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voodoo101

Why can AVSIM not be a troll free zone

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It is a shame that the AVSIM forums have turned into such a site for trolls. It used to be a place where people shared problems and found solutions, where people could chat about flying and simming, however in recent times it has become a place where bored people just sit and troll as many sections as possible.

 

Simple questions cannot be asked without "read the manual" and "search". Sometime the search does not find the specific question, sometimes the information in the manual is too hard to understand for the beginner (remember that not all the people on the forum have been simming for years, some are newbies).

 

Then you have the people who just want to argue, you ask a simple question and instead of getting and answer, they give you information that they know nothing about. Quite often the post turns into a slanging match where the troll will keep it going just for fun. Many a good post is lost as the arguments continue.

 

There are quite a few members on here that I would ban if I was a moderator because I can see how they are bringing these forums down. 

 

In my opinion, the new way of rating comments has just made it worse as they all jump on the bandwagon.

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People say "don't feed the trolls" but to be honest I have no idea what they eat

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People say "don't feed the trolls" but to be honest I have no idea what they eat

 

Mostly adventurers.    Maybe some cookies here and there.

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Is a troll free zone even possible on the Internet? I believe not because we are dealing with humans and human nature.

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I have noticed that since the release of P3D the increase in "how great thou are X-Plane" seems to be growing on a daily basis. Amazing how much its performance, visuals, and on and on have improved over the last 5 or 6 days while the program has just been sitting there on people's hard drives. No slam to X-Plane guys. We all are guilty of defending our own Fav's when it comes to flight sims. Just sort of fun to watch.


Is a troll free zone even possible on the Internet? I believe not because we are dealing with humans and human nature.

AVSIM without Trolls would be like Mexican Food with no spice.

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Well, the new ratings system is making things worse. Don't know who had the bright idea, but hopefully they will just please scrap the damn thing. The old system was anonymous, this one isn't. Now if you rate someone in a certain way and it's not approved of by someone else, it becomes a personal manhunt. No sir, didn't like it... No rating system would be better than this. The old one wasn't broken IMHO.

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Still better then airliners.net = arm chair experts.

 

This forum is still pretty good.  I am on other forums ie trains and you should hear some of the foamers over there.  This is a big forum, and with so many members some get off by trolling others.

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Craig, is this because of your post back in the PMDG genral forums? Not reading the stickies? Or did Kyle rile you up? Either way, no was was trolling on that thread. In general, true trolls don't come by here much.

 

At least most AVSIM forum sections don't have intentional trolls.

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Craig, is this because of your post back in the PMDG genral forums? Not reading the stickies? Or did Kyle rile you up? Either way, no was was trolling on that thread. In general, true trolls don't come by here much.

 

At least most AVSIM forum sections don't have intentional trolls.

 

Nothing to do with a particular post and as to Kyle, I don't get wound up in arguments, it was just a general observation. I have seen it on a few sections of the forums and lots of post by lots of people. It seems like somebody posts a question and gets slated. I must admit that it does seem that the PMDG forum is a bit worse. There are a lot of PMDG fans that jump to the defence of PMDG no matter what, somebody enquired as to an update on and update and next thing you know it about 5 pages long with people putting him down, heaven forbid he asked a question.

 

I do understand that people have there favourites and they like to point out the benefits of one or the other, it give people a chance to make an informed decision, a ration discussion never hurt anyone, it just seems that some people like to change there point dependant on what the question is, just to make it into an argument and then start slagging off the opp or anyone who disagree's for no reason.

 

Over the years I have followed AVSIM and have been simming for many years, when 2D cockpits where made out of lines and an outside view was a grid. AVSIM used to be a place for discussion and sharing, a place where you used to get help for problems and information on new products. Now it seems a place where people want to stir up arguments, many times without problems being solved and questions being answered. It's getting more like the comments on Youtube every day, on there people put up videos to help and get stupid comments saying how they did something slightly incorrect. The fact that you have to sign in makes no difference and adding a "dumb" button makes it worse. Maybe it is because FSX is easier to run now, when it would not run right and everybody had problems it was like a bond. Maybe it is because high quality aircraft like the NGX has brought FSX back into the mainstream and brought with it a new type of simmer, who has never been through the rough times and expects everything on a plate.

 

I think it may be time to do like many others have done and find another forum, where people respect the hobby that we all share and have mutual respect for other members.

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I honestly don't think AVSIM is filled with trolls.

 

It's one of the least troll-ridden forums that I visit   - the only forum I visit that has less trolls in it is a Buddhist community, so that's pretty good going for AVSIM! :lol:

 

A lot of what you describe Craig, is just disagreement and discussion, perhaps some hot air, but it's not really trolling.    As he has come up in this discussion, I'll say that I don't like Kyle's posting manner too much (he probably doesn't like mine, that's fair enough!), but I'd never ever consider him a troll.          

 

(BTW, I know you weren't calling Kyle a troll either, I'm just using that as an example for how just because someone's "style", personality, or ego may not suit us individually, it doesn't mean that they are a troll, or even that you are right and they are wrong).

 

A troll is someone who has no purpose or agenda other than to disrupt an internet community and to bring the like-minded discussion into chaos and conflict.

 

Very few people in this community fit that description ......... and if they do come here, they won't last long as Tom will fish 'em out and cast 'em into his pond, as food for his cats   :wink:

 

The AVSIM membership often like to beat themselves up; to reflect on the bad things, but if you look at the full picture, this is a strikingly positive community.   :cool:

 

Amen!

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When I first came here 20+ years ago (I think) These forums were full of helpful people and it was a nice place. It was so nice that everyone knew individuals because of their knowledge.

 

My memory fades as I get older but I could name them. Only a few are left but most are gone because the trolls have changed the flavour completely, and its not a friendly place it used to be any more.

 

Those that I remember fondly  are Les Dillon and Larry Adamson to name a few. All the PMDG guys are very helpful. Bryan York is probably the best supporter/Developer of all, and another great guy is Ryan (Tabs).

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I like the rating system. One thing I do not like about the Orbx forum is anytime someone (Like JV) makes a post it is followed by 60 attaboy, thank you, we love you JV...... and you have to dig for any real questions or answers.

 

At least with this system you can just agree and thank or vise versa without taking up three pages.

 

Just my opinion.

 

But attaboy for making the troll post. :LMAO:

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Whenever you get a feeling that a certain community is just full of a--holes and s---heads it generally helps to spend a few minutes reading YouTube comments. Be warned though that prolonged exposure may cause you to lose any faith in humanity that you previously had.

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Whenever you get a feeling that a certain community is just full of a--holes and s---heads it generally helps to spend a few minutes reading YouTube comments. Be warned though that prolonged exposure may cause you to lose any faith in humanity that you previously had.

So true on YouTube out of the blue some guy will comment on how great ###### was or that he is gonna do your mom.

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I dont think AVSim has too many trolls it's just that there's a couple that are always around

 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

 

 

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Nothing to do with a particular post and as to Kyle, I don't get wound up in arguments, it was just a general observation. I have seen it on a few sections of the forums and lots of post by lots of people. It seems like somebody posts a question and gets slated. I must admit that it does seem that the PMDG forum is a bit worse. There are a lot of PMDG fans that jump to the defence of PMDG no matter what, somebody enquired as to an update on and update and next thing you know it about 5 pages long with people putting him down, heaven forbid he asked a question.

 

I do understand that people have there favourites and they like to point out the benefits of one or the other, it give people a chance to make an informed decision, a ration discussion never hurt anyone, it just seems that some people like to change there point dependant on what the question is, just to make it into an argument and then start slagging off the opp or anyone who disagree's for no reason.

 

Over the years I have followed AVSIM and have been simming for many years, when 2D cockpits where made out of lines and an outside view was a grid. AVSIM used to be a place for discussion and sharing, a place where you used to get help for problems and information on new products. Now it seems a place where people want to stir up arguments, many times without problems being solved and questions being answered. It's getting more like the comments on Youtube every day, on there people put up videos to help and get stupid comments saying how they did something slightly incorrect. The fact that you have to sign in makes no difference and adding a "dumb" button makes it worse. Maybe it is because FSX is easier to run now, when it would not run right and everybody had problems it was like a bond. Maybe it is because high quality aircraft like the NGX has brought FSX back into the mainstream and brought with it a new type of simmer, who has never been through the rough times and expects everything on a plate.

 

I think it may be time to do like many others have done and find another forum, where people respect the hobby that we all share and have mutual respect for other members.

O.K. now I better understand where your coming from. In your original post I was shaking my head as to what days in the past were actually 'Good' in terms of where your going here. Things got bad with the release of FSX and came to a fever pitch right before a troll got so ticked he brought Avsim down. After the hack people returned to some sort of civility but it has never been the same as it was prior to FSX. As others have said Avsim is actually better than allot of places you go on the net. Have you read through some of the CNN comments posted under their articles? It's shocking what people will say about others out there. Another thing to be mindful of this is just the way society is. If it wasn't for laws we'd all be in trouble. Under the vale of anonymity people flat out don't care what they say to others because they know no one will find out who they really are. I look at it as a world wide problem.

 

In the confines of our community many of us are guilty with pushing the envelop. I did myself with my anger at the state FSX was in upon release. To this day because of my resistance to tweaking and constant hardware upgrades that don't quite hit the mark I stayed with FS9. Missing all the great new work because I didn't have time to fool with FSX. With kids homework, buying/selling houses, and contracting in a fickle job market FS9 ran perfectly when I had the time. I didn't have time to figure out why on approach to KJFK or long flights I constantly get an OOM errors. X-Plane, FS9, Aerofly FS, and even Flight just worked without issue every time. We've had some serious back and forth around here with who's sim is better. At the root of it we all want the hobby to move along and as long as a segment is sitting on something old cuts back on what truly can be done with the new platform because developers are trying to please two parties. Are these passionate people trolls because of an overall divided house for legitimate reasons? I think not. Are people going to take sides based on allegiance, yes (it happens throughout our society, look at politics). You see it all the time. For my own reasons I feel P3D v2 is a more trouble free option to FSX. Others feel PMDG is the best developer we have. The days when we were on one platform were the 'Good Ole Days' if you ask me. You had 10 to 15 new add-ons coming out a month at times. Surely a month didn't go by without some cool new high quality add-on showing up. That for me was an era that I hope returns. Our hobby was built on people freely giving for the love of the hobby. Freeware was what it was all about. With the advent of FSX that effort became much harder. Hopefully as we move forward the techniques now are more refined where we can get back to hobbyist creating for the love of it and not profit driven. These hobbyist turn into high end developers and end up working for companies like PMDG and Aerosoft. Don't get me wrong payware has it's place and has really pushed us to a level companies like Lockheed Martin have taken notice but to return to an era that you speak about we all need to be on one page again with discussions less about how to make the sim work or tweaks versus the love of aviation and talking about that cool new airplane or tool someone released. Once we get back to what's important and what brought us here in the first place will the tone of discourse settle down like it was before.

 

 

Well, the new ratings system is making things worse. Don't know who had the bright idea, but hopefully they will just please scrap the damn thing. The old system was anonymous, this one isn't. Now if you rate someone in a certain way and it's not approved of by someone else, it becomes a personal manhunt. No sir, didn't like it... No rating system would be better than this. The old one wasn't broken IMHO.

 

I actually like this system. Anonymity allows people to hide. Your support is right there for all to see which is how it should be. This is a feature I hope stays.

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I actually think the websites like to see the trolls because they result in lots of argument, more views, more click, more ad revenue.  Now having said that I think Avsim is generally pretty good and has a relatively small number of trolls vs. many other sites.

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I actually think the websites like to see the trolls because they result in lots of argument, more views, more click, more ad revenue.

 

Kind of like 'Reality TV' which I hope dies a quick death...

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Nothing to do with a particular post and as to Kyle, I don't get wound up in arguments, it was just a general observation. I have seen it on a few sections of the forums and lots of post by lots of people. It seems like somebody posts a question and gets slated. I must admit that it does seem that the PMDG forum is a bit worse. There are a lot of PMDG fans that jump to the defence of PMDG no matter what, somebody enquired as to an update on and update and next thing you know it about 5 pages long with people putting him down, heaven forbid he asked a question.

 

I do understand that people have there favourites and they like to point out the benefits of one or the other, it give people a chance to make an informed decision, a ration discussion never hurt anyone, it just seems that some people like to change there point dependant on what the question is, just to make it into an argument and then start slagging off the opp or anyone who disagree's for no reason.

 

Over the years I have followed AVSIM and have been simming for many years, when 2D cockpits where made out of lines and an outside view was a grid. AVSIM used to be a place for discussion and sharing, a place where you used to get help for problems and information on new products. Now it seems a place where people want to stir up arguments, many times without problems being solved and questions being answered. It's getting more like the comments on Youtube every day, on there people put up videos to help and get stupid comments saying how they did something slightly incorrect. The fact that you have to sign in makes no difference and adding a "dumb" button makes it worse. Maybe it is because FSX is easier to run now, when it would not run right and everybody had problems it was like a bond. Maybe it is because high quality aircraft like the NGX has brought FSX back into the mainstream and brought with it a new type of simmer, who has never been through the rough times and expects everything on a plate.

 

I think it may be time to do like many others have done and find another forum, where people respect the hobby that we all share and have mutual respect for other members.

 

 

I do partially agree with you on the "everything on a plate" argument. Though I think the change in community attitude is pointed more towards the overall growth of the community. When a community is small, there are many like-minded folks. A bigger,growing community has people from many different backgrounds,Points of view, personalities,  and thus conflict is seen everyday.

 

I will say that while I do respect Kyle for his contribution to aviation knowledge, he may come off with an ego, and inadvertently rebuke some new folks. I'm not going to lie about that. Like I said, we have many personalities here.

 

This forum has a severe case of multiple-personality disorder! Not in a bad way of course.

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