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Kuragiman

Made The Switch But...

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So I abandoned FSX because I got tired of having to wrestle with it EVERY SINGLE FLIGHT.  With the ability to transfer my addons over with the migration tool I made the leap and I was happy for the most part.  I am currently just trying to find the sweet spot.   In some locations I get 30+ FPS with most everything maxed and World of AI traffic armed with 40% and 10% car traffic.    In other locations not so much.   This is a screen cap sitting at KDFW in Dallas (FSDreamTeam version) with performance graphics overlaid.

 

Can someone explain to me WHY for the love of all that is Holy I am getting 18 FPS when the GPU and CPU are twiddling their thumbs according to the performance graphs?   According to the graphs I have so much overhead left over I should be running @ 40 FPS with even more stuff turned on!   @_@    FSX did this too me as well only WORSE.  There is no excuse for this miserable performance (well I am sure there is an excuse somewhere).  I have watched videos from Froogle and others on YouTube and their Prepar3D is running like a bat out of hell with a lot of the sliders maxed, INCLUDING shadows.   Any insight into what is making my system go on strike would be appreciated.

 

Specs:

 

i7 3930k 6 core @ 3.8ghz HT On (12 cores total)

Asus GTX 770 OC II with 2 gigs of DDR5

32gigs G.Skill 1866mhz RAM 9-9-9-24

ASUS X79 Sabertooth OC Motherboard

10k RPM Velociraptor is my simulation drive

Win 7 Pro 64-bit

Corsair Liquid Cooler

 

P3d-Sim.JPG

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Can someone explain to me WHY for the love of all that is Holy I am getting 18 FPS when the GPU and CPU are twiddling their thumbs according to the performance graphs?

 

The reason is you need to add the affinity mask line at the top of your p3d.cfg file for your cpu as I have 4 core 3770k I cant tell you what it should be but do a search and there will be an answer for you - thats it no other changes to you cfg file and you made a wise decision 

Edited by n4gix
Delete EXCESSIVE quote!

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Both FSX and P3D rely on one CPU core to do the heavy lifting.

 

The other cores do useful work, like texture loading, but they do not produce the main rendering picture.

 

On your performance graph, you can see one core maxed out.. that is the way it works..

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I am actually running the Affinity Mask with 12 cores running.    Core 0, 1 and 3 have been forced off but the others are in use now.   This spread the load slightly but didn't get me more than 1-2 FPS.    However....  I just found a tweak that did in fact help me gain 10 FPS back and it's something I would have never expected.   I stumbled upon it while pulling my hair out.  Someone actually DOWNCLOCKED their video card and got a massive boost.   I tried it out of despartion and I'll be damn if my FPS at KDFW didn't go from 25 FPS to 35 FPS.    I guess the Factory default overclock works wonders for modern games but is damaging to FSX/P3D's performance.

 

That being said, wouldn't it be great if we lived in a computer world where our favorite SIMS would actually use more than one core to it's fullest potential?   Ahhhhhh.. perhaps one day in the future.   Also, 64 bit would be nice.   I have 32gigs of RAM just sitting in here doing nothing when it comes to FSX/P3D.  XD

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On your performance graph It looks to me like LP2 is being reduced in efficiency by work on LP3. You want to see next to nothing happening on LP3 if the main work is on LP2. It's possible the affinity has changed and the downclock did nothing. Instead I would arrange an AM to select LPs from alternate cores and retest.

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On your performance graph It looks to me like LP2 is being reduced in efficiency by work on LP3. You want to see next to nothing happening on LP3 if the main work is on LP2. It's possible the affinity has changed and the downclock did nothing. Instead I would arrange an AM to select LPs from alternate cores and retest.

 

Exactly Steve there is an excellent thread here on how to do it - just not sure of link as its 3:30 am - yikes

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...as its 3:30 am - yikes

 

Hey Rich, I find it's the best time of day :BigGrin: Keep well, speak later bro.

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Hey Rich, I find it's the best time of day :BigGrin: Keep well, speak later bro.

 

Been hanging around you to long lol kidding take care my friend - lets get some Idealflight going in P3D  :)

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Thnx for the mention Rich, yes would be good. Speak later.

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LP2, LP3?    Is that short for Logical Core 2 and Logical Core 3?

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Yes LP0 being the first. Generally referred to as 'logical processor', whereby cores can have a number of LPs, a CPU a number of cores.

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Right.  So I have 6 Physical and 6 Logical cores.    Okay.... bedtime.   I am so close to perfecting this build for the smoothest simulation possible... then... I am going to add my preferred air liner.. and watch it all unravel... XD  lol.     Here's hoping iFly 737NG won't break the camel's back.   This is why I am trying so hard to get all the frames I can NOW before I add a complex aircraft that I know is going to eat 5-15 FPS.

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I installed p3d thinking I'd get better perf than FSX - and I get worse even at default settings.

 

I assumed since it used more GPU I'd be better off...

 

I wish there was a guide on what settings to use for "slower" systems.

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I think this is better.   Someone mentioned that P3D is hard to benchmark because it does not give consistent reporting and I found that.    I got 40FPS on one test and was like YES!   But I had to go and play around with the AM again and I can't get that 40 FPS to pop again under identical conditions.  I don't know what magic spot I found but I screwed it up and haven't been able to get 40 FPS back on the counter in over an hour of screwing around with just the AM and my hardware settings.    I have spread out the load quite a bit better now I think but there is a TON of overhead still.   Why won't P3D use the rest of my system resources?   ARGH!   Can my mainboard RAM be choking stuff if it's too slow?   My RAM is rated at 1866mhz but the system has it underclocked at 1333mhz... Is it because there is so much of it?    Is it possible that I have TOO much RAM and its forcing me to slow down the timing and MHZ on it to make the system stable with 32gigs?  What happens if I pull out 16gigs of RAM?  Would that potential help or hinder?

 

(This is my FPS sitting at FSDreamTeam's KDFW with ASNEXT weather running. ))

 

P3D-Sim2.JPG

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(This is my FPS sitting at FSDreamTeam's KDFW with ASNEXT weather running. ))

 

Here you go read carefully - this will solve your am choice - worked great for me - dont pull ram has nothing to do with it by the way I use NI so I would pay attention to how to get the ideal AM

 

http://forum.avsim.net/topic/444793-one-tweak-to-rule-them-all-how-to-set-affinity-mask-correctly/

Edited by n4gix
Removed excessive quote, again!

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I actually came across that article and followed its instructions but got little extra power.  The only thing thus far that seems to have worked is downclocking my video card.    I got 45 FPS in the test I just did for about 5 seconds and then...  ASNEXT decided it was time to make thunderstorm over DFW and the FPS went down to 25.   XD    lol.    So I guess this is the best my setup can do.   Which means... no flying a 737NG through bad weather at detailed airports....  T_T

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no flying a 737NG through bad weather at detailed airports....

 

Being relatively new to P3D still means you have not probably realised that lower frames need not affect smoothness in the sim.  Indeed many here comment that P3D is vastly superior in this regard compared to FSX at similar frames.  Best to suck-it-and-see and turn off the frame rate display.  :lol:

 

Most people are seeing up to 30fps  (with sliders appropriately adjusted) on even modest equipment and with shadows enabled.

 

Remember less is often more in P3D ... the reverse of FSX.  Have fun, just fly ... in your iFly.

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Right.  So I have 6 Physical and 6 Logical cores...

 

Nope, you have 1CPU with 6 cores that make up 12 logical processors.

 

But it seems my comment about the graphs has fell to deaf ears. You need to look at the graphs, you can see that LP2 and LP3 are the same physical core. It's simple, with one LP of the pair maxed you want to see next to no work on the other. That's usually the reason for poor performance in weather. So you arrange an Affinity Mask to keep them separated onto physical cores when you have HT enabled.

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Being relatively new to P3D still means you have not probably realised that lower frames need not affect smoothness in the sim.  Indeed many here comment that P3D is vastly superior in this regard compared to FSX at similar frames.  Best to suck-it-and-see and turn off the frame rate display.  :lol:

 

Most people are seeing up to 30fps  (with sliders appropriately adjusted) on even modest equipment and with shadows enabled.

 

Remember less is often more in P3D ... the reverse of FSX.  Have fun, just fly ... in your iFly.

 

 

Yes it is 'SMOOTH' but if it's a Smooth Slideshow I just can't get into the simulation.   The suspension of reality gets broken and I get disappointed.   With the hardware I have I should be able to taxi down to the runway and have it be smooth.   Lesser machines don't seem to have a problem but the Beast does.   I don't know if I have something wrong in my bios, wrong in my OS or if a piece of hardware is just broken.    I pushed the game around the different cores until it LOOKS balanced with no more than a 50% load on any one core at a time and my video card shows a hit no greater than 55% on it's GPU... so if the cores are showing 50% used and the Video card is showing 50% used... WHY isn't P3D using MORE and giving me better than 19 FPS when I am sitting idle at the gate at KDFW-FSDT?   This is what is driving me nuts.  Looking at all the graphs says to me 'THIS COMPUTER CAN DO MORE!'  But P3D is not TRYING to use more... it's just stuck at 50% utilization and I can find no explanation or tip/trick to make it go beyond.

 

SteveW, I did push the AM around using a utility called Progress Lasso.  I watched the Usage graph change right before my eyes from SPIKED/THRASHING cores to evened out multiple cores as shown in my new screen shot but the effect was small on the FPS.   

 

I need to know what piece of hardware... or what background program may be choking this simulation... They ALL DO IT.    X-Plane, FSX, P3D... They all CHOKE and its maddening because I watch videos and people list their specs and my specs crush theirs but they are running smooth and I am clunking along, SMOOTH, but SLOW FPS.   Everyone says ignore the FPS.   You can't ignore it when it drops below 20.   I start to see that frame lagging and it makes me want to punch cute fuzzy kittens in half and I love kittens.  T_T

 

I spent the entire damn weekend parked at gate A11 at KDFW just trying to get good frames.   I got up to 40 FPS sitting in a Cessna Caravan and I thought THAT'S IT!  I got it!   I'll buy iFly now... Load it in.  Load up my scenario.. 19 FPS...   I was like...   no way! There is no way ONE plane is sucking out 21 FPS.   So whatever setup I had is not a good setup for iFly.

 

Why can't my sim run like Froogle's?  T_T     Going to fight it again when I get home.       

 

Seriously though... shouldn't an i7 3930k 6 core with a GTX 770 OC II be able to push this sim good with high settings?

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I did push the AM around using a utility called Progress Lasso.  I watched the Usage graph change right before my eyes from SPIKED/THRASHING cores to evened out multiple cores as shown in my new screen shot but the effect was small on the FPS.

 

In your first screenshot it is clear that the LPs are utilised incorrectly, but in the second I still can't see that your simulator is running correctly. What AM are you using?

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In your first screenshot it is clear that the LPs are utilised incorrectly, but in the second I still can't see that your simulator is running correctly. What AM are you using?

 

I wish I was home right now.   I've been keeping each one I tried in the CFG file, commented out, as I try them.  Off the top of my head I can remember using;   14, 15, 4080, 4086 and the one I currently have is 1364.

 

I told PrePar3D to only using PHYSICAL cores in one run but that wasn't with the AM.  I did it through Process Lasso which has a feature to set the AM directly just like the Task Manager can.  I told it to only use the physical cores.     

 

So if I get it right are you saying that every single graph should be used and all relatively the same percentage of utilization?   I'll let you know more when I get home in a few hours. 

 

I really appreciate the attempt to help.   I watched more videos at lunch today and just sighed.   One guy stated that his specs in the video were  i7 2500k with GTX 580.   His frames never dropped past 30 while recording in a complex 146 aircraft.   He had the Out-Of-Box settings which look pretty darn good.   I would be happy with that but I know my system can push it.    I watched another guy wtih an i7 3770k and GTX 780 pushing max everything and he was doing pretty good for the most part, even over dense cityscapes.    

 

I saw something in regards to FSX that sounded interesting.   It suggested installing the simulator BEFORE overclocking the system and then once its installed then you start pushing your OC up and up until you are stable and fast.   I assume that is because the CFG gets made basd on your current system specs?    So in theroy, if you set it at your default speeds and then ram up afterward it would boost your performance.   I don't know.   All I know is there a ton of video evidence that my system isn't working right for this simulator and others have gotten theirs to work awesome with lesser hardware. 

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So if I get it right are you saying that every single graph should be used and all relatively the same percentage of utilization?

 

One will be maxed out, the others will be medium. Try an AM of 2720 (101010100000) which utilises the last 4 cores.

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One will be maxed out, the others will be medium. Try an AM of 2720 (101010100000) which utilises the last 4 cores.

 

Will do when I get home.   I am also going to delete the CFG file and let it rebuild since I did change settings in BIOS..  I notcied my RAM was only running @ 1333mhz when it is rated for 1866mhz.   I fixed that and downclocked from 4.6 ghz to 3.8 ghz just to see if I was hammering the system.   I'll let you know the results.  Thanks.

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OK!. Remember that the proper AM can only prevent the sim loading threads unnecessarily onto the same core, to prevent performance degradation, rather than improve performance.

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Okay.  I killed off the CFG file and let it reload and did the AM mask and WOW.    Sitting at Langley with default settings is yielding 55-65 FPS.      When I load the iFly 737NG it plummets to 25FPS.  T_T    That plane CANNOT be costing THAT much processing time?        I loaded up my DFW scenario with the Caravan Cessna parked at gate A11 with the payware FSDT and it's doing 45-50 FPS where it was doing 22.   :)     So that is a huge improvment.    Now... if ONLY it would do that.. while I am in the 737 I would be done and able to fly.   Attached are two screencaps showing the FPS.   My GTX 770 OC II in BOTH scenarios wasn't using more that 50% of the GPU.   <----   THIS.   This needs to be used more.   P3D is suppose to be more GPU intensive than FSX which relied heavily on CPU power.    And you can see at the bottom the CPU isn't even being used as hard.. 14% max.

 

P3D-Sim3.JPG

 

P3D-Sim3-737.JPG

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