Much as I respect, admire and appreciate the great products that most payware developers supply, I am beginning feel somewhat concerned by the growing aggressive and, apparent arrogant manner in which some are treating us - CUSTOMERS.Here is an example posted here on Avsim today by a major player: "...Some of the posts above are so woefully ignorant of facts that the posters should be banned just for voicing an opinion on a topic about which they know absolutely nothing."And: "...So before anyone goes of running their mouth with ignorant, uninformed crap- take a moment to think through the fact that you are completely unaware of 95% of what goes on in the background."Regardless of whether or not some may state those quotes are 'out of context', if I posted words in that way, I would fully expect to have the post deleted and possibly even banned.I am fully aware that ALL forums have their share of 'trolls' and/or moaners, complainers etc. However... Please developers, remember we are not all from the same stable.I really don't think the posts like that quoted lead a good example.

But on the other hand, if a situation doesn't pertain to you then you know you can ignore it. And the above quote is from the owner of the company in his own forum here.

Hi.OED online gives two definitions of 'crap'...'…something of extremely poor quality… ' and '…a losing throw of 2,3, or 12 in craps… '... but we all know the word is generally regarded as vulgar when used in such a context (this is indicated by Webster's) and its public use by the owner of a company is very unprofessional. There's no excuse, though I don't imagine the company owner would delete his own post.Regards,Dedited with a p. s. Gosh, a bit slow this morning. Welcome back.

But on the other hand, if a situation doesn't pertain to you then you know you can ignore it. And the above quote is from the owner of the company in his own forum here.

Not really relevant Jim. One rule for them and another for us?

But on the other hand, if a situation doesn't pertain to you then you know you can ignore it. And the above quote is from the owner of the company in his own forum here.

As you are a commercial member affiliated with one of my favorite products, it pains me to hear that from you. When I walk into (for instance) a Sprint store I expect kind, courteous, forgiving behavior. If I don't get that, I leave. The same goes for product forums. In fact, I'm so hard headed that I will not support a product if I've ever witnessed the developer/s being blatantly rude to would be/current customers. Of course this also depends on the particular circumstance.

So what you are both saying is that if a line of posts are totally wrong, un-informed, and off the wall, a developer cannot say a single thing? We are just supposed to sit here and not address totally wrong posts when it is clear they are totally wrong? Remember we are not talking about opinion here, but posts about inaccurate-false information that is actually harmful. So it's OK for customers to lie?Zach, no worries because for 2 months now I have not had any ties to said products. So if you walk into your Sprint store and there is a crazy fool shouting nonsense about Sprint, you don't expect the manager to address such foolishness?Phil, if a normal member had the proper knowledge about a product and posted the same thing as RSR did, I would also expect that post to stay in place as well. But I don't see where they would have that proper knowledge.This is the same reason why a total bashing of a product or company is not allowed to continue, because people don't think the company has a right to respond, only sit there and take it all in.I should post the link to a pretty famous article that talks about how the customer is NOT always right.

Yeh well lets not fogget the picture there painting for people reading the forum, looking for info on said product.They then read what the dev's post....u get my drift..Customers may not always be right but telling them they are incorrect in that manner will have them walking out on you.Simple.So someone comes here with false info about your product...what do you do..scream, shout, stamp your feet and disrespectfully belittle them..Or:Kindly, without aggression, explain were they are wrong, correct them, and thank them for thier concern.??????I have always found that the latter...being kind and curtiose to customers....landed me with more beer tokens for a friday night :)Just remember:''Customers make paydays possible''..

Of course, the customer is not always right. The customer has a problem. If it were not so, they wouldn't be posting, or in the store. If they knew everything (non-ignorant) they wouldn't be posting, or in the store. I think that anyone who runs a business has a responsibility to be a better example than some of the poor folks who are their customers. Of course you can respond when someone isn't getting it. If I have a problem, I like it to be handled, not to be told I am an idiot(even if I am). I think that most folks who are problem customers have been ripped off before(or so they think) and feel the only way to get results is to go in with both guns blazing. I think there is enough blame to go around.If a retailer can't find a way to deal with people, maybe they need to do something else. And yes, I have delt with problem customers. Bob

So what you are both saying is that if a line of posts are totally wrong, un-informed, and off the wall, a developer cannot say a single thing? We are just supposed to sit here and not address totally wrong posts when it is clear they are totally wrong? Remember we are not talking about opinion here, but posts about inaccurate-false information that is actually harmful. So it's OK for customers to lie?Zach, no worries because for 2 months now I have not had any ties to said products. So if you walk into your Sprint store and there is a crazy fool shouting nonsense about Sprint, you don't expect the manager to address such foolishness?

Sorry to hear that, Jim.And fair enough, but you catch my drift. In the mentioned post, I can see where the said developer is coming from. But I fear that's because I may be a ###### of the said company... I'm not quite sure.

So what you are both saying is that if a line of posts are totally wrong, un-informed, and off the wall, a developer cannot say a single thing? We are just supposed to sit here and not address totally wrong posts when it is clear they are totally wrong? Remember we are not talking about opinion here, but posts about inaccurate-false information that is actually harmful. So it's OK for customers to lie?Zach, no worries because for 2 months now I have not had any ties to said products. So if you walk into your Sprint store and there is a crazy fool shouting nonsense about Sprint, you don't expect the manager to address such foolishness?Phil, if a normal member had the proper knowledge about a product and posted the same thing as RSR did, I would also expect that post to stay in place as well. But I don't see where they would have that proper knowledge.This is the same reason why a total bashing of a product or company is not allowed to continue, because people don't think the company has a right to respond, only sit there and take it all in.I should post the link to a pretty famous article that talks about how the customer is NOT always right.

That's NOT what I said AT ALL Jim, and I'm quite sure you know that.However, if I were to say, as a result of that, that you're talking "crap" etc, I'm more than just a little sure the moderators here would have something to say - and RIGHTLY so in my opinion.I saw a great deal of double standards in the forces and tend to find it insulting, to say the least.

That's NOT what I said AT ALL Jim, and I'm quite sure you know that.However, if I were to say, as a result of that, that you're talking "crap" etc, I'm more than just a little sure the moderators here would have something to say - and RIGHTLY so in my opinion.I saw a great deal of double standards in the forces and tend to find it insulting, to say the least.

In honesty, a particular company draws a lot of water around here. A lot. But in context, I'm having trouble seeing a big issue with the way this particular post went. However, there have been a few other threads that ended like this with much less antagonizing. I'm no mod, but I would have deleted the post. Oh well.

In honesty, a particular company draws a lot of water around here. A lot. But in context, I'm having trouble seeing a big issue with the way this particular post went. However, there have been a few other threads that ended like this with much less antagonizing. I'm no mod, but I would have deleted the post. Oh well.

Couldn't agree more Zach. If it were my forum, I would've locked or deleted it MUCH sooner. I'm surprised he let it get anywhere near that far. That, I don't have any issue with at all. As stated, it's their forum, they can do as they wish.It was the words used that I found so offensive.

Couldn't agree more Zach. If it were my forum, I would've locked or deleted it MUCH sooner. I'm surprised he let it get anywhere near that far. That, I don't have any issue with at all. As stated, it's their forum, they can do as they wish.It was the words used that I found so offensive.

I agree. The thread should have been locked after the penultamate post saying that PMDG won't allow discussion of their legal matters - a very valid point.I could see nothing in the previous post to warrant such the final ofensive outburst.

The ideal situation would be that customers and vendors treat each other with mutual respect. Unfortunately we do not live in an ideal world.Introduce those who's sole purpose is to bash, post misinformation, and generally cause havoc and the situation turns into something that resembles OWS.

Ron has a very valid point. Especially considering the MASSIVE forum membership jump, just after the latest aircraft release. Although obviously great for the developer with big sales figures, over night it transformed a once great and friendly discussion and support forum, into something resembling the forum of a 'first person shooter' type game, including an obviously high number of impatient 'youngsters'.I do feel though, that such developers should refrain from actually being offensive - under any cirmumstances. Especially when considering they have absolute control over the previous postings anyway.I'm trying hard to be as diplomatic as possible, and NOT make this any kind of 'bash' ( I hate that word - surely there's a better one? ). I love their software and NORMALLY greatly admire their methods also. I guess everyone has a breaking point. I reiterate though.... how would I (or you?) have been treated having posted that?