Hi,For my packages I use an EXE installer (Clickteam) for one reason - my installation support issues are cut by over 75%. I've had too many people install a package to their root folder instead of the FS folder, etc. The mess I had to clean up (via email!)...I'm careful not to have it touch the registry or any cfg files, or create any uninstalls, icons, or menu entries. If you take the time to make sure the install is "minimal", then it's basically an automated unzipper.It also has the ... button to install to a folder of your choice, if desired.Hope this helps,--Tom GibsonCal Classic Propliner Page: http://www.calclassic.comFreeflight Design Shop: http://www.freeflightdesign.comDrop by! ___x_x_(")_x_x___

You can create an installer does gives an exe setup + separated files. Is up to the user to choose what type of installing he wants.You can avoid registry use by using ini files.Jose

I believe that happens if you use the msi installer if you use the exe there is also the bootstrapping codeJose

One tip--you can cleanup your uninstall entries in Control Panel by removing the uninstall entry in the registry for the offending program. Uninstall entries are found here:HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINESOFTWAREMicrosoftWindowsCurrentVersionUninstall-John

>The same problem irritates me as well and I use an old>utility called INCTRL 3 which was written for Windows 95 by>Neil J. Rubenking of PC Magazine. It was freeware then. (In>fact I recall laboriously typing in the code from the pages of>the mag - that gives you some idea of how ancient a fossil I>am :-) ) Believe it or not it works perfectly with Windows XP>and Windows x64.>What it does is this:>You run INCTRL and specify the install program that you wish>to monitor.>INCTRL then takes a "snapshot" of all drives that you specify>as well as the registry and any .INI files you care to>specify.>The install program runs and installs whatever it is supposed>to. When the entire process is finished, INCTRL asks you to>confirm that the entire installation procedure is completed. >Then it takes another "snapshot" and compares the diffences>and writes out a txt file listing every new file, every>changed file and every added entry in the registry. You can>save this txt file for future reference. >Now you have CONTROL and can manually reverse anything that>the install program did. It's a wonderful little utility.>The program itself leaves no trace of itself - no registry>entry, nothing. It's absolutely clean and leaves no mess>behind!>I went looking for a link to post here for downloading, but>for some reason, ZDNET don't seem to have it on their site.>However, I'm sure you can google it somewhere.>>Greetings>Dave Britzius>(Cape Town)Here's a link: http://www.leeos.com/software_0.html---------------------------------------http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v615/Dar...ows-naughty.gif

I also used to live in the 'hate setup.exe' camp, but now that I've producing my own scenery, I have to admit, I'm also distributing via setup.exes and I did have a change of heart a bit.Ideally, I wanted to live in both worlds and have the data in a zip and an exe frontend, as suggested. Unfortunately, InstallShield doesn't allow for this option. And the cab files it produces can't be opened with cab unzippers either. Supplying an exe and a zip is more of a hassle for the distributors, so I don't go down that route, and putting both in one file doubles size which I find unfair to modem users or broadband users on a low download limit. I wish InstallShield would allow for the zip option.On the other hand, things aren't that bad with InstallShield setup.exes. I never add custom registry entries and icons, etc. It does however put an uninstall option into the add program list. This however is a good thing. One can uninstall via this list or running the setup.exe again, there is no uninstaller. I think the problem is that the add program list should allow for groups so browsing through it is much easier (anybody at Microsoft listening?). InstallShield also puts one entry into the registry to keep track if an application is installed or not. But this gets removed as soon as the scenery is uninstalled.Overall my experience with InstallShiled is quite positive. One click and it does everything for you, without stuffing anything up. The problem of course remains if you can trust a certain setup.exe, which you never know until you try it.Hope this helps.Christian

>One tip--you can cleanup your uninstall entries in Control>Panel by removing the uninstall entry in the registry for the>offending program. Uninstall entries are found here:>>HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINESOFTWAREMicrosoftWindowsCurrentVersionUninstall>>-JohnFor those uncomfortable with playing with the Windows Registry , a freeware programme called EASYCLEANER by TONIARTS does the same thing. If I ever come across a programme that will not uninstall for some reason, I simply delete the programme folder, use EasyCleaner to delete the entry in the Add/Remove programmes dialogue box and use another registry cleaning programme calles REGSEEKER to clean up any references to the programme that are left behind.Barry

How would zipping a packed installer .exe file double the original file size?If WinZIP cannot compress a file, it stores the file without compression. File size may increase, but only by a matter of kilobytes. Will not double the filesize, unless the installer.exe file is approximately the same number of bytes as the ZIP format adds for control information regarding the compressed file inside a .zip.At this point, if I were to develop an aircraft addon, I'd probably just put it all in a zip file, make the zip self-extracting with the winzip tool, and put that in a .zip with a readme.txt.... No registry entries, no add/remove programs entries... In the end, however.... As long as the installer provides the option to change the installation path, and doesn't overwrite the flightsim registry containing FS's main directory (that some installers allegedly do), I don't see what the fuss is about...

"It does however put an uninstall option into the addprogram list. This however is a good thing. One can uninstallvia this list or running the setup.exe again, there is nouninstaller. I think the problem is that the add program listshould allow for groups so browsing through it is much easier(anybody at Microsoft listening?). InstallShield also puts oneentry into the registry to keep track if an application isinstalled or not. But this gets removed as soon as the sceneryis uninstalled."That is exactly what I try to avoid, more entries in my add/remove list or start menu. The problem is that most that use autoinstallers for their designs do not know how to configure them to not do this or to even place the files correctly, so it is hit or miss, and I an not playing russian roulette after hours of setting up FS the way I like. If you must have an uninstall, place it with the files.I can see the designers point of view on the support, but without some track record I am just not going to run an EXE file unless I am very sure it will not screw up my FS.Regards, MichaelKDFWhttp://www.calvirair.com/mcpics/mcdcvabanner.jpgCalVirAir International

Same here - I really dislike installers, but for complicated installations, it's much harder to do the support for a freeware release than it is to come up with a "safe" installer. For our freeflow sceneries, which require numerous folders and optional files to be compatible with other commercial packages, and requires backup of many default scenery files, we needed an installer. So, we've used nullsoft's scriptable install system. It takes a while to figure out, but then it is very powerful, and allowed us to make an installer that makes no changes to the registry, leaves no files behind, and can easily be converted to a manual install. I think it's a good happy medium...and it's certainly saved us a lot of headaches trying to troubleshoot all the manual install possibilities. Best,sgPS> Sorry if that was my weather adventure that had that uninstall.exe problem! Live and learn. That's one of the problems with clickteams' installer creator - if you don't know better, and accept the defaults for everything, you can get into a lot of trouble...

>How would zipping a packed installer .exe file double the>original file size?That is NOT what is being cited. The "double the file size" refers to the suggestion of having BOTH an "installer version" AND a "regular zipped version" in the SAME download...This was already asked and answered in this very thread... :)

tgibson,Is there any way for an end user to see what the ClickTeam installer is about to do? For example, when I run the installer does it unpack files (such as a "setup script" which tells the installer what to do) into a temporary folder?Shalomar,Unfortunately I don't think FSManager monitors the registry or temporary installation files :/ JohnCi,That's one place to look for registry entries, yes, but there are other locations where programs write information to (I believe "Software" is one). The problem is how to make sure that you catch all of the changes when you aren't being told what they are.MD83,The download link for INCTRL 3 doesn't work on that page?Christian,The problem us users face when using installers is that - as you pointed out yourself - we can't know which ones will behave and which ones won't :/ Hence, as far as we are concerned, every installer is "the enemy" (so to speak). It doesn't help to know which installers CAN be configured to be very end-user friendly (no registry clutter, no orphaned files) because we can't tell if the developer has configured the installer properly.And just in case it didn't register earlier - for those of you using 32-bit Windows there is a possible solution called SandboxIE:http://www.sandboxie.com/This program sets up a "virtual environment" within which you can run programs such as installers. The installers themselves think they're writing files and registry entries as they should, while in reality they are interacting within a "sandbox". The website explains it better than I can :)None of the files or registry entries they create are committed to the real registry or the real locations on your harddrive, and once the installation is done you can copy the files you want from the "sandbox" into your real FS2004 directory.I can't use it myself because I'm running Windows x64 and there isn't a 64-bit version of the program yet, but maybe it'll be of use to some of you.