[05MAR15] PMDG 737NGX Versions for FSX/FSX-SE & P3D Released

[scandinavian13 5,192]

Wel I don't doubt that it *may* be, but it did not necessarily have to be this way if more thought was put into it from the start, like having the disc product be the same, or allowing the registration code you receive to be used on the site to register activate the product, or even on a case by case basis. I'm pretty sure not *everybody* cares to have the SE, isn't there a way you could just provide a new serial/activation and void the old one if necessary? (If your concern is people having 2 copies, which I see a little hint of).

 

Anywho, ate least a heads up would have been nice on the different vendor sites that the product is not 100% the same (even if limited to installer or whatever). I just bout it like a week ago, and would not have if I knew of these issues (I actually haven't even received it, a friend is bringing it me, so excuse me if some of the terms or concepts I used are just gibberish,,,).

 

I'm not sure why someone would need a head up on the fact that it's going to be difficult to update people who bought physical copies. Perhaps that's just a side effect of having grown up in the time before internet-based updates where you had to physically mail in a form to have a CD shipped to you sometime in the following months. Then again, this is also why I embraced downloaded products and just create a backup disc on my own at home - no waiting, and I can go directly to the developer instead of some other shop to have the CD/DVD made and put in a pretty box. Either way, the people who you'd need to take the notification issue up with is whoever sold you the CD/DVD copy.

 

As far as your registration comments go, none of your "solutions" would be sustainable. In fact, with the one "solution" of doing things on a case by case basis, it would probably delay things longer for everyone because of the amount of manual labor required.

 

I get that waiting isn't fun. I've been there. As mentioned, just have a little patience. We told everyone in various posts in the weeks leading up to this update that those with the CD/DVD version would receive a delay in getting an update. FSX:SE surprised the whole entire community, so it's not like we had a lot of time to get an update plan in place with other distributors. You all may think you're pretty clever with computers and how businesses work. I used to think that, too, but until you become intimately familiar with how customer management and business works (and not just business in general, but partner agreements), I politely ask that you leave the business decisions and the associated issues to us. If there were an easier or quicker way, we likely would've released an update to you already utilizing that method.

[walterg74 0]

I'm not sure why someone would need a head up on the fact that it's going to be difficult to update people who bought physical copies.

Uhmm.. Because it *shouldn't* be? I don't see your logic behind why it should be difficult or different to ugrade the same product just because one is downloaded and the other is burned on a disc. That makes 0 sense... But I'm willing to best my last dollar that the reason they aren't the same if due to piracy concerns, and therefore a bad judgement call was made on a bad technical implementation due to business fears.

 

You all may think you're pretty clever with computers and how businesses work. I used to think that, too, but until you become intimately familiar with how customer management and business works (and not just business in general, but partner agreements), I politely ask that you leave the business decisions and the associated issues to us. If there were an easier or quicker way, we likely would've released an update to you already utilizing that method.

Nope, we don't think that at all, just trying to provide ideas to solve this, which by the way is not a business decision, it's a techincal one. But that's ok, I see ideas are not welcome, and already figured out by your reponses that all you care about is being right (or at least thinking you are), so there will be no more discussion on my part about this. There is no point in continuing the discussion.

 

Cheers.

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

Nope, we don't think that at all, just trying to provide ideas to solve this, which by the way is not a business decision, it's a techincal one.

 

Technical decisions are subject to funding by...? Business decisions.

 

Additionally, when it comes to sharing data between partner systems (a technical task), this is also subject to business decisions.

 

 

 

But that's ok, I see ideas are not welcome, and already figured out by your reponses that all you care about is being right (or at least thinking you are), so there will be no more discussion on my part about this. There is no point in continuing the discussion.

 

It's not that ideas are not welcome. It's that people are continuing to get upset as if we're intentionally trying to drag this out. Believe me: if we had a way of putting this behind us, it would have been done already.

 

As far as your own personal shots at me, if you'd been paying attention, I've more than once (in the past week, mind you) retracted a statement for being incorrect. It's not about being right. It's about looking at the big picture and seeing what needs to be done. If you can't see the big picture, all you can do is trust the person who has it.

[walterg74 0]

In that your are correct, I don't have it. (Heck I don't even have the product yet, I hope to have it this afternoon! ).

 

But still, even if it may not be convenient for you (I do not know your user base size, and from those how many have the 737, and of those how many actually got the disc version, and of those how many care about the SE, I'm guessing the number gets smaller and smaller as we progress those concepts ) but business doesn't have to "fund" anything. In a key substitution for example, you're not giving anything away...

 

Anyway, just bring it

 

Out of curiosity, since I'm new here... What is your role at PMDG besides dealing with us impatient people?

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

business doesn't have to "fund" anything. In a key substitution for example, you're not giving anything away...

 

Might want to think that one over again.

 

I might not be giving a key away, but I'd be giving someone's time away. Someone's time costs money, which would need to be funded somehow.

 

 

 

Out of curiosity, since I'm new here... What is your role at PMDG besides dealing with us impatient people?

 

I answer support tickets, moderate the forum (and the Facebook page), and work on secret projects.  :ph34r:

[walterg74 0]

Ok, sure I'll rethink it: how much time does it take to re-issue a keyvs all thetime wasted answering support tickets, forum posts and facebook comments..?

[scandinavian13 5,192]

Ok, sure I'll rethink it: how much time does it take to re-issue a keyvs all thetime wasted answering support tickets, forum posts and facebook comments..?

 

You're really not going to win this argument because you haven't done any of these things for us. Seriously. You're wading into waters you don't have the slightest clue about while trying to allude the guy who knows intimately about the process doesn't. Perhaps you should walk up to the front of the plane next time and tell the pilot how he should fly the plane the next time you fly commercially.  :wink:

 

Furthermore, the idea that answering support tickets and forum posts is "wasted" time kinda loops back around to infer that I'm wasting my time here considering your original point. Plus, the idea that I'm wasting my time supporting customers in general is pretty laughable, honestly. I don't think anyone would actually make that assertion...particularly when they're the one asking for support.

 

I see why you'd want nothing more to make me suddenly wake up and see the light of this false idea of reality you have regarding the license issuance - it would solve all of your problems - but it's not based in the realistic limitations surrounding the issue. We've asked for patience. We need your patience.

[jmdriskell 178]

I just received the below response to a ticket that I opened with PMDG concerning my problems trying to find the "vaulted 737 NGX SP1D".
 

As outlined in the Avsim Support forum and on our Facebook page,  the Steam Compatibility Update (SP1D) requires that the entire aircraft be replaced with a new installer.  You can download an updated installer file from your Account at PMDG under your Previous Orders tab. Simply select the product and download the new installer.  Once you have the new installer,  uninstall your current aircraft and then run the updated installer and you should be all set.  Let us know if you need further assistance.

 

My response to this was:

 

It should not be necessary to read instructions for a number of different places in order to find out what to do to download a "service pac".  The instructions should be included on your official company web site or in the messages in the PMDG Operations Center.  Thanks to someone else from the Avsim community, I did download the entire 737 package and I see in the readme that the most recent changed is included in the package.

Please think about this when you release upgrades or modifications in the future.

James M Driskell

 

PS - For Kyle Rodgers:  I do own the FSX version of the 737.  I bought the FS9 version many yeares ago.

 

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

PS - For Kyle Rodgers:  I do own the FSX version of the 737.  I bought the FS9 version many yeares ago.

 

Wasn't doubting you. All I saw in your account, though, was the FS9 version. It's entirely possible that the NGX is under a different email address for you. I was simply confirming you didn't think the FS9 version was supposed to get the update.

[jmdriskell 178]

Thanks,

 

James M Driskell

[walterg74 0]

You're really not going to win this argument because you haven't done any of these things for us. Seriously. You're wading into waters you don't have the slightest clue about while trying to allude the guy who knows intimately about the process doesn't. Perhaps you should walk up to the front of the plane next time and tell the pilot how he should fly the plane the next time you fly commercially.  :wink:

 

Furthermore, the idea that answering support tickets and forum posts is "wasted" time kinda loops back around to infer that I'm wasting my time here considering your original point. Plus, the idea that I'm wasting my time supporting customers in general is pretty laughable, honestly. I don't think anyone would actually make that assertion...particularly when they're the one asking for support.

 

I see why you'd want nothing more to make me suddenly wake up and see the light of this false idea of reality you have regarding the license issuance - it would solve all of your problems - but it's not based in the realistic limitations surrounding the issue. We've asked for patience. We need your patience.

I never said that supporting customers "in general" is wasting time.

 

Now when resolving issue "A" takes less time than keeping on answering mutiple questions, posts, emails, tickets, etc. about issue "A", clearly you're doing something wrong... (And that'sthe time I'm counting as wasted vs your comment of "someone must pay for the time to issue keys"). See the difference?

[PMDG777 231]

I never said that supporting customers "in general" is wasting time.

 

Now when resolving issue "A" takes less time than keeping on answering mutiple questions, posts, emails, tickets, etc. about issue "A", clearly you're doing something wrong... (And that'sthe time I'm counting as wasted vs your comment of "someone must pay for the time to issue keys"). See the difference?

And what about the time Kyle has wasted having to try and prove that he knows a hell of a lot more about how PMDG is run than you? Do you consider that as time wasted?

[walterg74 0]

And what about the time Kyle has wasted having to try and prove that he knows a hell of a lot more about how PMDG is run than you? Do you consider that as time wasted?

Of course I do, that's the entire point of the argument! He claims it's not viable to simply do a key substitution solution because "the time of the person doing that must be paid". Ok, so add up the time it take to do that, and compare it to the time spent answering questions, commenting posts, replying to e-mails, etc. to idiots like me, *for this issue alone*. Which is greater? Where are you wasting more time/money? If you can't see that my friend, then there is nothing more I can say that will help you do so...

 

Live long and prosper.

 

P.S. i doubt he has to "try" to prove he knows more about how PMDG is run. That was never in doubt and I'm 100% sure he knows how it's run vs me where my knowledge is 0. The point isn't how PMDG is run, rather than practical and efficient problem solution...

[scandinavian13 5,192]

 

 

rather than practical and efficient problem solution...

 

Except, as I've mentioned multiple times, your solution is not based in reality. It's not the most efficient method, no matter how many times you say it.

[walterg74 0]

Except, as I've mentioned multiple times, your solution is not based in reality. It's not the most efficient method, no matter how many times you say it.

 

Why is it not "based in reality"? What exactly do you mean by "reality"?

 

Bear with me for a minute here...

 

Part 1) If you wanted to, How long does it take for you to provide a customer with a new key? 5 minutes?

Part 2) can you void generated keys? If you can that's another five minutes. If you can't, then we have the real issue of not wanting people to have a second "free key".

 

Can you tell me honestly, with a hand to your heart, that any other possible solution would take less time than that?

 

Just trying to understand the logic here *while I wait*