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shamrockflyer

P3D V2.4 CTD

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Over the past week I have been getting random crashes with P3D V2.4. I just had my first flight with the PMDG 777 crash on me after 5 hours, I know it wasn't an OOM as there was no message pointing towards the possibility of an OOM. I have installed WOAI, but I would like to know the actual cause and how to fix it. 

 

Regards, Ciaran 

 

Log Name:      Application
Source:        Application Error
Date:          08/02/2015 17:56:56
Event ID:      1000
Task Category: (100)
Level:         Error
Keywords:      Classic
User:          N/A
Computer:      ****
Description:
Faulting application name: Prepar3D.exe, version: 2.4.11570.0, time stamp: 0x542314d3
Faulting module name: ntdll.dll, version: 6.3.9600.17278, time stamp: 0x53eeb4a3
Exception code: 0xc0000374
Fault offset: 0x000debd8
Faulting process ID: 0x2ab4
Faulting application start time: 0x01d04390805f97c8
Faulting application path: C:\Program Files (x86)\Lockheed Martin\Prepar3D v2\Prepar3D.exe
Faulting module path: C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\ntdll.dll
Report ID: de7e4147-afbb-11e4-82c1-d43d7ef8b254
Faulting package full name: 
Faulting package-relative application ID: 
Event Xml:
  <System>
    <Provider Name="Application Error" />
    <EventID Qualifiers="0">1000</EventID>
    <Level>2</Level>
    <Task>100</Task>
    <Keywords>0x80000000000000</Keywords>
    <TimeCreated SystemTime="2015-02-08T17:56:56.000000000Z" />
    <EventRecordID>20611</EventRecordID>
    <Channel>Application</Channel>
    <Computer>GeekInCloset</Computer>
    <Security />
  </System>
  <EventData>
    <Data>Prepar3D.exe</Data>
    <Data>2.4.11570.0</Data>
    <Data>542314d3</Data>
    <Data>ntdll.dll</Data>
    <Data>6.3.9600.17278</Data>
    <Data>53eeb4a3</Data>
    <Data>c0000374</Data>
    <Data>000debd8</Data>
    <Data>2ab4</Data>
    <Data>01d04390805f97c8</Data>
    <Data>C:\Program Files (x86)\Lockheed Martin\Prepar3D v2\Prepar3D.exe</Data>
    <Data>C:\Windows\SYSTEM32\ntdll.dll</Data>
    <Data>de7e4147-afbb-11e4-82c1-d43d7ef8b254</Data>
    <Data>
    </Data>
    <Data>
    </Data>
  </EventData>
</Event>
 

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Most ntdll.dll errors are caused by a bad overclock, a voltage too high or too low.  The AVSIM CTD Guide provides some probable solutions when the ntdll.dll is shown as the faulting module.  One known cause is MyTrafficX v5.4c.  All explained in the CTD Guide.

 

The exception code 0374 also indicates a heap corruption.  Page 7 of the CTD Guide provides guidance on fixing heap limitations and corruptions.

 

Best regards,

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Well I know its not a bad overclock as I have done extensive testing and stability testing on my overclock and didn't have any problems. It could be an OOM as I was about 5/6 hours in the flight. 

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Respectfully, do not be confident your overclock is now stable.  The ntdll.dll is just one indication of an unstable overclock but, in your case, I think it is the heap limitations.  I had a great overclock once too and ran several stability tests and they all passed with flying colors.  Then I started up FSX....

 

Long flights can result in OOM's depending on your settings; however, you will not get an ntdll.dll error but an api.dll error or maybe a Stackhash.  Most OOM's will also show you the error message "You have run out of memory and FSX will now shutdown" (or something like that).  It's not memory you ran out of but Virtual Address Space (VAS).  Windows should have come up with a better error message like, "you have run out of virtual address space".  When our apps, like P3D get converted to 64 bit apps, we'll be limited to a default of 8 terabyes of VAS.  Best to monitor your VAS with the FSUIPC utility.  Setup guidance is in the AVSIM CTD Guide.

 

Best regards,

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Just completed CYYZ-EGGC in the P3D PMDGT7-300ER. No VAS issue, not a single CTD. Default airports, night flight. Smooth flying with Fs2Crew all the way.

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I got the same CTD on final in Dubai after a 6 hr flight with the PMDG777. I also overclock but I am definitely stable. It was in sync with a camera switch...

 

I've gotten a CTD maybe twice my whole time flying 2.4. I guess only more flights for me will tell if it is in-fact something with the 777 in 2.4 or my system.

 

Back to the cockpit for me. I will report if it happens again.  :rolleyes: 

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You might want to think about downloading the freeware in the AVSIM Library, a program called Quantumleap.  It allows you to "leap" from point A to Point R then you take over and land at Point Z.  Something like that.  At least it would eliminate these 6 hour flights that cause a lot of problems.  Personally I cannot see how anyone can sit in front of their computer for 6 hours using FS but a lot of people are doing it!  About 2 hours is my max!  I like the fact you are investigating the cause(s).

 

Best regards,

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8 terabyes of VAS

 

Man, oh man. What would we even do with 8 terabytes of VAS??

 

I would have loved to be at the ACES (or earlier, for that matter) where someone said, "nah, 32-bit should be fine for the foreseeable future."

 

Argh.

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Could it be caused by driver issues Jim? I updated my drivers, and I have since reinstalled P3D as I was experiencing other issues. I have played games such as Watch Dogs, Assassins Creed Unity and Elite Dangerous for well over 6 hours and never had a single crash or ntdll.dll error - this is all on the same computer. 

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You might want to think about downloading the freeware in the AVSIM Library, a program called Quantumleap

Thanks for that, Jim. I just use 4x compression at the moment, but will give this a go. Sounds ideal.

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Could it be caused by driver issues Jim? I updated my drivers, and I have since reinstalled P3D as I was experiencing other issues. I

 

It definitely could be your Intel Chipset drivers too or some other hardware driver.  FSX is totally different than other games as the engine cannot be modified and the software was developed for Vista and less powerful computer systems.  Some of the latest games are taking advantage of the CPU and GPU and that's why they perform much better. 

 

In the AVSIM CTD Guide we included a suggestion to keep your drivers up-to-date and suggested downloading a driver updater.  They are usually free to scan your system but the software wants you to buy a license if you want the program to update the software for you.  You can also Google the drivers the software found out-of-date and download and install the updates yourself.  Right now one company (Iobit) has a Driver Booster program that is freeware but the downloads for the updates are usually slower than if the product was activated.  I just completed a total reinstall of Windows 7 and Microsoft seems be be getting better finding updated drivers for your SATA Controllers, USB ports and I had not seen that in the past.  I did see they find and install a basic SATA controller and it is best you get the controller used by your MB manufacturer.

 

Best regards,

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Well I did a driver scan of my computer the day I had the ntdll.dll error, the scan found Intel Chipset drivers so I installed those, I have now been doing a stress test on my CPU with Prime95, I am over 1 hour 40 minutes in without any problems, I guess after 1 hour we can call it stable, but I am going for the full 3-4 hours just to be safe, some run P95 for over 24 hours, but I honestly don't have the time or think its really that much different to running it for 3-4 hours. 

 

I hope when P3D goes 64 bit all these problems will be a thing of the past, and your work load will be a lot lighter than it is now Jim. I appreciate your help. 

 

Regards, Ciaran

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I guess after 1 hour we can call it stable, but I am going for the full 3-4 hours just to be safe, some run P95 for over 24 hours, but I honestly don't have the time or think its really that much different to running it for 3-4 hours.

 

I think that is long enough for sure.  I really didn't mean for you to do stability testing all over again.  That's a pain.  I was just trying to state that stability testing is not necessarily an indicator that your system will be stable when FSX is running.  Maybe it's because FSX might make your CPU run hotter trying to render all of those textures at high settings and maybe with a bad tweak in the FSX.cfg. 

 

I have the 4770K CPU and have found it impossible to overclock as high as you have.  It is very not common to find a 4770K CPU that has the capability to overclock as high as you have.  Here's a link to what I found - http://techreport.com/review/24889/haswell-overclocked-the-core-i7-4770k-at-4-7ghz .  From this link the following is important:

 

"Of the processors Asus has tested, 70% hit 4.5GHz, 30% reached 4.6GHz, and 20% made 4.7GHz. Only 10% were stable at 4.8GHz. Heat is reportedly the limiting factor, and Asus recommends using a dual-fan water cooler to prevent thermal throttling past about 4.5GHz or 1.25V. Going beyond 1.35V is apparently problematic even for high-end water coolers."

 

Evidently there are good 4770K CPU's and a lot more bad CPU's. It's the luck of the draw to find a 4770K CPU that will overclock above 4.7GHz. I had mine overclocked as high as 4.4GHz but periodically got the ntdll.dll error so lowered to 4.2GHz. It was much more stable at 4.2GHz. Recently though I got more ntdll.dll crashes (I don't mess with voltages... they are set to Auto as suggested by ASUS). I don't have the time to be messing with overclocks and voltages. To me it's not that important as FSX runs just as great in TurboMode and at 3.9GHz. So, until I can find some time to mess with it, I'm leaving it in Turbo Mode and the BIOS settings are set to Optimized Defaults. If you get an ntdll.dll error (or BSOD) with Optimized Defaults, then there is something else seriously wrong. Perhaps a cooling problem (I have the Noctra D14 cooler on my CPU; lots of fans too).

 

Not sure if you have an ASUS MB but here's a quick tutorial to set your overclock to 4.6GHz to test stability of your 4770K CPU -

. If it passes the test, you have a very good CPU. If not, your system will not boot up and you will have to go back into the BIOS and go to Optimized Defaults or your previous settings.

 

What you could do is go to each page of your BIOS and save an image of your settings to a memory stick. Then go to Optimized Defaults and see if this fixes your ntdll.dll crashes. Most likely it will but I understand the pain and suffering associated with overclocking.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Best regards,

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I got a crash to CTD last week while flying KSAN to KJFK, in the PMDG 737NGX . It happened about 4 hours into the flight. My Intel 4820K is overclocked rto 4.8ghz; i have 16gigs of ram and a gtx780.

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Not sure if you have an ASUS MB but here's a quick tutorial to set your overclock to 4.6GHz to test stability of your 4770K CPU -

A great big Thank You, Jim, for that embedded video. Just what I was looking for.

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