On 2 August 2005, Air France Flight 358, an Airbus A340-300 (registration F-GLZQ) overshot the runway at Toronto Pearson International Airport during a thunderstorm. The plane continued for 300 metres before coming to rest at the bottom of a ravine at the end of the runway adjacent to Highway 401. All 297 passengers and 12 crew survived but the plane was completely destroyed by fire. The investigation predominately blamed pilot error when faced with the severe weather conditions.On 1 June 2009, Air France Flight 447, an Airbus A330-203 (registration F-GZCP) flew directly into a thunderstorm..........This was the second accident in a row involving Air France aircraft flying directy into a thunderstorm....This suggests to me a culture of Beat the storm or Get-There-Itus with the culture at Air France.This has been studied heavily in the USA and many recomondations due to the amount of storms from Florida, Texas and up through the Mid-West. Air France should take note.Cheers

Go on, say that again, I dare you...

I think you may have misunderstood me there.... I'm not saying that it is easy to fly commercial... I'm saying that planes today may give a false sense of "Plug and Play".... in that you plug something in, and expect the plane to do one thing, but it does another.

I'm here to answer questions, but one point on the Colgan crash is that it was complacency induced by fatigue. For the record, I would have been more than happy to fly with the crew on that aircraft if they hadn't been pushed to their physical limits. All humans have a point beyond which they can no longer function properly and they were pushed well past this point on the night in question.

I know, I had to do a sort of report for Air Safety in my 'Riddle class. Complacency brought on by fatigue is still complacency. That scheduling is so screwed up at the regionals shows a trend of complacency on several levels (dispatch and the pilots not claiming fatigue) as far as I'm concerned. Of course, we knew that already.

I think you may have misunderstood me there.... I'm not saying that it is easy to fly commercial...

It is. He just has to keep that image. :(

Did the Aircrew activate the passenger seatbelts sign at any time?

Did the Aircrew activate the passenger seatbelts sign at any time?

I'd assume they'd have had the seatbelt sign on due to the CB and turbulence in the vicinity before the pitot's iced over and everything went pear-shaped...Capt. Rónán Kyne.

Did the Aircrew activate the passenger seatbelts sign at any time?

 

LOL... Sorry... That was kind of funny, but no disrespect is intended.

 

The first thought I had was of some poor passenger looking over to the next person and saying; "Hey, we're kind of in a nose dive... should we put on our seat belts?"...

 

 

More seriously.. I wish no one would have to endure that kind of horror.

On 2 August 2005, Air France Flight 358, an Airbus A340-300 (registration F-GLZQ) overshot the runway at Toronto Pearson International Airport during a thunderstorm. The plane continued for 300 metres before coming to rest at the bottom of a ravine at the end of the runway adjacent to Highway 401. All 297 passengers and 12 crew survived but the plane was completely destroyed by fire. The investigation predominately blamed pilot error when faced with the severe weather conditions.

 

On 1 June 2009, Air France Flight 447, an Airbus A330-203 (registration F-GZCP) flew directly into a thunderstorm..........

 

This was the second accident in a row involving Air France aircraft flying directy into a thunderstorm....This suggests to me a culture of Beat the storm or Get-There-Itus with the culture at Air France.

 

This has been studied heavily in the USA and many recomondations due to the amount of storms from Florida, Texas and up through the Mid-West. Air France should take note.

 

Cheers

 

Good comment.

 

Korean Air and China Airlines suffered from the non working crew syndrome, with Captains being treated as Gods.

 

Mayday (Aircrash Investigations) has quite a few examples of this.