've been looking for!I must have messed around with most of the textures for this scenery in attempts to fix this problem, but I don't remember trying these two.Will give it a try ASAP. Thanks for the information!EDIT:It works! Re-edited the two textures as DXT3 with no mipmaps.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I used to use DXT on scenery but up close I find it does not have the necessary sharpness. Over the years with the improvments in the computer specs I have found that the need for DXTs is becoming less important. So for main terminal buildings I use 32bit and for ground I use 16bit and for other peripheral 3D objects I use DXTs.Shez

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
So these could be the culprit textures I've been looking for!I must have messed around with most of the textures for this scenery in attempts to fix this problem, but I don't remember trying these two.Will give it a try ASAP. Thanks for the information!EDIT:It works! Re-edited the two textures as DXT3 with no mipmaps.
Yes it did work! Thanks guys - this is a great scenery and I'm glad to have it working properly

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites