Ronan, btw, did you maybe miss my topic above - you might be one who could know that.

http://forum.avsim.net/topic/386773-how-does-one-pay-for-atpl/page__st__50#entry2483958

Here is a question in the middle... I see the way is going like this PPL -> CPL -> ATPL. For example, a company here close to me, JetAlliance, is a bizjet flyer, and they do all types of trainings, ab initios, up to ATPL.

Now, I *read* on one forum they are offering you to pay for PPL, and if you are good, they might take you and pay for rest but you must fly 3 years at least for them afterwards. I will make contact with them next week inquiring about this, but what do you say initially about that? But if I understand it correctly, for bizjets CPL is enough, correct? You need ATPL only to fly big airliners?

 

And let's say I would do a PPL+CPL, selfpaid or not and get a job as bizjet pilot, and fly for couple of years, then make an ATPL, would my flown hours count when applying for ATPL jobs in various companies?

Depends on whether or not you want to be the PIC or SIC(P2), for PIC you'd need an ATPL unless it was less than 12.5 tons MTOW (Off the top of my head). For SIC(P2) a CPL should do. And those hours will count towards total time, though most airlines base their entry requirements on PIC time not Total time.

 

Regards,

Ró.

Depends on whether or not you want to be the PIC or SIC(P2), for PIC you'd need an ATPL unless it was less than 12.5 tons MTOW (Off the top of my head). For SIC(P2) a CPL should do. And those hours will count towards total time, though most airlines base their entry requirements on PIC time not Total time.

 

The limit is actually 12500 lbs (5700 kg). And you can only be PIC on single pilot ops.

The limit is actually 12500 lbs (5700 kg). And you can only be PIC on single pilot ops.

I had a feeling I was mixing something up there, thanks for clearing that up for me. I'll be the first to admit I made a mistake there, sorry for that guys.

 

Regards,

Rónán.

Hey Word Not Allowed just one thing I think you should do before you go any further with any of this is go and get the highest-rated aviation medical you can find. Here in NZ, you need a Class-1 medical for a CPL/ATPL and even then, our national carrier has their own medical exam which is even more stringent. My older brother got caught out on this years ago when he was just about to start flying for them - they did a very specialized colour-blindness test and found he couldn't see a very obscure shade of green. That was the end of any talk of him getting into the airline. He was gutted needless to say and the regs vary from country to country (not sure what European policies are) as far as I know but it would suck really badly to get as far as he did and miss out on such a small silly thing.

 

For myself being a pilot was always my dream but I was recently (last Friday in fact) diagnosed with juvenile myoclonic epilepsy (haven't had any seizures in years but apparently my EEG test showed abnormal electrical brainwave activity) so I won't be getting anywhere near the cockpit of an airliner. In fact, I won't even be able to get a PPL or fly solo as I can't get a class-2 medical so yea...sucks for me.

 

Just do yourself a favour and make sure your health checks out 100%.

That is one really great suggestion. I'll check it where these tests are made.

they did a very specialized colour-blindness test and found he couldn't see a very obscure shade of green.

 

That's a subject that gets a lot of attention in aviation. A cousin of mine came across the same problem years ago which effectively ruled him out of the cockpit. Incidentally, being a blood relative I imagine I could have similar issues if I were to sit a specialized test. I have always found the ishihara test difficult but never actually failed it.

 

http://www.pprune.or...thread-4-a.html

 

Look at the table on post 2.

Strangely enough Australia seems to be fairly relaxed about it.

My older brother got caught out on this years ago when he was just about to start flying for them - they did a very specialized colour-blindness test and found he couldn't see a very obscure shade of green. That was the end of any talk of him getting into the airline.

 

In NZ lantern test is not alowed? I have problems with some colors, but i think that can be solved becouse i never had a problem with night driving or something like that. And i have a lot of night km

 

 

For myself being a pilot was always my dream but I was recently (last Friday in fact) diagnosed with juvenile myoclonic epilepsy (haven't had any seizures in years but apparently my EEG test showed abnormal electrical brainwave activity) so I won't be getting anywhere near the cockpit of an airliner. In fact, I won't even be able to get a PPL or fly solo as I can't get a class-2 medical so yea...sucks for me.

 

Just do yourself a favour and make sure your health checks out 100%.

 

I'm really sorry about that

 

 

Word Not Allowed, maybe you know allready, but PPRUNE FORUMS is the nice place for your questions http://www.pprune.org/

You can hear a lot of things about training, jobs and airlines politic's etc.

I have a similar situation and ambition, i did some research earlier this year and bizjet is a good option. I'm going for PPL next year, will see after that... My dream is airliner too, but i decided to go with small steps and postponed final decision. Maybe i'll go for ATPL, or maybe I might be able to afford private flying in the future, if I'm happy with that.

I feel that I was made for this job, but judgment tell's me no need to rush.

 

This days I'm going to meet a friend who have ATPL for more then a year and He's looking for a job, i'll tell you if i find out some interesting news

That's a subject that gets a lot of attention in aviation. A cousin of mine came across the same problem years ago which effectively ruled him out of the cockpit. Incidentally, being a blood relative I imagine I could have similar issues if I were to sit a specialized test. I have always found the ishihara test difficult but never actually failed it.

 

http://www.pprune.or...thread-4-a.html

 

Look at the table on post 2.

Strangely enough Australia seems to be fairly relaxed about it.

 

Yea I think it was a lantern test that he failed on and as I recall he was told that flying in Australia with those conditions was possible but I think the problem was that flying into other countries where that isn't allowed would be a legal issue or somesuch.

 

 

I'm really sorry about that

 

At least I'll be a lot richer not having to pay for lessons lol =D.

Well, I looked at this lantern test, it's a shape or number hidden in one color in a bunch of other points, right? No problems recognizing, at least not on my screen as it is...

Well, I looked at this lantern test, it's a shape or number hidden in one color in a bunch of other points, right? No problems recognizing, at least not on my screen as it is...

 

No I think that's called an Ishihara test as per below:

 

http://www.toledo-be...nd/Ishihara.asp

 

The lantern test (called a Farnsworth Lantern Test apparently) involves having to identify, from a distance, two colours that are shown quite close together as described here:

 

http://www.livestron...olor-blindness/

 

I guess it makes sense that being able to distinguish colors close together like that (i.e. red and green) is important in aviation. I've taken the Ishihara test before but never completed a FALANT so can't offer first-hand experience. Although the Ishihara test is used it seems the FALANT is far more important for aviation purposes.

This European Aviation Safety Agency document deals with medical requirements. They are complex.

 

I suggest that the OP has the appropriate medical examination before proceeding further, rather than discussing medical requirements in this, or other, forums.

I just had a very cool talk with a guy working in one training school, who are doing integrated ATPLs, training for other companies etc.

 

He said explicitly that he can't promise me any jobs afterwards, but due to the reason that they work together with other airlines (he said his simulators are used for yearly trainings of various european airlines and companies), he could help me open couple of doors for easier applications etc.

 

Furthermore, he also told me I'm at the limit for the airliner with my 33, especially since starting now, but I'm not too old. I will surely have it harder than other younger pilots but it's not impossible according to him. Also he says that the older I get, the more chance I would have flying a business jet.

 

What do you think about it?

What do you think about it?

 

Who knows? It can either go extremely well. Or it can go straight to hell. Certainly, somewhere between the two.

 

Well, say you did the professional pilot route with PPL CPL ME IR, ATPL theory. Heck, even throw in MCC and a type rating - but no jobs in sight.

 

Would you have the means to put food on the table and pay your bills after you have completed the training?

 

I am not saying don't do it. All I am saying is be careful and think it through. Starting from scratch, without a big pile of cash, at the age of 33, you will have to make some sacrifices.

 

Sincerely, good luck with the decision.

Would you have the means to put food on the table and pay your bills after you have completed the training?

 

If I took the bank loan and got no job afterwards, no way. Besides, my girlfriend wouldn't allow me for that scenario - by allow I mean, she wouldn't agree me going that route. And I would respect that.

 

Thanks anyways.